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Thread started 16 Jul 2015 (Thursday) 20:29
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7D 1 Underexposure - Again

 
Pagman
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Jul 18, 2015 22:31 |  #106

davesrose wrote in post #17636088 (external link)
LOL, sorry, but the images you've posted seem a lot more boring and dull...whether from your Canon or D7100. It's apparent you're either trolling or not serious. Good luck with finding that non-existent camera that will take good photos for you:-P


I am sorry if I sounded harsh its just a personal opinion like i experience, when i go to my own difficult lengths to take a pic of a plane and experience physical pain taking a shot, how do you think it makes me feel getting knocked back and treated like my pics are just crap.
Its my hobby and each picture records a special time in my life.

We all have different appreciation levels and what rocks your boat may not mine.

If i have taken a pic of a plane and its the first time i have been able to show the captain smile at 6 miles up, that is a Massive achievement to me, just like a plant grower taking a pic that shows a finely detailed center bloom.

P.


Finally got it right I think - Nikon D7500, Nikon 300 F4 PF, Nikon 1.4 X mk3 TC

  
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davesrose
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Jul 18, 2015 22:31 |  #107

kcbrown wrote in post #17636092 (external link)
But it is exposed well, and that makes it possible to do a lot with it in postprocessing. For instance (hope davesrose doesn't mind my butcher job on his image! :lol: ):

No, don't mind:) The image looks better at it's original size, and everyone is different about how much saturation and "pop" they like. Being an illustrator as well, I like fuller tonal range (that some may see as "washed out"). I've noticed many popular trends now are heading towards more saturation and less contrast range...different strokes for different folks. I like the original as is on my calibrated system, but YMMV. The image was meant as an example of an exposure that has no clipping, and as you indicate, it can then give you limitless possibilities in post. I'm now done with this thread!:lol:


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Pagman
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Jul 18, 2015 22:35 |  #108

davesrose wrote in post #17636110 (external link)
No, don't mind:) The image looks better at it's original size, and everyone is different about how much saturation and "pop" they like. Being an illustrator as well, I like fuller tonal range (that some may see as "washed out"). I've noticed many popular styles now are heading towards more saturation and less contrast range...different strokes for different folks. I like the original as is on my calibrated system, but YMMV. The image was meant as an example of an exposure that has no clipping, and as you indicate, it can then give you limitless possibilities in post. I'm now done with this thread!:lol:


Thank you for your input it is appreciated it all goes a long way believe it or not...

P.


Finally got it right I think - Nikon D7500, Nikon 300 F4 PF, Nikon 1.4 X mk3 TC

  
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gonzogolf
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Jul 18, 2015 23:44 |  #109

Pagman wrote in post #17636093 (external link)
And get better results than i saw with my d7100?

Skip i want to say briefly that i do appreciate your time and effort explaining things, I am not completely thick just a bit stubborn sometimes, and i guess sometimes i am held back in the grey area between serious auto and dedicated manual when it comes to shooting cameras, I guess i still need the auto side of things just like painting a house - i love painting with a brush not a roller, but i dont want to mix the paint myself, i want that done before hand leaving me time to appreciate applying it to a wall.

Hope you can understand that my friend.

Yes, you are so invested in the faults of the camera that you fail to understand the real fault lies with you. With a small bit of effort on your part uou could fix themexposure issues and make better photos. But your stance seems like you would prefer to get wet and complain about the rain, than open an umbrella.




  
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Dan ­ Marchant
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Jul 19, 2015 02:14 |  #110

Pagman wrote in post #17636109 (external link)
I am sorry if I sounded harsh its just a personal opinion like i experience, when i go to my own difficult lengths to take a pic of a plane and experience physical pain taking a shot, how do you think it makes me feel getting knocked back and treated like my pics are just crap.
Its my hobby and each picture records a special time in my life.

We all have different appreciation levels and what rocks your boat may not mine.

Your making a common mistake of assuming that what you experienced while taking a photo is evident to others just from the photo. This is a reason why so many people find it hard to critique their own work. They can't differentiate between the experience of capturing the image and the image itself.

You look at your image and react to the experience you had while taking it. But that has nothing to do with the visual quality of the image. Others look at the image and have no connection to the events/emotions you experienced. All they can judge the image on is the image itself.


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Jul 19, 2015 02:18 as a reply to  @ Dan Marchant's post |  #111

Well said and often forgotten.


Lupo

  
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Azathoth
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Jul 19, 2015 09:42 |  #112

Use manual mode and spot metering. If it is underexposed it's your fault not the camera's. Practice a lot in order to get the correct exposure on the first click.


