Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and our Privacy Policy.
OK
Index  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Guest
New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 24 Aug 2016 (Wednesday) 21:29
Search threadPrev/next
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

Canon 5D Mark IV -- Time to Discuss!

 
CyberDyneSystems
Admin (type T-2000)
Avatar
49,296 posts
Gallery: 155 photos
Likes: 5874
Joined Apr 2003
Location: Rhode Island USA
Post edited over 2 years ago by CyberDyneSystems. (2 edits in all)
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:13 |  #1231

They used the same sensor tech @ 6MP for about 8 years and got drummed out of the DSRL business?

I recall a number of avid Fuji shooters at F.M. forums, but at that time we never saw them here (Canon only)

Fuji's last DSLR was in 2007.


GEAR LIST
CDS' HOT LINKS
Jake Hegnauer Photography (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)
davesrose
Title Fairy still hasn't visited me!
3,614 posts
Likes: 489
Joined Apr 2007
Location: Atlanta, GA
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:19 as a reply to  @ CyberDyneSystems's post |  #1232

Maybe it also was them losing money by paying so much to be Nikon compatible. They do make some nice mirrorless systems now.


Canon 5D mk IV
EF 135mm 2.0L, EF 70-200mm 2.8L IS II, EF 24-70 2.8L II, EF 50mm 1.4, EF 100mm 2.8L Macro, EF 16-35mm 4L IS, Sigma 150-600mm C, 580EX, 600EX-RT, MeFoto Globetrotter tripod, grips, Black Rapid RS-7, CAMS plate and strap system, Lowepro Flipside 500 AW, and a few other things...
smugmug (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Talley
Talley Whacker
Avatar
11,061 posts
Gallery: 45 photos
Likes: 2717
Joined Dec 2011
Location: Houston
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:22 |  #1233

It's a shame. Their business model for mirror less cameras now is fantastic


A7rIII | A7III | 12-24 F4 | 16-35 GM | 28-75 2.8 | 100-400 GM | 12mm 2.8 Fisheye | 35mm 2.8 | 85mm 1.8 | 35A | 85A | 200mm L F2 IS | MC-11
My Gear Archive

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
TeamSpeed
01010100 01010011
Avatar
35,306 posts
Gallery: 98 photos
Best ofs: 2
Likes: 4865
Joined May 2002
Location: Northern Indiana
Post edited over 2 years ago by TeamSpeed.
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:26 |  #1234

umphotography wrote in post #18118870 (external link)
Well completely disagree with that statement

The problem is

1- every credible editing program on the market is designed for Raw file use

2- Color,Color and Color. Digital sensors still do whacky things with color, no matter how close you get it in camera

Noise control at Higher ISO's.... you know more than anyone ow important a raw file is for these needs

Raw is going no where and rightly so. But I agree Jpeg has come a long long way. For sports, little need for a raw file

I am very well versed in post processing, and have watched Canon's files get better and better with each model release. NR, color, sharpness, etc are all software tools, and Canon has been updating their software libraries for their firmware, and it shows in the end result. It is increasingly more difficult to process a raw file in order to produce a result that is visibly better than a good set of parameters in-camera for the JPG, especially in situations that aren't too terribly challenging, including NR for high ISO settings.

I have processed 5D2, 6D, 7D, 7D3, 1D3, 1D4, and 5D3 images from raw compared to the JPGs (thousands at this point), and the 7D2 and 6D are very difficult to really improve on with raw vs in-camera with the proper white balance settings and picture styles and NR settings. The other bodies are very easy to get better results from raw vs the in-camera JPGs and they are just not good metrics for my argument. Newer bodies are MUCH improved, due to Canon finally working out their software changes for the firmware, something they let go for years. Canon simply needs to change their NR menu options from Disable, Low, High, etc to something with sliders to control the different parameters of NR. That is the last holdout that I see in regards to in-camera NR producing spectacular results over post processing of raws.

So raw files for correcting white balance issues, getting the most DR, or correcting exposure/shadows/highl​ights, but in other cases, jpg might be good enough.


