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Thread started 24 Aug 2016 (Wednesday) 21:29
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Canon 5D Mark IV -- Time to Discuss!

 
gjl711
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Sep 25, 2016 12:37 |  #3121

manderson wrote in post #18139952 (external link)
I hate being off topic, but I know exactly what you mean. Can you remember when it was cheaper to build your own desktop workstation? If your motherboard is five years old, the new video cards probably won't even fit. I did a new build last year and it was over 2K. Of course, I don't mess around. I also do digital audio in addition to photography. I am seriously thinking about going totally SSD with backups to RAID NAS.

In an attempt to make things worthy of our subject matter, I just spent a bunch of money I shouldn't have :cry:, but I must have this camera! :grin:

I think if performance is your goal, building will be less expensive but if your looking for a decent machine for cheap, just not worth building anymore. I picked up a referb Dell but my mom-in-law for $299 and it is 1000 times more than she will ever use.


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Luxx
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Sep 25, 2016 12:50 |  #3122

Ok so this is the discussion I want...where will you take this camera vs others. With that idea in mind I feel like I have a vote for 1/2 stop over 5d3 and another for what sounds like a full stop.

So maybe 1/2 stop better than 6d?




  
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don1163
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Sep 25, 2016 12:56 |  #3123

jkokbaker wrote in post #18139874 (external link)
just testing it, I'm coming from a 5d II, wanted to see how much I could push the ISO with this camera compared to the 5D II

Do you notice a great improvement? Coming from the 5D2 straight to the 5D4 should be a noticable improvement..


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John_T
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Sep 25, 2016 13:06 |  #3124

manderson wrote in post #18139952 (external link)
I am seriously thinking about going totally SSD with backups to RAID NAS.

Welp, recently I decided to through money at Adobe, thinking that would get them moving...

- Intel i7 6700K CPU @ 4Ghz
- Noctua NH-U12S HSF
- 64GB Corsair Vengeance 3000 RAM
- Samsung 950 M.2 NVME 512GB boot drive
- Gigabyte Z170X 7 EU MB
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- Samsung 850 Pro SSD 512GB
- Samsung 850 Pro SSD 2TB
- Samsung 850 Pro SSD 1TB
- Antec 850W PSU
- SilverStone TJ07 case
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Nice machine, everything is really fast... except for the same old hiccup functions in LR.

Save your money and yell at Adobe there in their ivory towers with triple pane windows..


Canon : EOS R : 5DIV : 5DS R : 5DIII : 7DII : 40 2.8 : 50 1.4 : 35L : 85L : 100L IS Macro : 135L : 16-35L II : RF-24-105L IS : 70-200L II : 100-400L IS II : 1.4x & 2x TC III : 600EX-RT : 580EX : 430EX : G1XII : Markins Q10 & Q3T : Jobu Gimbal : Manfrotto Underware : etc...

  
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jkokbaker
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Sep 25, 2016 13:32 as a reply to  @ don1163's post |  #3125

Big difference, I love the new camera


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Mike
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Sep 25, 2016 14:08 |  #3126

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18139929 (external link)
You can still use the main dial (shutter finger dial) to zoom in and out, like on 5D3 and 7D2.

Ah. My bodies were the generation before those! Didn't know that!


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Sep 25, 2016 14:14 |  #3127

manderson wrote in post #18139952 (external link)
I hate being off topic, but I know exactly what you mean. Can you remember when it was cheaper to build your own desktop workstation? If your motherboard is five years old, the new video cards probably won't even fit. I did a new build last year and it was over 2K. Of course, I don't mess around. I also do digital audio in addition to photography. I am seriously thinking about going totally SSD with backups to RAID NAS.

In an attempt to make things worthy of our subject matter, I just spent a bunch of money I shouldn't have :cry:, but I must have this camera! :grin:

A graphics would fit mine I bought an Asus that had a pcie 3.0 slot.


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sploo
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Sep 25, 2016 14:19 |  #3128

Luxx wrote in post #18139979 (external link)
Ok so this is the discussion I want...where will you take this camera vs others. With that idea in mind I feel like I have a vote for 1/2 stop over 5d3 and another for what sounds like a full stop.

So maybe 1/2 stop better than 6d?

I've not seen anything that would make me think there's more than a 1/2 stop of improvement at high ISO vs the 5D3 (which in itself is impressive for a single generation). I've noted previously that the extra resolution may allow more aggressive noise reduction, and therefore for the same print size you may be able to achieve something close to one stop of improvement.

DxoMark's quantitative numbers broadly match that too.


