Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and our Privacy Policy.
OK
Index  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Guest
New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre Sports Talk 
Thread started 22 Dec 2015 (Tuesday) 23:55
Search threadPrev/next
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

Focus issues: black jerseys or lens microadjustments?

 
MacGrad
Member
91 posts
Likes: 10
Joined Jul 2009
Location: Hamilton, ON
Post edited over 3 years ago by MacGrad.
     
Dec 22, 2015 23:55 |  #1

A quick question for other volleyball/sports shooters: I'm not sure I'm nailing focus on my shots, but I can't figure out if it's because my 7D is having issues with the black jerseys and the poor gym lighting, if I'm cutting the DOF too thin, if the camera/lens combo needs microadjusting... or, possibly, could these be focusing properly but the grain/noise from ISO6400 is making them look OOF?

Has anyone else had this problem and, if so, how were you able to determine the cause? If it was a jersey/lighting issue, how did you correct for it?

Additional info:
* Primarily shooting at ISO6400 and f2.2 / 2.5 in order to get shutter speeds of 1/800
* Main lens is 100mm f/2
* Shooting primarily from from the behind the umpire's chair on the sidelines, so I don't think I should be running into DOF issues if I'm focusing "center mass" on the player
* During the most recent tournament, I tried using Spot + Expansion point AF instead of just Spot AF, but the issue still remains.

A few (cropped) pics to illustrate...

Shot 1: AF lock was on the black/gold area on the passer's right arm (just by her neck), so I'd expect I'd get her face in focus
Shot 2: AF lock was on the chest between the Nike symbol and the team logo

Any help would be appreciated!


HOSTED PHOTO
please log in to view hosted photos in full size.


HOSTED PHOTO
please log in to view hosted photos in full size.


7D... Tamron 17-50mm... Canon 50mm f1.8... Canon 100mm f2.0... Canon 70-200mm f4

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)
Nogo
World Record Holding Most Boring Commenter
7,745 posts
Gallery: 16 photos
Likes: 551
Joined Dec 2013
Location: All Along the Natchez Trace (Clinton, MS)
     
Dec 23, 2015 00:47 |  #2

You may try to use a wider focus area if the black jersey is causing problems.

I am not sure the path you are exploring is the solution to your problem. If you can give us more information it may help. What AI Servo Case are you using? Do you have any action shots with that setup under better lighting circumstances we can compare to these shots? It looks to me that your problem goes beyond just simple missed focus.


Philip

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
psnl1
Mostly Lurking
13 posts
Joined Apr 2013
Location: Harrisburg, PA
     
Dec 23, 2015 07:46 |  #3

MacGrad...I struggle with your issues as well...especially when I'm in VERY tough lighting conditions (that are probably changing often because flickering lights)...with solid jersey colors. I have used both the 7Dii and have the pleasure of using a 1Dx...with Case 2 or Case 4...and find myself disappointed with some of my images because of softness. Although lighting conditions are difficult...I tend to think that the real problem is that I'm locking focus on the jersey and NOT the face. Because the lighting conditions requires me to shoot at 2.8 to get the shutter speed I want (1/1000 or 1/800)...and often shooting close to my subjects...the depth of field is VERY shallow...leaving little room for missing the mark on focus...specifically the player's face. I see that you are shooting at 2.2 which is even shallower than me.

Anybody have any thoughts about whether I'm reading my situation (and MacGrad's) correctly?




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
PhotosGuy
Moderator
Avatar
75,847 posts
Gallery: 8 photos
Likes: 2505
Joined Feb 2004
Location: Middle of Michigan
     
Dec 23, 2015 10:37 |  #4

psnl1 wrote in post #17829579 (external link)
...I tend to think that the real problem is that I'm locking focus on the jersey and NOT the face.

Best of luck with that when you're shooting their action! They just move too fast, IMO.
Black shirts! What ever happened to "Girly" colors? ; D
My solution was to ask the coach to have them in the lighter gray/red jerseys for the first match, (just in case they lost & had to play in another building with even worse lighting.)
He didn't, & the # of images I had to delete were just too high. So after 4 years of shooting the team (for free) & giving the team & graduating seniors a poster, I just quit doing it.