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Pagman
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Jul 19, 2015 20:44 |  #113

Dan Marchant wrote in post #17636247 (external link)
Your making a common mistake of assuming that what you experienced while taking a photo is evident to others just from the photo. This is a reason why so many people find it hard to critique their own work. They can't differentiate between the experience of capturing the image and the image itself.

You look at your image and react to the experience you had while taking it. But that has nothing to do with the visual quality of the image. Others look at the image and have no connection to the events/emotions you experienced. All they can judge the image on is the image itself.


Thank you for making some very clear comments dan and I agree not everyone can appreciate what goes into a Special moment, and doubly hard to get across the importance, my passion is aviation always has been always will, i collect tail numbers etc, so to a greater extent when i take a snap of a plane several miles up - I have a system for this, after a days shooting of airways going over my garden, i then collect the details of them from a plane radar software like FR24, I then go through my pics after writing down the tail number, if the pic is rubbish it is deleted and only clear enough pics are saved for my reference files.
If I am lucky enough to see aircraft that are slightly lower - this to me is a big bonus and as above they are logged and any better pics are saved, due to their larger size more will be kept.
If one day I am extra lucky enough to visit a decent civil airfield or airshow, then this to me would be like a Third Level producing far more keepers but again serving my reference purpose, thats the bones of my hobby its not just picture taking or photography its Far Far more:-)


P.


Finally got it right I think - Nikon D7500, Nikon 300 F4 PF, Nikon 1.4 X mk3 TC

  
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Pagman
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Jul 19, 2015 20:52 |  #114

Azathoth wrote in post #17636470 (external link)
Use manual mode and spot metering. If it is underexposed it's your fault not the camera's. Practice a lot in order to get the correct exposure on the first click.


What would be Brilliant would be a Dual exposure sensor like the 7d having to digic 4 brains, imagine 2 separate exposure brains one for highlights and one for shadows, so you could have a spot reading for your shadows and get a reading for that separate from a reading outside the spot circle - a dual meter reading that was processed at the same time through 2 chips giving a picture where you could spot meter the small center without generating noise from the rest of the scene.


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Jul 19, 2015 21:23 |  #115

Pagman wrote in post #17637121 (external link)
What would be Brilliant would be a Dual exposure sensor like the 7d having to digic 4 brains, imagine 2 separate exposure brains one for highlights and one for shadows, so you could have a spot reading for your shadows and get a reading for that separate from a reading outside the spot circle - a dual meter reading that was processed at the same time through 2 chips giving a picture where you could spot meter the small center without generating noise from the rest of the scene.

P.

What would be brilliant is you turning your analytical eye upon yourself, and fixing the problem.




  
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Jul 19, 2015 21:47 |  #116

gonzogolf wrote in post #17637138 (external link)
What would be brilliant is you turning your analytical eye upon yourself, and fixing the problem.


Instead of knocking what i write how about considering trying what i shoot with the same gear instead, I am not saying I am very good at Landscape snaps, or the same with people or sports, i have dabbled with landscapes - you know the situation visit a place and take a pic with the cam you have, probably not the best set up a long tele zoom at 70mm for landscapes :lol:

But back on track(i hope) I was asking a simple question that does not include bashing my camera snapping technique, I wanted to know if the 7d in general over exposed or underexposed it pics? and i found out from searching and Google'ing that Yes the 7d mk1 does preserve highlights by slightly under exposing bu 2/3 to 1 stop, this is why anyone who reads this things will keep roughly 1 stop of + EC dialed in, however - that can not be done in manual can it......


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Jul 19, 2015 22:12 as a reply to  @ Pagman's post |  #117

Anything that can be done in auto, can be done in manual im terms of metering and exposure.




  
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Jul 19, 2015 22:41 |  #118
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Pagman wrote in post #17634645 (external link)
I have read in many places that 320,640 and 1250 are the cleaner ISO settings than just using the native speeds of 400,800 1600 etc.
P.

So what. Read on.

Pagman wrote in post #17634664 (external link)
I have just been doing the reading up on it and probably like yourself there are those who think 320, 640 etc are a real bonus and others believe not, I too would interesting to find out the truth behind this.
P.

The truth is that the 7D can be used quite effectively at ISO 6400, if the shooter/processor knows what (s)he is doing. Any miniscule differences between 320 and 400 are totally irrelevant to producing a quality shot.

gonzogolf wrote in post #17635062 (external link)
With a backlit bird it may be that you have to blow out the highlights in order to retain proper exposure on the bird. ETTR is not meant for this situation.