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CyberDyneSystems
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Post edited over 4 years ago by CyberDyneSystems. (2 edits in all)
     
Sep 25, 2016 14:43 |  #3129

MODERN CANON AF: Holy Mackeral!

Just tested the 5D4 with 500mm MKII with both Extender 2X MkIII, and MkII

OMG OMG OMG!!!!

This camera has managed a SIGNIFICANT leap ahead of any previous EOS AF system I have used! Now I understand what they've been talking about in the 1DX2 thread.

With either one of the 2X extenders, didn't seem to matter which, the AF speed, accuracy, jumping from near to far, was like a bare lens on most cameras!

2XIII allowed me to select a huge number of AF points (all?)
2X II allowed selection of any of the 9 center AF points (7 across center, 3 up and down center)
With that limitation vs. the MkIII, I was otherwise unable to see any difference in speed or hit rate.


Previously I had pretty much poopooed the claims that the 2XIII was big improvement for AF vs. the 2X MkII. Maybe I had the wrong camera, or maybe those making the claim had not tried the 2X II on their newer bodies?

What I will say is this, with a fully modern high end body like the 5D4, both the 2X III and 2X II paired with the EF 500mm f/4L IS MKII are performing like nothing I have ever before seen. Super fast AF, jumping from distant to near targets almost like a bare lens!

I immediately had to retry the combo with 7D2 and 1D4, which I have used the same lens/TCon combo on before (as well as 5D3 now sold) . none of which are coming in even CLOSE to being as superbly fast and accurate. The 7D2 is out there in the exact same (superb crisp) light, and it's hunting and not moving from near to far quickly at all.

It appears that the "built in brake" that the Canon 2X converters have always applied to previous bodies, does not engage on the 5D4 at all. It appears to try to AF at full speed, like a bare lens, and it also appears to be successful!

Sorry folks, if your shooting anything other than a 5D4 (or I assume 1Dx2) right now, you are dealing with a very different AF system.

IMHO, this is the biggest jump in actual AF performance since the 1DMkII. None of the other systems in between have displayed such an obvious side by side improvement.

The 7D2 improvements in use compared to 1D4/1D3/1D2 is NOT NEARLY as notable as compared to the 5D4 vs. 7D2!

As of today, I will have to change my stock answer to the age old "should I get a 2X T-Con?" question. Now the answer will have to begin with "shooting a 5D4? Then yes, if not,. well..."


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automag928
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Sep 25, 2016 15:06 |  #3130

Got my lenses all dialed in with Reikan Focal pro - MFA all done!! Results were close to what I got with Dot Tune, maybe +/- 1 or 2 on each lens, but not too bad. The AF on this camera is absolutely ridiculous!


Canon 5D4 | Canon 6D | Canon 24-70 f2.8 L II | Canon 70-200 f2.8 L II | Canon 24-105 f4 L | Canon 70-300 L | Canon 85 f1.8 | Canon 50 f1.8 | 430EXIII

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sploo
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Sep 25, 2016 15:08 |  #3131

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18140093 (external link)
MODERN CANON AF: Holy Mackeral!

Just tested the 5D4 with 500mm MKII with both Extender 2X MkIII, and MkII

OMG OMG OMG!!!!

This camera has managed a SIGNIFICANT leap ahead of any previous EOS AF system I have used! Now I understand what they've been talking about in the 1DX2 thread.
...

Hopefully I'll get my 5D4 back early next week (I'm told the AF fix is complete) and I must try the 70-200II + 2x TCIII. It worked pretty well on the 5D3, but there was definitely a noticeable drop in AF speed. I assume the f/8 focussing isn't a brick wall thing - i.e. a lens that's focusing at f/5.6 will also benefit, as it's further from the autofocus system's limit (of f/8).

A 500mm f/4 with a 2x TC (for a 1000mm f/8) must be a stunning thing for birding (assuming it's optically sharp). It would be quite interesting to see how that combo works on the 80D - given that it too has plenty of f/8 AF points.

Overall though, I think we're really lucky with the 5D4 AF improvements. I don't recall anyone talking about an expectation of a major step forward here, and on paper it looks pretty similar to its predecessor. I certainly "get" now why 1Dx guys said the 5D3 was good but not in the same class, but it would be interesting to know how the 5D3, 1Dx, 5D4 and 1Dx2 compare in terms of locking and tracking. I wonder if the 5D4 is on a par (or maybe even better) than the original 1Dx? Certainly I wasn't expecting the kind of improvement we've been given - it's a massive bonus with the extra DR, resolution, touch screen, and small-but-significant high ISO gains.