FrankC - 20D, RAW, Manual everything...
Classic Carz, Racing, Air Show, Flowers.
Find the light... A few Car Lighting Tips, and MOVE YOUR FEET!
Have you thought about making your own book? // Need an exposure crutch?
New Image Size Limits: Image must not exceed 1600 pixels on any side.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Zivnuska
Goldmember
Avatar
3,640 posts
Gallery: 70 photos
Likes: 537
Joined Oct 2007
Location: Wichita, Kansas
Post edited over 3 years ago by Zivnuska.
     
Dec 23, 2015 10:52 |  #5

MacGrad,

Are all of your pics at f/2.2 and ISO 6400 with this soft focus? If not, could you post one where the focus is ideal? If not, what percentage are keepers? Your dof under these conditions at 20 ft is just one foot but that should be enough to get a good focus. I'm trying to determine if you have a back focusing issue.

Phil


www.zivnuska.zenfolio.​com/blog (external link) = My Blog
Gear List
www.zivnuska.zenfolio.​com (external link)

"It's not tight until you see the color of the irides."

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
JeffreyG
"my bits and pieces are all hard"
Avatar
15,520 posts
Gallery: 42 photos
Likes: 592
Joined Jan 2007
Location: Detroit, MI
     
Dec 23, 2015 11:44 |  #6

Those are misses, both examples look to be just a little bit backfocused. I have a bunch of comments, so I think I'll bullet:

1) Volleyball has a higher miss rate than most sports. It's a combination of the erratic motion, the lateness of getting onto the subject (often), and the traffic / net obstructions.
2) Like all indoor sports, the AF system is already going to struggle with low light. Add in black jerseys and life is harder.
3) Also, note that center of mass can be a problem for all sports because players than lean while moving can put the face outside the DOF.
4) Speaking of DOF, the difference between f/2 and f/2.8 isn't much. In general you just have to hit focus and a miss at f/2 would probably still be a miss at f/2.8.

My suggestion would be to shift the AF point up higher and then try to track with the active AF point on the face. Faces offer good contrast for the AF system to see, and that's where you want the plane of focus anyway.

Track their legs when shooting back through the net, and be prepared for a huge miss rate on that because the net is just a pain.


My personal stuff:http://www.flickr.com/​photos/jngirbach/sets/ (external link)
I use a Canon 5DIII and a Sony A7rIII

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
MacGrad
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
91 posts
Likes: 10
Joined Jul 2009
Location: Hamilton, ON
     
Dec 24, 2015 23:48 |  #7

Thanks for the feedback, everyone! The holiday rush has kept me from responding until now, but hopefully I can provide more helpful info:

Nogo wrote in post #17829422 (external link)
You may try to use a wider focus area if the black jersey is causing problems.

I am not sure the path you are exploring is the solution to your problem. If you can give us more information it may help. What AI Servo Case are you using? Do you have any action shots with that setup under better lighting circumstances we can compare to these shots? It looks to me that your problem goes beyond just simple missed focus.

Since I'm on a 7D, I don't have the "Servo Cases" to choose from. My custom settings include:

Tracking Sensitivity: 1 click below normal (1 above "Slow")
Servo AF Tracking: Continuous AF Track priority
AF Area: Spot + Expansion (or Spot only)
AF-assist beam firing: Disable (Flash is not allowed in volleyball, so no AF-assist flashes)

I don't have any action shots under better lighting at the moment, since the previous gyms have had poor lighting -- I'll have to see if I can "create" some similar shots as a comparison.

psnl1 wrote in post #17829579 (external link)
MacGrad...I struggle with your issues as well...especially when I'm in VERY tough lighting conditions (that are probably changing often because flickering lights)...with solid jersey colors. I have used both the 7Dii and have the pleasure of using a 1Dx...with Case 2 or Case 4...and find myself disappointed with some of my images because of softness. Although lighting conditions are difficult...I tend to think that the real problem is that I'm locking focus on the jersey and NOT the face. Because the lighting conditions requires me to shoot at 2.8 to get the shutter speed I want (1/1000 or 1/800)...and often shooting close to my subjects...the depth of field is VERY shallow...leaving little room for missing the mark on focus...specifically the player's face. I see that you are shooting at 2.2 which is even shallower than me.