Past Equipment | My Personal Gallery (external link) My Business Gallery (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
David ­ Arbogast
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
10,949 posts
Gallery: 35 photos
Likes: 7071
Joined Aug 2010
Location: West Point, Georgia
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:26 |  #1235

So I guess some of you are getting shipping notices tomorrow? Can't wait to see some imagery. :)


David | Flickr (external link)
Sony α7R II | CV 12mm, FE 12-24mm, Loxia 21mm, Loxia 35mm, FE 50mm ZA, Batis 85mm

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
CyberDyneSystems
Admin (type T-2000)
Avatar
49,296 posts
Gallery: 155 photos
Likes: 5874
Joined Apr 2003
Location: Rhode Island USA
Post edited over 2 years ago by CyberDyneSystems.
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:31 |  #1236

TeamSpeed wrote in post #18119482 (external link)
I am very well versed in post processing, and have watched Canon's files get better and better with each model release. NR, color, sharpness, etc are all software tools, and Canon has been updating their software libraries for their firmware, and it shows in the end result. It is increasingly more difficult to process a raw file in order to produce a result that is visibly better than a good set of parameters in-camera for the JPG, especially in situations that aren't too terribly challenging, including NR for high ISO settings.....

I'd also point out that you are getting better and better at getting the shots with each event. Some of that may be Canon, most of it is you ;)


GEAR LIST
CDS' HOT LINKS
Jake Hegnauer Photography (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
digital ­ paradise
How do I change this?
Avatar
14,305 posts
Likes: 7428
Joined Oct 2009
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:32 |  #1237

It's out. Attach this to the 5D4.

https://www.dpreview.c​om …-f2-4-manual-focus-lenses (external link)


Image Editing OK

Website (external link) ~ Buy/Sell Feedback

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
TeamSpeed
01010100 01010011
Avatar
35,306 posts
Gallery: 98 photos
Best ofs: 2
Likes: 4865
Joined May 2002
Location: Northern Indiana
Post edited over 2 years ago by TeamSpeed.
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:36 |  #1238

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18119491 (external link)
I'd also point out that you are getting better and better and getting the shots all the time. Some of that may be Canon, most of it is you ;)

Perhaps, but last NBA season and a couple of portrait sessions, I was able to set up the picture styles and NR settings in the camera such that the final JPGs were quite good, and I have given up processing the raws, because the end results weren't visibly different in print sizes. At 100%, you could see the differences, but they were slight enough that they don't show in posters. The only time I went back to raws were times I didn't have the correct WB temp, or I needed to push/pull highlights/shadows because the JPG wasn't good enough. That is where the raws are very valuable for me now.

I will say something I have said before, I think shooting a camera at high ISO values thousand+ times seems to make the end results better as the body gets more usage. I cannot explain it, but I have taken nearly identically exposed shots when I first got a camera, and then a couple of years later, find a similiar exposure high ISO, and they look cleaner. It may be nothing, but is my perception at this point. This may explain why my 7D bodies and even my 7D2 and 5D3 performed better than what others were getting from theirs?

The 5D4, with the new NR that Canon calls out, and the other advances, should produce spectacular JPG results.


Past Equipment | My Personal Gallery (external link) My Business Gallery (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Talley
Talley Whacker
Avatar
11,061 posts
Gallery: 45 photos
Likes: 2717
Joined Dec 2011
Location: Houston
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:40 |  #1239

TeamSpeed wrote in post #18119497 (external link)
Perhaps, but last NBA season and a couple of portrait sessions, I was able to set up the picture styles and NR settings in the camera such that the final JPGs were quite good, and I have given up processing the raws, because the end results weren't visibly different in print sizes. At 100%, you could see the differences, but they were slight enough that they don't show in posters. The only time I went back to raws were times I didn't have the correct WB temp, or I needed to push/pull highlights/shadows because the JPG wasn't good enough. That is where the raws are very valuable for me now.

I will say something I have said before, I think shooting a camera at high ISO values thousand+ times seems to make the end results better as the body gets more usage. I cannot explain it, but I have taken nearly identically exposed shots when I first got a camera, and then a couple of years later, find a similiar exposure high ISO, and they look cleaner. It may be nothing, but is my perception at this point. This may explain why my 7D bodies and even my 7D2 and 5D3 performed better than what others were getting from theirs?

The 5D4, with the new NR that Canon calls out, and the other advances, should produce spectacular JPG results.

I agree with that. Also... you shooting more Jpeg means your buffer is not an issue. Isn't this why the pro's shoot JPG mostly because of the buffer issue.


A7rIII | A7III | 12-24 F4 | 16-35 GM | 28-75 2.8 | 100-400 GM | 12mm 2.8 Fisheye | 35mm 2.8 | 85mm 1.8 | 35A | 85A | 200mm L F2 IS | MC-11
My Gear Archive

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
TeamSpeed
01010100 01010011
Avatar
35,306 posts
Gallery: 98 photos
Best ofs: 2
Likes: 4865
Joined May 2002
Location: Northern Indiana
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:50 |  #1240

Talley wrote in post #18119507 (external link)
I agree with that. Also... you shooting more Jpeg means your buffer is not an issue. Isn't this why the pro's shoot JPG mostly because of the buffer issue.

