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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 17 Dec 2014 (Wednesday) 10:12
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EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS II USM Review WOW!

 
cdang
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Nov 30, 2016 20:41 |  #4966

I currently use a 1Dx. I have only been birding a few times as I have just recently got my 100-400 II. The first hour was horrid as I would get hardly any in focus but it improved as I got more practice. Just wanted to hear others thoughts. I will give mode 3 and IS off this weekend to see how I go.

Edit; As I found (and expected), I need more reach so thinking of a 7D2 or 1.4x extender. Having an extender is going to be tricky using the middle point only! Even on zone AF was hard. Hence why I'm considering a 7D2.




  
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Nov 30, 2016 20:43 |  #4967

johnf3f wrote in post #18199620 (external link)
Glad to hear of your success! Unfortunately it does not tally with my and others experiences.

But we are all different and have different insights. Could I ask, have you tried shooting BIF with IS off?

I have found that IS OFF is the better method, as has everyone I know, but that does not mean that we are right!

I do know that with the 100-400 Mk1, 70-20 F2.8 L IS Mk1, 300 F4 L IS, 300 F2.8 L IS mk1 and 2, 600 F4 L IS Mk1, 800 F5.6 L IS that turning IS off is the better option. Note that these are all lenses that I do or have owned (except for the 300 F2.8 L Mk2).

I was very surprised that the IS mode 3 worked so well on my 100-400 Mk2 - but I was horrified that it needed it! Much as I like this lens the balance and handling is terrible! Perhaps that is why it needs IS?

Anyway if you can get good BIF shots, as it appears you can, with IS on then I salute you. IS has completely defeated me! With IS off most numpties (around here) seem to fare better, but I respect your opinion and experience.

So long as you get the shot, who cares how you got it? I (and others) just find IS OFF easier and more successful - you find otherwise and that's fine.

Not a snowball's chance in hot places I could have taken this without IS, especially with the the Mk1: Handheld, 1/80 @ 400mm. Would have been a Rorschach test...:D Biggest advice would be to try them all out with your own shooting.

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digital ­ paradise
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Post edited over 2 years ago by digital paradise. (2 edits in all)
     
Nov 30, 2016 21:46 |  #4968

cdang wrote in post #18199592 (external link)
I've been debating getting a used 7D2 instead of using a 1.4 for BIF..

At the moment I'm using case 3 with zone AF. Anyone using something different? Thanks for sharing your tips ߘ

Case 3 is intended refocus quickly on something else entering whatever AF points you are using. TS is set to +1 so it tends to drop focus on your primary subject that you have been tracking and refocus on something else. Lets say another bird flies in front Case 3 wants to drop the one you are tracking and refocus on the other. Good for shooting motorsports if you want to quickly shoot between one bike and another. Or quickly track two birds back and forth.

Case 2 is the opposite. TS is set to -1. It continues to track the bird even of another passes in front of it. Very handy when tracking and you go off the bird because it moves on you or you move by error.

Here is an example. I was tracking this gull. The previous shots had the AF point on it. During the burst sequence it swooped up. I got about 3 frames in as it moved up and it stayed in focus. This all happens in second and the difference between TS -1 and +1 makes a big difference. it is a screen shot it might not look good.

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Here again a few weeks ago. The gull flew behind the branches and the system kept it in focus. It did not try to refocus on the branches. Case 3 would have tried to refocus on the branches.

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I tend to use Case 2 and lower TS to -2 for precise tracking. For smaller erratic birds I'll use case 5 to 6 and one of the zone AF Modes. I also set TS to -2 for those Cases as well. A actually use small and 65 point zone quite often in Cases 5 and 6.

Case numbers have nothing to do with initial AF acquisition. The case numbers control AF tracking characteristics after initial focus has been achieved. We only have some limited control of initial AF acquisition via 1st and 2nd image priority on the purple menus, tab 2. I know Case 3 says "instantly focus on subject suddenly entering AF points" but that is after you have achieved initial focus lock on something else first.

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Nov 30, 2016 22:48 |  #4969

My humble and somewhat disorganized experience suggests that tracking a bird in flight works better with IS off. With it on, the IS tends to fight my movements. Still, I have had some success with it on and off.


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Dec 01, 2016 00:48 |  #4970

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Dec 01, 2016 09:48 |  #4971

digital paradise wrote in post #18199745 (external link)
.............. Case 2 is the opposite. TS is set to -1. It continues to track the bird even of another passes in front of it. Very handy when tracking and you go off the bird because it moves on you or you move by error........

I've posted this shot before but while on the subject and to help illustrate the point, attached is my best "Case 2" example.
It does it well !