Anybody have any thoughts about whether I'm reading my situation (and MacGrad's) correctly?

I've tried to use 1/800 / f2.2 in order to keep the shots "properly" exposed without going up to ISO12800... I know the DOF is thin, but I figured I'd still be within proper DOF to get the faces clear (especially on the second shot, which was dead center focus). I know 1/1000 would eliminate the last bit of motion blur on the ball, but I would expect that 1/800 would be fast enough to eliminate motion blur on most images.

Also, using the 100mm, I'm forced to shoot action on the far side of the court (at the net) or in the back row (positions 1 and 6)... I estimate I'm usually about 18-20ft minimum from the subject.

PhotosGuy wrote in post #17829764 (external link)
Best of luck with that when you're shooting their action! They just move too fast, IMO.
Black shirts! What ever happened to "Girly" colors? ; D
My solution was to ask the coach to have them in the lighter gray/red jerseys for the first match, (just in case they lost & had to play in another building with even worse lighting.)
He didn't, & the # of images I had to delete were just too high. So after 4 years of shooting the team (for free) & giving the team & graduating seniors a poster, I just quit doing it.

I would LOVE for the girls to have a second jersey! However, since our girls only play about 1 tournament a month at this level, the coaches/organization only provides one jersey for the girls... and it just so happens it's the black one.

Zivnuska wrote in post #17829780 (external link)
MacGrad,

Are all of your pics at f/2.2 and ISO 6400 with this soft focus? If not, could you post one where the focus is ideal? If not, what percentage are keepers? Your dof under these conditions at 20 ft is just one foot but that should be enough to get a good focus. I'm trying to determine if you have a back focusing issue.

Phil

Let me check to see what other images I have from the last tournament, and I'll post them below.

JeffreyG wrote in post #17829824 (external link)
Those are misses, both examples look to be just a little bit backfocused. I have a bunch of comments, so I think I'll bullet:

1) Volleyball has a higher miss rate than most sports. It's a combination of the erratic motion, the lateness of getting onto the subject (often), and the traffic / net obstructions.
2) Like all indoor sports, the AF system is already going to struggle with low light. Add in black jerseys and life is harder.
3) Also, note that center of mass can be a problem for all sports because players than lean while moving can put the face outside the DOF.
4) Speaking of DOF, the difference between f/2 and f/2.8 isn't much. In general you just have to hit focus and a miss at f/2 would probably still be a miss at f/2.8.

My suggestion would be to shift the AF point up higher and then try to track with the active AF point on the face. Faces offer good contrast for the AF system to see, and that's where you want the plane of focus anyway.

Track their legs when shooting back through the net, and be prepared for a huge miss rate on that because the net is just a pain.

I've been shooting for my daughter's team for a couple of years, so I definitely know better than to expect a high keeper rate. :-) It just surprised me that, especially on the one shot where I'd expect a good result (shot #2), it still missed. As for shots through the net, I've tried to avoid this because of the focus issues I've read about with black jerseys and the netting... :-)


7D... Tamron 17-50mm... Canon 50mm f1.8... Canon 100mm f2.0... Canon 70-200mm f4

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sandpiper
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
7,171 posts
Gallery: 1 photo
Likes: 50
Joined Aug 2006
Location: Merseyside, England
     
Dec 25, 2015 15:29 |  #8

MacGrad wrote in post #17831736 (external link)
My custom settings include:

Tracking Sensitivity: 1 click below normal (1 above "Slow")
Servo AF Tracking: Continuous AF Track priority
AF Area: Spot + Expansion (or Spot only)
AF-assist beam firing: Disable (Flash is not allowed in volleyball, so no AF-assist flashes)

Using spot AF is likely to be contributing to the problem. The AF works by focusing on a line of contrast and will be unable to work effectively on a solid black under the AF point. You need to get the point over a good line of contrast such as the neckline, bottom edge of the shorts, end of a sleeve etc., where there is good contrast between the black and the players skin, or else part of the number or the pale stripes near the shoulders. Shot 2, with the focus on the black area, would really struggle. Shot 1 sounds like it should have been OK, but with the smaller spot AF area it can be hard to be sure if it caught enough of the line or not. .