I shoot Raw+JPG just to make sure I have an emergency cushion, so I still hit buffer issues from time to time. However I am timing when I mash the shutter so that I often only need about 1-2 seconds of shots. That is purely just experience on my part, having had several years now of shooting. :) If I miss a season, I would probably have to start all over in figuring all this out again.


Past Equipment | My Personal Gallery (external link) My Business Gallery (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Talley
Talley Whacker
Avatar
11,061 posts
Gallery: 45 photos
Likes: 2717
Joined Dec 2011
Location: Houston
     
Sep 06, 2016 21:57 |  #1241

TeamSpeed wrote in post #18119521 (external link)
I shoot Raw+JPG just to make sure I have an emergency cushion, so I still hit buffer issues from time to time. However I am timing when I mash the shutter so that I often only need about 1-2 seconds of shots. That is purely just experience on my part, having had several years now of shooting. :) If I miss a season, I would probably have to start all over in figuring all this out again.

Once you have one kid... you know how to have two ;)


A7rIII | A7III | 12-24 F4 | 16-35 GM | 28-75 2.8 | 100-400 GM | 12mm 2.8 Fisheye | 35mm 2.8 | 85mm 1.8 | 35A | 85A | 200mm L F2 IS | MC-11
My Gear Archive

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
TeamSpeed
01010100 01010011
Avatar
35,306 posts
Gallery: 98 photos
Best ofs: 2
Likes: 4865
Joined May 2002
Location: Northern Indiana
     
Sep 06, 2016 22:06 |  #1242

But having the first kid came naturally, lol, photography, not so much.


Past Equipment | My Personal Gallery (external link) My Business Gallery (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
George ­ Zip
My neighbours are looking at me a bit strangely
Avatar
1,386 posts
Gallery: 31 photos
Likes: 1940
Joined Aug 2015
     
Sep 06, 2016 22:14 |  #1243

TeamSpeed wrote in post #18119482 (external link)
I am very well versed in post processing, and have watched Canon's files get better and better with each model release. NR, color, sharpness, etc are all software tools, and Canon has been updating their software libraries for their firmware, and it shows in the end result. It is increasingly more difficult to process a raw file in order to produce a result that is visibly better than a good set of parameters in-camera for the JPG, especially in situations that aren't too terribly challenging, including NR for high ISO settings.

I have processed 5D2, 6D, 7D, 7D3, 1D3, 1D4, and 5D3 images from raw compared to the JPGs (thousands at this point), and the 7D2 and 6D are very difficult to really improve on with raw vs in-camera with the proper white balance settings and picture styles and NR settings. The other bodies are very easy to get better results from raw vs the in-camera JPGs and they are just not good metrics for my argument. Newer bodies are MUCH improved, due to Canon finally working out their software changes for the firmware, something they let go for years. Canon simply needs to change their NR menu options from Disable, Low, High, etc to something with sliders to control the different parameters of NR. That is the last holdout that I see in regards to in-camera NR producing spectacular results over post processing of raws.

Interesting, I am too nervous to shoot JPEG, as I always seem to mess up WB. Maybe I should practice more.




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
clc2112
Member
Avatar
93 posts
Likes: 12
Joined Aug 2005
     
Sep 07, 2016 00:02 |  #1244

Those that have ordered through B&H Before . .

I pre-ordered through B & H. If I get the first wave, do you think I would get a shipment notification early Thursday, late Thursday?

The reason I ask is that I have found a Mk IV locally unspoken for. If I got the first wave from B&H I am more than happy to wait a day to save $315. But, if I don't get one of the first shipments I can pick one up locally at 10am on Thursday.

Ughhh first world problems,




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
smythie
I wasn't even trying
3,669 posts
Gallery: 30 photos
Likes: 611
Joined Jun 2009
Location: Sydney - Australia
     
Sep 07, 2016 00:11 |  #1245

I can understand paying the early adopter tax of full release price over waiting 6 months for prices to drop, but paying nearly an extra 10% for the sake of a few days or maybe a couple of weeks is not something I'd be willing to stomach


Gear List

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

746,238 views & 2,663 likes for this thread
Canon 5D Mark IV -- Time to Discuss!
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Index   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset

Not a member yet?
Register to forums
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.1forum software
version 2.1 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member is joni H
812 guests, 320 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 15144, that happened on Nov 22, 2018

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.