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Thread started 24 Aug 2016 (Wednesday) 21:29
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Canon 5D Mark IV -- Time to Discuss!

 
freestylee30
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Sep 07, 2016 17:18 |  #1321

clc2112 wrote in post #18120193 (external link)
Chat from B&H. I pre-ordered on Aug 25th at 940p Eastern Time


George F: Hello Calvin, my name is George F and I'm looking forward to helping you today!
Me: Hi George can you confirm if my order will ship tomorrow?
George F: Yes, it will ship tomorrow.
Me: confirmed, done deal right? It'll arrive on Friday?
George F: Hopefully if everything goes as scheduled.
Me: can you tell me the shipper? Fedex?
George F: I'm not sure.
Me: ok. So it goes out tomorrow. Thats good info
Me: thanks George
George F: You're welcome.
George F: Thank you for choosing to shop with B&H, we appreciate having you as a customer. Have a wonderful day!
Me: u2

P.S. if you are in San Jose, I know Best Buy on Blossom Hill has a few that are not spoken for and are available Thursday, when they open.

Dang! I must be unlucky with the people I get on chat - twice now. My pre-order was put in on the 24th at 11 PM my time, (Pacific) hopefully I get mine on Friday. One thing the last dude did tell me is that their (B&H) shipment should be big enough to fill 'most' of the pre-orders they received.

Talley, you asked why go through the big retailers? I chose B&H because they are reputable, saved $300 on sales tax and they offered free 1 day shipping. :-) Good enough for me.


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Sep 07, 2016 17:18 |  #1322

Talley wrote in post #18120239 (external link)
Exactly. Canon looked at that thread and said that's all you want.... Well show you!!!

...and they still get bashed. They fixed everything wrong with 5d3 and more.

5D4 will be epic

Just get some images and a review posted soon......that will show the nonbelievers :lol:


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Rittrato
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Sep 07, 2016 17:33 |  #1323

don1163 wrote in post #18120246 (external link)
Just get some images and a review posted soon......that will show the nonbelievers :lol:

I don't expect any groundbreaking difference between this and the 5D3 or even from the 5D2, but I always shoot under a great or good lighting condition. I don't really shoot high ISO's or don't even recover much shadows. I imagine most photographers fall under this scenario to be quite honest, excluding pros of course.


I still bought it though, mainly for the other bells and whistles.




  
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Scrumhalf
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Sep 07, 2016 17:35 |  #1324

All someone needs to show is lack of banding in shadows and 6D-beating high ISO perfornance.


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Talley
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Sep 07, 2016 17:38 |  #1325

More DR and sharper images at base ISO is the big one.


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basketballfreak6
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Sep 07, 2016 17:39 |  #1326

imho, all the hate stems from these few kinds of people

- some people are just selfish, because Canon didn't cater to MY OWN desire and needs, Canon obviously don't give a sh!t about the paying customers, ME! ME! ME!

- armchair experts and techies, ones that's never used the system, or really shoot much at all, they just like gadgets, being constantly fed with stuff like "DR is everything" or "AA filters are bad" and treat those words like gospel without actually experiencing how much or little impact they really are out on the field, they can tell you how good or bad a camera is by simply reading the spec sheet, i actually saw on a youtube clip comment section one person telling another that the he is a f***ing moron for saying that the 5d4 is good for stills because it still has an AA filter and that makes the photos sh!t

- people using other brands or systems that for some reason feel the need to justify their own purchases, that they made the right choice, that their system is superior, they (weirdly) feel threatened that competitor brand has released a good product and that's just not on!

but yea, i don't understand it, if you don't like something, move on, vote with your wallet, if you want to show Canon, hit them where it hurts, the bottom line, and if you're someone that don't even shoot with the system and have no intention to, then why would you even care?


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sploo
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Sep 07, 2016 17:55 |  #1327

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18120235 (external link)
It is an interesting phenomena, and yet we see it pretty much every time.

In this case it is all the more confusing based on a few specifics to the 5D4 release.

- In all the 5D4 wish list threads in the rumors forum, the requested dreams are in fact less than Canon is offering. Most asked only for a few more pixels, and more DR.
Canon is giving us that, plus faster frame rate, plus 4K, plus 400bits a second, plus improved AF, plus the blessed EC in manual/auto ISO, plus the re-designed AF Zone toggle, Plus GPS, Plus Wifi (I did not expect either) IN A Magnesium body (really did not expect that)

- Most of the belly aching is about the usability of an included feature that literally NO ONE had predicted or foreseen. So by including a new technology that no one else has used before, Canon has somehow angered the masses buy not doing it right? Even though until yesterday we didn't even know what doing right might be? No other camera can do it, so why does it hurt the 5D4 that it can?