With the smaller spot AF area, you are increasing your chances of not including a sufficient line of contrast for the AF to work with. Spot AF is intended for situations where you are shooting through tight obstacles, such as multiple small branches with a target bird sitting behind them, or chain link fencing etc., any situation where you want to avoid the AF being distracted by something just off to the side from the subject. It is not intended as a "more accurate" AF in normal use. When shooting sports, the larger (standard) AF point is better as you increase the chances of getting a lock.

In addition, make sure that you track the players for a short period, with the AF on, before taking the shot. AI servo is predictive and focuses where it expects the subject to be when the shutter is released, so the more time you give it to calculate speed and direction the more accurate it can be.




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
MacGrad
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
91 posts
Likes: 10
Joined Jul 2009
Location: Hamilton, ON
     
Dec 26, 2015 00:37 |  #9

Zivnuska wrote in post #17829780 (external link)
MacGrad,

Are all of your pics at f/2.2 and ISO 6400 with this soft focus? If not, could you post one where the focus is ideal? If not, what percentage are keepers? Your dof under these conditions at 20 ft is just one foot but that should be enough to get a good focus. I'm trying to determine if you have a back focusing issue.

Phil

As requested, here are a couple others from that tournament. Both of these are before the play starts, so I can rule out motion blur as an issue. No adjustments made in post, so it's SOOC using a Neutral picture style. It still looks like it missed slightly:

1. Focus point includes index and middle fingers on right hand, part of her left leg, jersey/shorts above left leg, and a bit of background.
2. Focus point is split about 50/50 between orange padding and black jersey just below jersey number.


HOSTED PHOTO
please log in to view hosted photos in full size.


HOSTED PHOTO
please log in to view hosted photos in full size.


7D... Tamron 17-50mm... Canon 50mm f1.8... Canon 100mm f2.0... Canon 70-200mm f4

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
MacGrad
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
91 posts
Likes: 10
Joined Jul 2009
Location: Hamilton, ON
     
Dec 26, 2015 00:44 |  #10

For comparison purposes, here's a shot with a different details.

Focus point is centered on the first row of black netting below the tape, and immediately to the left of the attacker's elbow... it grabs just a bit of the attacker's black jersey in the lower right corner of the focus point. Again, SOOC using a Neutral picture style with no post-processing.

I appreciate the help everyone is providing!


HOSTED PHOTO
please log in to view hosted photos in full size.


7D... Tamron 17-50mm... Canon 50mm f1.8... Canon 100mm f2.0... Canon 70-200mm f4

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
PCousins
Senior Member
Avatar
986 posts
Gallery: 601 photos
Best ofs: 1
Likes: 14154
Joined Nov 2014
Location: Weston-Super-Mare (UK)
Post edited over 3 years ago by PCousins.
     
Dec 26, 2015 02:36 |  #11

MacGrad wrote in post #17829381 (external link)
... or, possibly, could these be focusing properly but the grain/noise from ISO6400 is making them look OOF?

Has anyone else had this problem and, if so, how were you able to determine the cause? If it was a jersey/lighting issue, how did you correct for it?

Additional info:
* Primarily shooting at ISO6400 and f2.2 / 2.5 in order to get shutter speeds of 1/800

I have not done any volleyball shooting but I have done a lot of photography in gyms where I needed high shutter speeds in artificial light. My Son's fly indoor radio control helicopters (about 18 inches in size) at the local school gym. I like to capture the shots with both the helicopter and my Son in the shot at the same time. This is very challenging as I require high shutter speeds for the fast movements of the model and of course an aperture value of around f/8-f/11.

