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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 20 Mar 2016 (Sunday) 13:28
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Crop and FF ramblings

 
FEChariot
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Post edited over 3 years ago by FEChariot.
     
Mar 20, 2016 13:28 |  #1

So I have been thinking when the 6D2 is released I would buy that. I also want to add UWA options so I have been in a waiting pattern waiting for new releases. Now the Tokina 14-20 and Sigma 50-100 have been announced, I am rethinking.

So if I stay crop I think I would add the Sammy 10/2.8, 14-20/2.0 and 50-100/1.8 and sell my 24-105, 50/1.8, 50/1.4, and 85/1.8. I may add a second better body like the 80D down the road.

The other route I would buy the Sammy 14/2.8, 15-30/2.8 or 16-35IS and sell my crop lenses and buy the 6D2.

The purpose of the UWA would be Astro and event type shots were larger aperture would be handy. Otherwise I shoot a bunch of everything. The crop option would allow me to start making the move right away where the FF option requires waiting for the 6D2. So anyhow I am interested in hearing other peoples opinions.


Canon 7D/350D, Σ17-50/2.8 OS, 18-55IS, 24-105/4 L IS, Σ30/1.4 EX, 50/1.8, C50/1.4, 55-250IS, 60/2.8, 70-200/4 L IS, 85/1.8, 100/2.8 IS L, 135/2 L 580EX II, 430EX II * 2, 270EX II.

  
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Mar 20, 2016 15:03 |  #2
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It's a difficult choice. I always thought that I eventually should upgrade to full-frame, but then came along the Sigma 18-35 1.8. This lens made me stick to crop and I no longer feel the need to upgrade. Even more so with the 50-100 1.8 coming soon. There is just a beautiful line up for crop cameras at this moment. Added bonus is that you save money and weight/size when sticking to crop.


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Tapeman
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Mar 20, 2016 23:05 |  #3

I can see the advantage of a crop camera if you shoot a lot of wildlife, but I think overall full frame bodies are more useful.

Waiting for a new body to be introduced can be frustrating though.


Canon G1X II, 1D MKIV, 5DSR, 5DIV, 5D MKII, 16-35/2.8L II, 24-70/2.8L II, 70-200/2.8L IS II, IS, 100-400/4.5-5.6 L IS II, 500/4 L IS II, 24-105/4 IS, 50/2.5 macro, 1.4x MKII, 1.4X MKIII, 2X MKIII,580EX II, 550EXs(2), ST-E2.
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GregDunn
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Mar 21, 2016 10:30 |  #4

Crop sensors also have faster flash sync in general, and if you're doing astrophotography some telescopes have a small enough aperture at the focuser that it vignettes the FOV for a larger sensor.

Also, currently the Canon body with the lowest dark current / thermal noise is the 7D mk II, which is ideal for astrophotography and low light work in general: see here (external link).


Canon 1Dx | 5D3 | 7D2 | 6D | 70-200L f/2.8IS | 70-200L f/4 | 24-70L f/2.8 | 24-105L f/4IS | 100-400L f/4.5-5.6IS | 17-55 f/2.8IS | 50 f/1.8 | 28-105 f/3.5-4.5 | 4x Godox AD360

  
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FEChariot
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Mar 21, 2016 14:29 |  #5

GregDunn wrote in post #17943050 (external link)
Also, currently the Canon body with the lowest dark current / thermal noise is the 7D mk II, which is ideal for astrophotography and low light work in general: see here (external link).

I have seen that. I wonder where the 80D, 6D2 and 5D3's replacement will fall in these respects though.


Canon 7D/350D, Σ17-50/2.8 OS, 18-55IS, 24-105/4 L IS, Σ30/1.4 EX, 50/1.8, C50/1.4, 55-250IS, 60/2.8, 70-200/4 L IS, 85/1.8, 100/2.8 IS L, 135/2 L 580EX II, 430EX II * 2, 270EX II.

  
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ed ­ rader
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Post edited over 3 years ago by ed rader.
     
Mar 26, 2016 14:58 |  #6

astro = iso 3200. I own crop and FF. i'll only use the cropper under iso 800 and preferably 400 or under. you can get the current 6d for a grand.


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ebiggs
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Mar 27, 2016 11:19 |  #7

All cameras are full frame. You look through the viewfinder and you get what you see. A full frame!


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FEChariot
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Mar 27, 2016 18:11 |  #8

ed rader wrote in post #17949657 (external link)
astro = iso 3200. I own crop and FF. i'll only use the cropper under iso 800 and preferably 400 or under. you can get the current 6d for a grand.

Yeah the reality is that I don't often want to being carrying around a second body so I need it to be more all inclusive of my needs. The 6Ds AF system wouldn't meet those needs. The 5D3 would but I am hoping the 6D2 will have some new features the 5D3 doesn't


Canon 7D/350D, Σ17-50/2.8 OS, 18-55IS, 24-105/4 L IS, Σ30/1.4 EX, 50/1.8, C50/1.4, 55-250IS, 60/2.8, 70-200/4 L IS, 85/1.8, 100/2.8 IS L, 135/2 L 580EX II, 430EX II * 2, 270EX II.