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Dec 01, 2016 10:06 |  #4972

itw wrote in post #18200070 (external link)
I've posted this shot before but while on the subject and to help illustrate the point, attached is my best "Case 2" example.
It does it well !
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forum: Canon EF and EF-S Lenses

Yes it does. It is surprising how little time you have and the results you get. I did some controlled tests. With TS set to -2 you get about between 1 and 2 seconds (closer to 1) before it starts refocus. This may not seem like much but at 10 FPS (min is set at 8) and the speed of flying birds it really makes a noticeable difference. You can get a handful of great shots and the AF is no where near the bird.

The was some conversion at one time that TS will effect initial AF acquisition. I did some controlled tests on that as well. I put tape on the lens and marked it so I would defocus the same amount every time between each test shot. Cam on tripod and I refocused and shot with on TS -2 and + 2 and I did not see any difference in AF acquisition speed. However I did see a noticeable difference at how long the AF would hang on when moving the AF point from on target to another between those 2 settings. I also did those tests using 4 expansion to see how they performed as described in various Canon documents.


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Dec 01, 2016 15:49 |  #4973

digital paradise wrote in post #18200077 (external link)
Yes it does. It is surprising how little time you have and the results you get. I did some controlled tests. With TS set to -2 you get about between 1 and 2 seconds (closer to 1) before it starts refocus. This may not seem like much but at 10 FPS (min is set at 8) and the speed of flying birds it really makes a noticeable difference. You can get a handful of great shots and the AF is no where near the bird.

The was some conversion at one time that TS will effect initial AF acquisition. I did some controlled tests on that as well. I put tape on the lens and marked it so I would defocus the same amount every time between each test shot. Cam on tripod and I refocused and shot with on TS -2 and + 2 and I did not see any difference in AF acquisition speed. However I did see a noticeable difference at how long the AF would hang on when moving the AF point from on target to another between those 2 settings. I also did those tests using 4 expansion to see how they performed as described in various Canon documents.

Nice work, patient and methodical guy.Thanks for the confirmation. Glad you're on our team ! ;-)a


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Dec 01, 2016 16:00 |  #4974

Nice explanation Digital Paradise - so much clearer than the manual!


Life is for living, cameras are to capture it (one day I will learn how!).

  
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Dec 01, 2016 16:18 as a reply to  @ Snydremark's post |  #4975

"Not a snowball's chance in hot places I could have taken this without IS, especially with the the Mk1: Handheld, 1/80 @ 400mm. Would have been a Rorschach test...Biggest advice would be to try them all out with your own shooting."

I have and that is why I don't use IS! Note the exception of the 100-400 Mk2 on which I need IS and IS mode 3 doesn't seem to cause nearly as many problems as I have on my other IS lenses.

True I cannot hand hold my 800mm at 1/80 like your shot with the 100-400 but I can get a fair proportion sharp at 1/160 so if I shoot a 1 second burst (10 frames) 5 to 7 will be good.

One place that IS does REALLY score is when I use Live View and use my camera + lens as a spotting scope - IS is brilliant for this.

We all have different capabilities and all lenses handle differently. As I have said before, much as I like, the 100-400 Mk2 I find it handling to be terrible - I found the 200-400 F4 L IS to be the same while the 600 F4 Mk2 to be Nirvana. My, somewhat stronger, friend who was trying the 200-400 and 600 mk2 with me found the complete opposite! We are all different, I only suggest that people try IS OFF - it has been a great success for me and I would like others to benefit, if it doesn't work then they can always turn it back on.


Life is for living, cameras are to capture it (one day I will learn how!).

  
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Dec 01, 2016 16:29 |  #4976

johnf3f wrote in post #18200441 (external link)
...
One place that IS does REALLY score is when I use Live View and use my camera + lens as a spotting scope - IS is brilliant for this.
...

This is one of my all-time favorite uses of it. There are, invariably, small kids and families that are out when we're spotting things and it's great to pull up the scene and zoom in on the LCD for them to be able to see the (normally) hard to spot things.


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Dec 01, 2016 18:08 |  #4977

Nice shots, Kev. It could just be my work monitor, but in the first one especially, the blacks look a bit blue . . .?


Cheers, Damien

  
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Dec 01, 2016 21:06 as a reply to  @ Snydremark's post |  #4978

We are on exactly the same wavelength here!

There is an excellent spot, not far from where I live, for Kingfishers. It is wonderful to see the joy on the faces of the kids, and their parents, when they can get a really good view of these beautiful little birds. It makes their day and promotes their awareness of nature.

So I miss a few shots - who cares? It is more important to get more people to appreciate what we have and could easily loose.

Keep up the good work, if we do not introduce others to the joys of wildlife then we may not have it for much longer.


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Dec 02, 2016 23:18 |  #4979

W the 5DIV

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Dec 02, 2016 23:44 |  #4980

NG8JGFX wrote in post #18201715 (external link)
W the 5DIV

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Impressive....looks like an awesome lens on an awesome body in some very capable hands :)


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