Please don't get me wrong I think your images are very good indeed but I think your problem is the high ISO you are using. You are pushing your 7d to the limits.

I was using a 7d like you so my ISO would be at 6400. The lens a 70-200 f/2.8 v2

I was finding that detail remains strong at ISO 1600, pushing ISO higher I would see some moderate detail loss as noise reduction blurs subtly contrasting detail, but results are still quite good. Noise grain becomes coarser and the blurring stronger, resulting in a noticeable drop in detail. Noise and the effects of noise reduction really become apparent at ISO 6,400 with strong blurring, bright noise pixels and chroma blotching. That said, the 7D's noise reduction processing generally does a good job, particularly for a camera with an 18-megapixel APS-C size sensor.

After 2 years use of my 7d I changed it for a 1d4. My Photography went up a level. I get so much better results in the gym and better keeper rate.

Considering the circumstances/conditio​ns If I was you I would be vey pleased with the pictures but I do think if you want better then it might be worth considering the 7d2 or a 1d4.


Gear List

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
JeffreyG
"my bits and pieces are all hard"
Avatar
15,520 posts
Gallery: 42 photos
Likes: 592
Joined Jan 2007
Location: Detroit, MI
     
Dec 26, 2015 08:07 |  #12

Both of your still shots, before action, look to be a little bit backfocused. My suggestion would be to set up the camera on a tripod and make a detailed check of the focus performance at about the distance you shoot in volleyball. There is nothing worse than trying to assess misses in action while dealing with a static focus error at the same spot. Static focus errors are easy to detect, and if they happen at all ranges you can correct them with MA in the body.

Once you are sure that your system hits focus in perfect conditions, everything else is just a matter of speed, poor contrast, and operator error.

When you are shooting action (and especially when you are shooting back through the net), where the AF point is at the moment the shutter is released may not really explain a miss. In the 200-800 milliseconds before you shoot, you need to have the AF system on the target and tracking at the right distance so that it is gathering the information on target location and speed. I track down low on volleyball when looking through the net, and then shoot when they go up. The AF point may indeed wind up on the net when I shoot, but it wasn't tracking there before the shot and the plane will still be on the subject when I take the shot.

And then sometimes I dwell on the net too long and shoot a burst, and the last couple shots will be focused on the net and I trash those.


HOSTED PHOTO
please log in to view hosted photos in full size.


HOSTED PHOTO
please log in to view hosted photos in full size.


My personal stuff:http://www.flickr.com/​photos/jngirbach/sets/ (external link)
I use a Canon 5DIII and a Sony A7rIII

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
lauderdalems
Senior Member
759 posts
Likes: 9
Joined Jun 2006
     
Dec 27, 2015 22:07 |  #13

I also believe your problem is the high ISO. Shoot a couple of shots during warmup with a flash and much lower ISO and I think you will see the problem is lighting - not focus.


http://gamedayphotos.u​wa.edu/ (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
MacGrad
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
91 posts
Likes: 10
Joined Jul 2009
Location: Hamilton, ON
     
Dec 30, 2015 23:25 |  #14

lauderdalems wrote in post #17834581 (external link)
I also believe your problem is the high ISO. Shoot a couple of shots during warmup with a flash and much lower ISO and I think you will see the problem is lighting - not focus.

Unfortunately, these tournaments are strict about the "no flash" rule -- I've seen parents with point-and-shoots asked to put their cameras away because they took a couple photos with flash during warmups. As the team-appointed "parent photographer", I don't want to risk being told I can't shoot for the rest of the day.

I'll try to duplicate the environment somehow in a non-tournament scenario, and use your suggestion and post the result.

PCousins wrote in post #17832585 (external link)
Please don't get me wrong I think your images are very good indeed but I think your problem is the high ISO you are using. You are pushing your 7d to the limits.

