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Thread started 02 May 2016 (Monday) 05:58
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I may be through buying used gear.

 
johnandbentley
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May 11, 2016 09:23 |  #31

I have had great luck buy used gear both on Craigslist and here. This includes camera bodies and lenses.


6D, Sigma 24mm f1.4 art, sigma 85 f1.4 art

  
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sandpiper
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May 11, 2016 10:25 |  #32

HoosierJoe wrote in post #17995133 (external link)
The only time I approached Paypal about a photo board purchase not as described, they told me it was between me and the buyer.

Glad they didn't tell you that.

How did you put the transaction through? That is a very unusual ocurrence as paypals buyer protection is really aggressive to the sellers, if a buyer says the item isn't as described they are likely to get there moneyback unless the seller can prove otherwise.

This is why so many sellers ask for payment to be sent as "Gift" or "to friend or family" rather than for a purchase. They say it is to save the fees, and they will then not need to pass those fees on to you, but in the event of a claim Paypal will just turn around and say "what purchase? You sent them a gift, it's theirs".

If you sent the payment as a gift, then the response you got would be the expected one, as it is not covered by buyer protection (as you told Paypal you weren't buying anything).

I am sorry you had such a run of bad luck but buying used is pretty safe when paying by Paypal (legitimately) and funding that payment through your credit card rather than the bank. That way, in the unlikely event that Paypal doesn't cover your ass, your credit card provider will normally refund you under their guarantee system and charge Paypal for it.




  
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Charlie
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May 11, 2016 10:59 |  #33

last year, this year has been horrific for me in regards to used gear. a few broken zoom mechanisms, bad elements, and poor lens coatings (more a defect than used gear problem). Literally thousands of dollars worth of bad gear. Thankfully, all of my issues have been resolved. Camera gear is a money pit, so I'll continue to buy used with a return policy aka paypal :twisted:

My gear lust is much more in check this year because I spent a lot of acquiring last year. Still want to tweak some items, but there's nothing that I'm really burning for.


Sony A7riii/A9 - FE 12-24/4 - FE 24-240 - CV 21/3.5 - FE 35/2.8 - SY 35/1.4 AF - FE 50/1.8 - FE 85/1.8 - EF 135/1.8 Art - F 600/5.6 - CZ 100-300 - Astro Rok 14/2.8 - Tamron 28-75/2.8 RXD, 70-200/2.8 VC

  
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Charlie
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May 11, 2016 11:02 |  #34

sandpiper wrote in post #18003569 (external link)
How did you put the transaction through? That is a very unusual ocurrence as paypals buyer protection is really aggressive to the sellers, if a buyer says the item isn't as described they are likely to get there moneyback unless the seller can prove otherwise.

This is why so many sellers ask for payment to be sent as "Gift" or "to friend or family" rather than for a purchase. They say it is to save the fees, and they will then not need to pass those fees on to you, but in the event of a claim Paypal will just turn around and say "what purchase? You sent them a gift, it's theirs".

If you sent the payment as a gift, then the response you got would be the expected one, as it is not covered by buyer protection (as you told Paypal you weren't buying anything).

I am sorry you had such a run of bad luck but buying used is pretty safe when paying by Paypal (legitimately) and funding that payment through your credit card rather than the bank. That way, in the unlikely event that Paypal doesn't cover your ass, your credit card provider will normally refund you under their guarantee system and charge Paypal for it.

"gift" purchases are to save from fee's first, skirt from responsibility second IMO. Both parties can get burned by gift, hence the reason POTN got away from gift purchases.


Sony A7riii/A9 - FE 12-24/4 - FE 24-240 - CV 21/3.5 - FE 35/2.8 - SY 35/1.4 AF - FE 50/1.8 - FE 85/1.8 - EF 135/1.8 Art - F 600/5.6 - CZ 100-300 - Astro Rok 14/2.8 - Tamron 28-75/2.8 RXD, 70-200/2.8 VC

  
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TeamSpeed
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May 11, 2016 13:21 |  #35

Charlie wrote in post #18003630 (external link)
"gift" purchases are to save from fee's first, skirt from responsibility second IMO. Both parties can get burned by gift, hence the reason POTN got away from gift purchases.

