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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 07 Oct 2015 (Wednesday) 16:01
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Need help choosing lens for first time DSLR buyer with interest in Landscape Photography

 
tomstephens89
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Oct 08, 2015 12:28 |  #16

A used 60D and the 18-135 STM both used gets my vote. Great focal range and an excellent combination that will allow you to find a style of photography that best suits you. This will allow you to decide what lens to invest in next.


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Oct 08, 2015 12:59 |  #17

mcluckie wrote in post #17736929 (external link)
Just my 2¢, but don't waste your money on a kit lens if the end result is for a printed image, however if the shots are for painting reference only, I've pointed 2 painting buddies to the combo of 18-55 and 55-250 for their crop bodies. You're better off with a cheap body and good glass than cheap glass on anything.

It is a myth that expensive lenses are sharper than kit lenses. The 18-55mm STM kit lens is just as sharp as the very expensive 17-55mm/2.8, and the kit autofocuses better.

https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1433059


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Oct 08, 2015 16:56 as a reply to  @ Archibald's post |  #18

I wasn't talking sharpness. Lenses have other, perhaps more important, qualities. Depth rendering, drawing style, contrast, etc.


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Oct 08, 2015 17:39 |  #19

mcluckie wrote in post #17738037 (external link)
I wasn't talking sharpness. Lenses have other, perhaps more important, qualities. Depth rendering, drawing style, contrast, etc.

Cool. Let's have a comparison.


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Post edited over 5 years ago by mcluckie. (4 edits in all)
     
Oct 08, 2015 18:23 as a reply to  @ Archibald's post |  #20

Sure, but I don't have either of the lenses you mention, or anything remotely similar, to compare. On full frame, a lot of corner/edge stuff happens that isn't seen on a crop sensor. Faster lenses wide open will show differences. The 50 1.2 is a tougher design than the 50 1.8, but both are pretty equal (in sharpness) stopped down. The 50L obviously has other qualities. The Zeiss Makro Planars have their special qualities. A ƒ4.5 lens on a crop doesn't seem that difficult to get right. Bigger glass generally focuses slower— I think the 85 1.2 is notoriously slow.

Sorry, I have no idea about EF-S lenses, and even less about EF-S zooms. I'll leave that to you.
I'll be the first to admit that the 40 STM is an amazing lens on the cheap.


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Oct 08, 2015 18:37 |  #21

mcluckie wrote in post #17738119 (external link)
Sure, but I don't have either of the lines you mention, or anything similar, to compare.
I'll be the first to admit that the 40 STM and 35 IS are amazing lenses on the cheap.

In the olden days, kit lenses were not very good compared to more expensive lenses. That has changed in the last couple of years. Today's Canon kit lenses are excellent in sharpness. As you say, there are other things to consider too besides sharpness. I believe that the 18-55mm STM lens has more CA and more distortion than the 17-55mm/2.8 ("believe" because of reviews - I have not tested for those properties). But both those characteristics can be easily fixed in post-processing. Light transmission is another property - and the cheap 18-55mm STM seems to be slightly better. As already mentioned, the AF is better on the 18-55mm STM.

Lots of newbies want L lenses or other expensive lenses because they want the best. It is good to strive for the best, but L lenses are not necessarily any better than the kit lens they already have.

Of course if you need speed, then you would need to put down the cash for a fast lens like the 17-55mm/2.8 or a fast prime. But if you are going to do mainly landscape photography, you will usually stop down, so the benefit of the big aperture is not realized.

If you would like to propose a comparison between these two lenses, let me know, and I will see what I can do.


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Oct 08, 2015 18:54 as a reply to  @ Archibald's post |  #22

I agree about the older years of lens design. I'm old. I also agree that L lenses are 80% hype with weathersealing. My favorite mid zoom was the old non-L 24-85, and my 2 most hated zooms were the 28-70 and 24-70 Ls. When I started with Canon and a 1Ds, I bought 6 L-primes and they're all gone. In the 70s and 80s with Nikons for SLRs, I swore I'd never own a zoom, and now I have 3.