Considering the circumstances/conditio​ns If I was you I would be vey pleased with the pictures but I do think if you want better then it might be worth considering the 7d2 or a 1d4.

Sadly, I can't justify a 1d4, especially since I don't shoot enough for that level of investment and I'm not making money off of this hobby.

Are the improvements in the 7D2 that significant? I doubt I'm using the 7D to its full potential (hence my question re: focusing), so I'd rather see if I can utilize other people's experience with the body before springing for another "new" body. After all, people were taking great volleyball pictures with this camera before the 7D2 was introduced. :-)

JeffreyG wrote in post #17832696 (external link)
Both of your still shots, before action, look to be a little bit backfocused. My suggestion would be to set up the camera on a tripod and make a detailed check of the focus performance at about the distance you shoot in volleyball. There is nothing worse than trying to assess misses in action while dealing with a static focus error at the same spot. Static focus errors are easy to detect, and if they happen at all ranges you can correct them with MA in the body.

Once you are sure that your system hits focus in perfect conditions, everything else is just a matter of speed, poor contrast, and operator error.

When you are shooting action (and especially when you are shooting back through the net), where the AF point is at the moment the shutter is released may not really explain a miss. In the 200-800 milliseconds before you shoot, you need to have the AF system on the target and tracking at the right distance so that it is gathering the information on target location and speed. I track down low on volleyball when looking through the net, and then shoot when they go up. The AF point may indeed wind up on the net when I shoot, but it wasn't tracking there before the shot and the plane will still be on the subject when I take the shot.

Thanks for the advice / tips.

Do you have any suggestions as to a tool to do focus checks at a distance? I've looked at a couple items, but they will be extremely small in the photo if I try to shoot them at the volleyball distance, and I'm not sure how easily I'll be able to see a backfocusing issue.

I agree with your comments on the net misses -- my keeper rate on those are low, but I expect that given the conditions, the black jerseys, and the netting. However, it's frustrating when I still seem to get those misses on the static shots, or on the shots were the movement is not erratic.

(Happy New Year, everyone!)


7D... Tamron 17-50mm... Canon 50mm f1.8... Canon 100mm f2.0... Canon 70-200mm f4

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
JeffreyG
"my bits and pieces are all hard"
Avatar
15,520 posts
Gallery: 42 photos
Likes: 592
Joined Jan 2007
Location: Detroit, MI
     
Dec 31, 2015 07:31 |  #15

MacGrad wrote in post #17838418 (external link)
Do you have any suggestions as to a tool to do focus checks at a distance? I've looked at a couple items, but they will be extremely small in the photo if I try to shoot them at the volleyball distance, and I'm not sure how easily I'll be able to see a backfocusing issue.

I suggest cereal boxes or similar. It helps if you have three of the same box, but you can use three different boxes. Set the boxes about 30 feet from the camera, which is on a tripod. The middle box is the target, and the other two boxes are set perhaps 1.5 feet closer and further from the target box.

Focus on the target box, and then use live view to take a look at the scene (magnified 10X). If the focus is perfect, the target box will be sharp and the other two will be equally soft. The best way to judge this is to look at the text printed on the box, and this is why I suggested that three of the same box can be a bit of an advantage.

Keep in mind that your AF is not 100% consistent, so you should AF (and maybe tap a couple times) and then take a look 3-5 times before deciding if the AF system is tending to mostly hit or mostly miss. If you think it is missing, dial in some micro-adjust and retest.

If you really have a lens that is behaving badly, I suggest repeating the test at more than one distance. I once had a 135L that was perfect at close ranges but that would backfocus at longer distances. I sent that one to Canon for correction.


My personal stuff:http://www.flickr.com/​photos/jngirbach/sets/ (external link)
I use a Canon 5DIII and a Sony A7rIII

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

5,486 views & 1 like for this thread
Focus issues: black jerseys or lens microadjustments?
FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre Sports Talk 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Index   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset

Not a member yet?
Register to forums
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.1forum software
version 2.1 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member is gammy13
1993 guests, 246 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 15144, that happened on Nov 22, 2018

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.