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CyberDyneSystems
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Post edited over 4 years ago by CyberDyneSystems. (2 edits in all)
     
Sep 25, 2016 15:13 |  #3132

sploo wrote in post #18140114 (external link)
... I wonder if the 5D4 is on a par (or maybe even better) than the original 1Dx? Certainly I wasn't expecting the kind of improvement we've been given - it's a massive bonus with the extra DR, resolution, touch screen, and small-but-significant high ISO gains.

My money is on the 5D4 > 1Dx.

It's got to be in this order;

1Dx2
5D4
1Dx
5D3


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don1163
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Sep 25, 2016 15:16 |  #3133

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18140093 (external link)
MODERN CANON AF: Holy Mackeral!

Just tested the 5D4 with 500mm MKII with both Extender 2X MkIII, and MkII

OMG OMG OMG!!!!

This camera has managed a SIGNIFICANT leap ahead of any previous EOS AF system I have used! Now I understand what they've been talking about in the 1DX2 thread.

With either one of the 2X extenders, didn't seem to matter which, the AF speed, accuracy, jumping from near to far, was like a bare lens on most cameras!

2XIII allowed me to select a huge number of AF points (all?)
2X II allowed selection of any of the 9 center AF points (7 across center, 3 up and down center)
With that limitation vs. the MkIII, I was otherwise unable to see any difference in speed or hit rate.


Previously I had pretty much poopooed the claims that the 2XIII was big improvement for AF vs. the 2X MkII. Maybe I had the wrong camera, or maybe those making the claim had not tried the 2X II on their newer bodies?

What I will say is this, with a fully modern high end body like the 5D4, both the 2X III and 2X II paired with the EF 500mm f/4L IS MKII are performing like nothing I have ever before seen. Super fast AF, jumping from distant to near targets almost like a bare lens!

I immediately had to retry the combo with 7D2 and 1D4, which I have used the same lens/TCon combo on before (as well as 5D3 now sold) . none of which are coming in even CLOSE to being as superbly fast and accurate. The 7D2 is out there in the exact same (superb crisp) light, and it's hunting and not moving from near to far quickly at all.

It appears that the "built in brake" that the Canon 2X converters have always applied to previous bodies, does not engage on the 5D4 at all. It appears to try to AF at full speed, like a bare lens, and it also appears to be successful!

Sorry folks, if your shooting anything other than a 5D4 (or I assume 1Dx2) right now, you are dealing with a very different AF system.

IMHO, this is the biggest jump in actual AF performance since the 1DMkII. None of the other systems in between have displayed such an obvious side by side improvement.

The 7D2 improvements in use compared to 1D4/1D3/1D2 is NOT NEARLY as notable as compared to the 5D4 vs. 7D2!

As of today, I will have to change my stock answer to the age old "should I get a 2X T-Con?" question. Now the answer will have to begin with "shooting a 5D4? Then yes, if not,. well..."

Looks like Canon have finally bought out an AF system to give the 6D a run for its money :lol:


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Sep 25, 2016 15:20 |  #3134
bannedPermanent ban

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18139922 (external link)
Any time I get a new "Machine" whether it's a so called "clean" install of my own or purchased with all the mess that comes with that, I have to spend weeks breaking it's back and cleaning out all the crap, changing the default file paths to the directories I want to use (on another HD or partition of the OS) etc. etc.


Tell me about it...

I'm also the 'IT' guru for my family, and, my wife's family...

And, they keep insisting on buying new computers with godawful modern OS's built for PC illiterate dummies, then asking me to come in an 'fix' them (read, install an OS they know and can actually use)...:rolleyes:

 :p :p :p :p


7D MarkII l 50 1.8 STM l15-85 IS USM l 100-400 IS L l 2x converter l 580EX II l Wireless remote l A computer l Some software l A vehicle to get me around...;)

  
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CyberDyneSystems
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Post edited over 4 years ago by CyberDyneSystems. (4 edits in all)
     
Sep 25, 2016 15:22 |  #3135

Two more examples.

this one shows full blacks and strong brights @ ISO 1600 interior shot under 1 CFL ligt and some sun coming through white blinds.

IMAGE: http://jakehegnauer.zenfolio.com/img/s2/v50/p659100539-5.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://jakehegnauer.ze​nfolio.com/p1048322262​/e2749137b  (external link)

Full size: http://jakehegnauer.ze​nfolio.com/img/s2/v50/​p659100539.jpg (external link)


this one is showing how much detail you get @ 1000mm with a 2X T-Con on a 500mm lens;
Full Size: http://jakehegnauer.ze​nfolio.com/img/s7/v159​/p757899361.jpg (external link)

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Canon 5D Mark IV -- Time to Discuss!
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