I have absolutely no interest in comparing lenses. I just went through an exhaustive, and slightly inconclusive, test with the 35 IS. It's a very fine non-L lens that rivals my older Zeiss. I don't post-process to fix a weak lens. I don't even want my body to do it. I'd rather have it right optically than through digital interpolation.

And you're right about the stopped-down landscape use. Most lenses are great at ƒ11+. In fact, I'll concede to all your points.


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Oct 08, 2015 18:56 as a reply to  @ mcluckie's post |  #23

I think that the 24-105L had way better color and contrast than my 18-55 STM and my old 17-55 2.8. And the 24-105L is basically the most kit that you're gonna get for an L lens.


6D ☺ G7 X Mark II ☺ SL1 ☺ EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM ☺ EF 28 f/2.8 IS ☺ EF 85 f/1.8 ☺ Rokinon 8 f/3.5 ☺ EF 24-105 f/4L IS ☺ EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS ☺ EF 50 f/1.8 STM ☺ EF 24-70 f/2.8L II

  
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Oct 08, 2015 19:09 |  #24

mcluckie wrote in post #17738138 (external link)
I also agree that L lenses are 80% hype with weathersealing.

LOL :-)


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Oct 08, 2015 19:22 |  #25

Archibald wrote in post #17738126 (external link)
In the olden days, kit lenses were not very good compared to more expensive lenses.

In the olden days of SLRs....your kit lens was a 50mm 1.8, and you could opt for a faster 1.4 ;-)a Well for someone starting off, getting a "kit" walkabout zoom (and maybe another telephoto one) makes sense. They do provide good enough quality and value, and it isn't as much a loss if you don't continue photography. As you learn, you can also see what focal ranges you prefer. Landscapes can use a wide variety of FLs....the current trend is to use a very wide angle lens and exploit huge perspective differences. But there are times where you might want to frame with a telephoto. I think it's also generalizing a bit too much to say a kit lens is just as good as more expensive lenses....more expensive lenses can have better build quality and optical quality then a kit (not just sharpness, but color contrast, lens flare and CA reduction). Of course the adage is that it's the photographer and their skills that makes the main difference. That's certainly true, but then that last extra bit of quality can mean quite a bit for certain applications. I think the argument is that kit lenses have good IQ and can produce good images with experience, but it still doesn't displace "high end" lenses.


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Oct 08, 2015 19:28 |  #26

mcluckie wrote in post #17738138 (external link)
And you're right about the stopped-down landscape use. Most lenses are great at ƒ11+. In fact, I'll concede to all your points.

Well but then many high density DSLR sensors get diffraction limitations at f11+...so one wouldn't see how great a lens could be at those apertures :-)


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Oct 08, 2015 19:37 |  #27

davesrose wrote in post #17738168 (external link)
Well but then many high density DSLR sensors get diffraction limitations at f11+...so one wouldn't see how great a lens could be at those apertures :-)

Diffraction is present at all apertures, increasing steadily as they become smaller.

Maybe we should all shoot landscapes at f/4 and focus-stack.


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Oct 08, 2015 19:45 |  #28

Archibald wrote in post #17738177 (external link)
Diffraction is present at all apertures, increasing steadily as they become smaller.

Maybe we should all shoot landscapes at f/4 and focus-stack.

diffraction limitation (external link)

I think Cambridge has a good overview/ calculator for diffraction limitation. It's more important for large scale prints....pixel peeping at relatively low MPs on web is not relevant. But I guess the main advantage of the current MP race is it gives you more wiggle room for cropping.


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Oct 08, 2015 20:02 |  #29

5Dc + 17-40

/thread


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Oct 08, 2015 20:20 |  #30

MalVeauX wrote in post #17736783 (external link)
Heya,

Used 60D
Used/New 10-18 STM (general and landscape)
Used 18-55 STM (general and landscape)
Used 55-250 STM (road racing and the like, also very distant landscape, don't forget telephoto is important in landscape too!)
Used/New 50mm F1.8 STM (portrait)

Similar only I'd opt for the 70D and skip the 50mm.


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Need help choosing lens for first time DSLR buyer with interest in Landscape Photography
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