The Dual pixel tech may or may not ever be evolved into a useful tool. For macro focus, or for highlight protection, We just don't know. However it's existence is already available in the hardware due to the AF tech that birthed those additional photo-sites. IMHO as long as the photo-sites exist, and the data is available, we might as well do some experimenting with the hardware and data and see what tools we can ring out of it. Better fro Canon to step up and try something with the hardware then leave it to a 3rd party to do so, no?

Raymond DeWalt never imagined that his invention would some day be used for cutting dados, spinning molding heads, or Rip cuts. All of this eventually came from that tool, some of it worked better on the Radial Arm Saw than any other tool (cross cutting Dados) some was almost disastrously dangerous (rip cuts IMHO) but the basic tool was there and adding these features was a no brainer and well, you never know till you try.
Ironically, what the tool was designed for from the get go, cross cutting and miters, it is no longer employed for in the vast majority of trades. (miter saws do it better, cheaper and more reliably)

With the 5D4 at least no one is going to lose a finger while we try it's hardware out in new ways. ;)

Maybe this example shed's some light on why I find this such a weird thing to be debating. In a shop , we are constantly, daily coming up with new and better ways to use or tools for operations that the designer may have never imagined. Cutting tenons or shaping cove molding on a table saw? Cutting circular wheels on a table saw? Using lathes to drill holes, using drill presses to sand inside of curves, or to cut mortises.

To me, pushing tools far outside the box is every day stuff.

Yep - my big "wants" over the 5D3 were more low ISO DR and some degree of ISO invariance; all available evidence points to a significant step forward there - not class leading, but no longer sitting at the back looking sorry for itself. If the idea of recovering a stop from a Dual Pixel raw file is feasible, that'd take it near the very top.

I wasn't really expecting much in the way of high ISO improvements, but from images I've seen there is definitely some improvement - maybe only 1/2 a stop or so, but enough to be readily noticeable.

I really wanted a deeper buffer and more fps. That's - just - a step forward. I'd have been happier with 8 fps, and given the huge (200 raw) buffer of the D500 the meagre 21 for the 5D4 is a bit of a disappointment.

Dual Pixel AF for video and a touch screen are big pluses, as are illuminated AF points in AI Servo, and EC in Manual with Auto ISO.

The cropping in 4k video is a let down, but I'm not a big video guy so I'm less worried about that.

The only problem is that I need to be away (for non-camera related duties) over the weekend, so I won't get much chance to play even if it does turn up on Friday :cry:


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Sep 07, 2016 18:07 |  #1328

I had to redirect mine to a FedEx location myself because of prior arrangements so I may not get to pick it up u til saturday


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basketballfreak6
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Sep 07, 2016 18:12 |  #1329

sploo wrote in post #18120286 (external link)
I really wanted a deeper buffer and more fps. That's - just - a step forward. I'd have been happier with 8 fps, and given the huge (200 raw) buffer of the D500 the meagre 21 for the 5D4 is a bit of a disappointment.

i completely agree with that, i feel too for the price the buffer should be bigger and also they should've given us uhs-ii sd card slot, but my guess is that canon feels the need for that clear distinction vs the 1 series (which i don't necessarily agree with) where with a much bigger buffer people may start to use the 5D as a "make do" sports camera


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sploo
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Sep 07, 2016 18:32 |  #1330

basketballfreak6 wrote in post #18120304 (external link)
i completely agree with that, i feel too for the price the buffer should be bigger and also they should've given us uhs-ii sd card slot, but my guess is that canon feels the need for that clear distinction vs the 1 series (which i don't necessarily agree with) where with a much bigger buffer people may start to use the 5D as a "make do" sports camera

It could be that - though the (clearly sports/high speed) 7D2 only has a 31 shot buffer (if I recall correctly). Given the price of RAM is pretty low these days it does seem like an odd decision to crimp in the that area.

Daft thing is, even a high speed UHS-I SD card should just about handle the 30 fps 4k on the 5D4 (i.e. fine for all the camera's video formats), so if they'd given us a ~50 shot buffer then the lack of a UHS-II or CFast slot would have been much less relevant. Sure, a faster card interface would the clear the buffer more quickly, but given it - as you say - isn't a dedicated sports body, it would be churlish to complain if you had ~7 seconds' worth of buffer to play with.