  
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Archibald
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Mar 27, 2016 19:32 |  #9

It all depends on what you shoot.

I have only APS-C bodies, and always have. My bank account is brimming with cash. I'm wondering what all the fuss is all about with "full frame" (which in reality is a crop of MF). I'm ready and able to "upgrade." But if I acquired a 6D or 5D3, it would spend most of its time sitting on the mantle, being admired but not used. The reason is I shoot mostly wildlife, birds and bugs etc, and crop is best for that.

Maybe if I went FF, I would find uses for it.

But judging from what many are doing, including several here at POTN, there is a greater chance that I will downsize, maybe to micro-4/3.

For now I think I will stick to what I have, and try to use my gear to full advantage.


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Copidosoma
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Mar 27, 2016 20:51 |  #10

7DII is very good for astro work. With a similar lens (Tokina 11-16 f2.8 vs. Samyang/Rokinon 14mm 2.8 for example) it holds up VERY well to the 6D. I was actually surprised.

Also, FWIW, "Astro is iso 3200" is such an oversimplification that it is basically false.

Milky way shots with a 24 1.4 or aurora shots with a 1.4 or 2.8 lens don't need that high of an iso at all. Not that the 7DII looks bad at 3200.

Nothing at all wrong with the 6D and the 6DII will likely be a bit better (wouldn't expect a huge improvement though). Not sure it would be such a game changer that it is worth the wait. Who can say though.


Gear: 7DII | 6D | Fuji X100s |Sigma 24A, 50A, 150-600C |24-105L |Samyang 14 2.8|Tamron 90mm f2.8 |and some other stuff
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ebiggs
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Mar 28, 2016 10:55 |  #11

Archibald wrote in post #17951151 (external link)
It all depends on what you shoot.

That is the BS that some push or want you to think. You can't use a 6D for sports or you can't use a 7D for landscapes. Right! It's nonsense. You as the photographer are more important to success than the gear you use.
My .02 cents and worth every penny. ;-)a


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Wilt
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Post edited over 3 years ago by Wilt. (4 edits in all)
     
Mar 28, 2016 11:00 |  #12

Archibald wrote in post #17951151 (external link)
" But if I acquired a 6D or 5D3, it would spend most of its time sitting on the mantle, being admired but not used. The reason is I shoot mostly wildlife, birds and bugs etc, and crop is best for that.

We must be careful about generalizations in discussions of FF vs. APS-C. Traditionally, Archibald's statement would be true. However, in the case of the 5DS, it has 241 pixels per millimeter on sensor, whereas virtually none of the APS-C bodies improve upon that pixel density. The 7DII has 244 pixels/millimeter, which is not a signficant advantage over the 5D3 when both cameras use only a 15mm x 22.4mm effective area of the sensor.

As a generality (and assuming same pixel per millimeter density), the FF camera captures much more total detail from the lens, as the lens delivers the same detail resolution (measured in line-pairs per millimeter of sensor). Even when the FF camera has FEWER pixels per milimeter on sensor, the APS-C image is magnified by a 1.6x greater amount to fill the same final print size, leading to perception of 'sharper' photo from FF at the same final print size (assuming same FOV captured in both). But unless you enlarge to greater than 16 x 24" print, you are likely not to really notice any FF 'advantage' The APS-C camera needs a pixel density which is 1.6x denser to have more detail in the final print, assuming same FOV captured in both cameras.


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sourcehill
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Mar 28, 2016 12:25 |  #13

Full frame was a game changer for my business. I shoot mostly people and the level of detail when you jump to full frame was huge to me.


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John ­ Sheehy
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Mar 28, 2016 16:32 |  #14

Copidosoma wrote in post #17951252 (external link)
7DII is very good for astro work. With a similar lens (Tokina 11-16 f2.8 vs. Samyang/Rokinon 14mm 2.8 for example) it holds up VERY well to the 6D. I was actually surprised.

How long are your exposures? After about 45 seconds to a minute, the 7D2 should take the lead, and a huge one, by several minutes. That is for the whole sensor, not a comparison with the 6D cropped to APS-C.




  
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FEChariot
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Mar 28, 2016 20:13 |  #15

John Sheehy wrote in post #17952250 (external link)
How long are your exposures? After about 45 seconds to a minute, the 7D2 should take the lead, and a huge one, by several minutes. That is for the whole sensor, not a comparison with the 6D cropped to APS-C.

For me a lot depends on how well I get my polar alignment on the Sky tracker but thanks for the info.


Canon 7D/350D, Σ17-50/2.8 OS, 18-55IS, 24-105/4 L IS, Σ30/1.4 EX, 50/1.8, C50/1.4, 55-250IS, 60/2.8, 70-200/4 L IS, 85/1.8, 100/2.8 IS L, 135/2 L 580EX II, 430EX II * 2, 270EX II.

  
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