POTN never endorsed gift, and POTN cannot police the use of gift payments. All that was done was that a "rule" or "guideline" was laid out that people couldn't call out gift in their sale posts. That doesn't mean it still doesn't happen. ;)


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HoosierJoe
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Post edited over 2 years ago by HoosierJoe. (2 edits in all)
     
May 12, 2016 06:35 |  #36

I never buy or sell as gift. Gift is done on these boards as a 1 dishonesty and I don't participate.

The item I refer to was in 2012 or so. Transaction for a lens at 285. I remember the price because I didn't bargain. The seller even gave me a phone number. He was in NY. Been on the board a long time.

Every thing about the lens was acceptable but it had terrible zoom creep. I didn't get a chance to use the lens for a few days after receiving so didn't notice the problem right away.

I remember the transaction well. The guy wouldn't do anything about it and PayPal turned me down the day after I filed the dispute. That's how it happened. Maybe I got the new guy at PayPal or the overseas guy no good in English.



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TeamSpeed
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Post edited over 2 years ago by TeamSpeed. (3 edits in all)
     
May 12, 2016 07:24 as a reply to  @ HoosierJoe's post |  #37

Let's get into the facts of this, shall we? I run 3 different paypal accounts, for business and personal use, and have used just about all the tools they offer over the years. I also run my online business through paypal, using their developer tools to link sites to payment.

1. They don't call these gift payments anymore either, they call them personal payments to friends or family.

2. Gift is no different than a money order or check. You don't have fees with some of these other types of payments either from the financial institutions. This is exactly what the personal payment is for via Paypal.

3. Even if you make a personal payment, if you make it by credit card, there is still a fee. If you use the funds in your account, it is simply an ACH to the recipient, and no fees are taken out.

4. Paypal no longer pays the account holders money market rates on the funds sitting in their balance. In fact Paypal pays NOTHING for those balances. They used to, but don't any longer. If I have funds in my account, and I just want to do an ACH to another paypal account holder, it is very simply 2 electronic transactions in the system to move balances, and they don't have to honor any kind of buyer protection this way, so it makes sense they don't charge a fee for this.

5. POTN has ZERO responsibility in governing this either, this is a forum, not a payment policing service. Members are responsible individuals, able to think for themselves and act accordingly. It is too easy these days to point fingers all over the place when things go south, except back at oneself.

I don't judge anyone on how they want to use paypal to pay for things, Paypal can take care of themselves and instill certain policies if they are being financially impacted by the customers. I let them be the "judge" of these transactions. They will shut down accounts if they are being abused as well. Paypal is looking out for their own interests, and not the customer based. They have to do what they have to do to keep their transaction counts high, nothing more.


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HoosierJoe
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Post edited over 2 years ago by HoosierJoe.
     
May 12, 2016 10:28 as a reply to  @ TeamSpeed's post |  #38

Right.
I don't use gift payments to sell or purchase. Not judging anyone who does but for me it is dishonest. The transaction in question was not on this board, and was not a gift, and I agree it was buyer beware. The boards are not responsible.

My point being that buyer beware for me is beginning to mean no used electronics. Even the ones I have purchased from retailers in the past few years have not been satisfactory. I either have the worst luck, God (or whatever you believe) is trying to tell me something, or there is a whole lot of defective used out there and I have been unfortunate enough to acquire it.

I kind of regret starting this thread, it was just venting. I should have known some well meaning people (not you) would pick apart every word. It's like talking to my Uncle Morty all over again.



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TeamSpeed
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May 12, 2016 10:59 as a reply to  @ HoosierJoe's post |  #39

I understand. I just wanted to point out that Paypal no longer has a "gift" payment. That all changed. It is now a "personal payment to friends/family". Probably the same thing, but they have made it more vague than before.

Any time you start a thread, you have about an 80% chance of it veering off into unintended territory! :)


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I may be through buying used gear.
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