I disagree. ETTR works just fine here. But, the shooter has to expose for the bird, and at that point the sky is way past blown.

gonzogolf wrote in post #17635077 (external link)
Because you don't seem to understand what we are saying. Little dark bird in big bright sky. It fools your meter and the contrast may be more than the EC can accomplish. Especially if you are worrying about applying ETTR instead of exposing for the subject.

Bingo. Admittedly, I only read about half of this thread. I can't believe nobody has suggested (please forgive me if you have) the obvious and easy solution, which follows:

You want to shoot a BIF, or bird on wire/pole whatever. You are most certainly going to be on the 'sunny side' of the bird. Aim camera at a sunny spot on the ground. The same sun is lighting the ground as the bird. Fix exposure using Manual mode or exposure lock (*-button). Dial in some +EC (ETTFR, if you insist). Aim camera at bird. Focus. Trip shutter. You now have a properly exposed, or close to it, shot of your bird. I recommend Manual over *. That way you can chimp/adjust without having to meter off the ground again.

gonzogolf wrote in post #17637199 (external link)
Anything that can be done in auto, can be done in manual im terms of metering and exposure.

True. But the reverse is not true. There are things you can do in Manual that just don't work in Av/Tv/P. The biggest is making the camera do what you want it to do, instead of what the engineers thought you may have wanted it to do.


WARNING: I often dispense advice in fields I know little about!

  
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GeoKras1989
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Jul 19, 2015 22:49 |  #119
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Pagman wrote in post #17637121 (external link)
What would be Brilliant would be a Dual exposure sensor like the 7d having to digic 4 brains, imagine 2 separate exposure brains one for highlights and one for shadows, so you could have a spot reading for your shadows and get a reading for that separate from a reading outside the spot circle - a dual meter reading that was processed at the same time through 2 chips giving a picture where you could spot meter the small center without generating noise from the rest of the scene.

P.

Panasonic P&S cameras have had that ability for years. Perhaps you have too much camera. Engineering does make the basic assumption that the end-user know how to make a camera do what (s)he wants.

gonzogolf wrote in post #17637138 (external link)
What would be brilliant is you turning your analytical eye upon yourself, and fixing the problem.

Please, gonzogolf, do not hold your breath on this one. I tend to learn some things from your posts.


WARNING: I often dispense advice in fields I know little about!

  
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Jul 19, 2015 23:10 |  #120

Pagman wrote in post #17637178 (external link)
Instead of knocking what i write how about considering trying what i shoot with the same gear instead, I am not saying I am very good at Landscape snaps, or the same with people or sports, i have dabbled with landscapes - you know the situation visit a place and take a pic with the cam you have, probably not the best set up a long tele zoom at 70mm for landscapes :lol:

But back on track(i hope) I was asking a simple question that does not include bashing my camera snapping technique, I wanted to know if the 7d in general over exposed or underexposed it pics? and i found out from searching and Google'ing that Yes the 7d mk1 does preserve highlights by slightly under exposing bu 2/3 to 1 stop, this is why anyone who reads this things will keep roughly 1 stop of + EC dialed in, however - that can not be done in manual can it......

P.

It doesn't need to be done in manual. In manual, the viewfinder display shows you what exposure you'll get if you take the shot with the parameters you've set. "Exposure compensation" has no meaning in manual mode because you're directly controlling the exposure yourself.

If you set your parameters in such a way that it reads a stop above neutral, that is no different than taking the shot of exactly the same scene in an automatic mode with exposure compensation set to a stop above neutral.

You can easily test this with your gray card. First, set up your gray card in relatively even light and position yourself with your camera so that the gray card fills the frame. Next, set your camera in Av (aperture priority) mode and set exposure compensation to one stop above neutral. Then take the shot. Now, put your camera into M (manual) mode. Then, while pointing the camera at the gray card in exactly the same way you did when taking the Av shot, change the shutter speed and aperture so that the meter reads one stop above neutral. Then take the shot.

Now examine the two shots. You'll see that they are identical (or, at least, as close as one can expect if you didn't use a tripod) as regards exposure. The shutter speed and aperture combination may differ from that which was used in Av, but the exposure will be the same because the light is the same, the subject is the same, your position is the same, the metering mode is the same, and the ISO is the same.


If you haven't yet experimented with manual mode, I strongly recommend you do so.


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7D 1 Underexposure - Again
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