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Sep 07, 2016 18:40 |  #1331

Oh, I hope mine is shipped tomorrow. I thought about going to NYC to pick it up myself, but I am too busy.

I just got my neck strap delivered today, a Black Rapid Kick. I have the older strap for ladies and it's on my 7D. I will try it. If it doesn't work, I can always use my trusty POTN Optec strap. :)

Still looking at the manual. There are many settings I have to do almost immediately. I have never reassigned dials and buttons before. This is going to be fun to remember everything.

I do mostly events, and flash work is really crucial. I am going to test out my brand new 24-70 2.8 II and 17-40 immediately. I have an event this coming week.

Canon actually advertised in their videos that 7 fps is really fast for this particular series of FF cameras. I don't think I would prefer the 5DIV to the 7D2 for sports, but who knows? I am going to test it on high school football coming up.

Good luck everyone! I won't be the first to post images as I think most people will get their in person ones first.


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smythie
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Sep 07, 2016 18:40 |  #1332

sploo wrote in post #18120286 (external link)
I really wanted a deeper buffer and more fps. That's - just - a step forward. I'd have been happier with 8 fps, and given the huge (200 raw) buffer of the D500 the meagre 21 for the 5D4 is a bit of a disappointment.

The D500 is not a good comparison IMO. It's targetted at a different market than the 5DIV. It's supposed to be the best crop body for the sort of things the D5 is good at - sports, journalism and other fast paced uses where frame rate and super AF is king. Its natural competitor is the 7D2, not the 5D3 or 5D4.

3 seconds worth of buffer isn't all that bad for a jack of all trades camera like the 5D4 and I suspect only those who try to make it do the job of a 1DX2 or 7D2 are going to fill the buffer.

No question though that it'd be nice if Canon had spent a couple of extra Yen on buffer memory and card slots (why not use the same slots as the 1DX2? previously the 5D2 and 5D3 had the same slots as the 1D of the time) to push the camera a little beyond what is currently on the market rather than just about matching current competitors


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basketballfreak6
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Post edited over 2 years ago by basketballfreak6.
     
Sep 07, 2016 18:52 |  #1333

sploo wrote in post #18120320 (external link)
It could be that - though the (clearly sports/high speed) 7D2 only has a 31 shot buffer (if I recall correctly). Given the price of RAM is pretty low these days it does seem like an odd decision to crimp in the that area.

Daft thing is, even a high speed UHS-I SD card should just about handle the 30 fps 4k on the 5D4 (i.e. fine for all the camera's video formats), so if they'd given us a ~50 shot buffer then the lack of a UHS-II or CFast slot would have been much less relevant. Sure, a faster card interface would the clear the buffer more quickly, but given it - as you say - isn't a dedicated sports body, it would be churlish to complain if you had ~7 seconds' worth of buffer to play with.

oh yeah, if they could give us ~50 shot buffer i'd be over the moon lol

SuzyView wrote in post #18120328 (external link)
Still looking at the manual. There are many settings I have to do almost immediately. I have never reassigned dials and buttons before. This is going to be fun to remember everything.

this was what i loved about my 5D3, customisable buttons, first thing i did was change the DOF preview button to so when i hold it down (and the new placement makes it easy to do so while shooting even for someone with small hands like me) it switches between one shot and servo af, another thing i did was change the set button so when i hold it down i can use the dial to change ISO which imo is quicker and more useful as you can see how it affects metering real time


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Sep 07, 2016 18:55 |  #1334

basketballfreak6 wrote in post #18120334 (external link)
first thing i did was change the DOF preview button to so when i hold it down (and the new placement makes it easy to do so while shooting even for someone with small hands like me) it switches between one shot and servo af,

I just discovered this on my 5D3. Its pretty handy to hold the DOF button with my ring finger and the AF-ON with my thumb.




  
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basketballfreak6
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Sep 07, 2016 19:26 |  #1335

mike_d wrote in post #18120335 (external link)
I just discovered this on my 5D3. Its pretty handy to hold the DOF button with my ring finger and the AF-ON with my thumb.

yea super useful feature, great for events and birding, or any situation really haha

i am happy they added that new af mode change button too, now i can assign that to change ISO and set button to zoom, now when i am in live view i can zoom in without having to take my hand of the lens (big deal when i am hand holding my huge ass sigma 150-600)


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