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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 21 Jan 2017 (Saturday) 21:19
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Cheaper option? profoto 22-inch softlight reflector

 
dylan84
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Jan 21, 2017 21:19 |  #1

I am looking to get a beauty dish that is i guess you'd called it, generic or a cheaper version than the Profoto 22 inch. https://www.bhphotovid​eo.com …oftlight_Beauty​_Dish.html (external link)

http://www.eroglamour.​com/glamour/20090525/k​ylieminoguephotographe​rellenvonunwerth/4-kylie-minogue...-photographer-ellen-von-unwerth.jpg

Does anyone use anything similar, or know about beauty dishes who can recommend anything as i am very new to this?

Thankyou




  
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windpig
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Jan 21, 2017 21:21 |  #2

What light are you going to use and what are you going to shoot?


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dylan84
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Jan 21, 2017 21:25 as a reply to  @ windpig's post |  #3

Do you mean ambient light, along with this? I am shooting fashion and looking to create similar looks to these links. I just know of this one that is being used so far.

http://www.eroglamour.​com/glamour/20090525/k​ylieminoguephotographe​rellenvonunwerth/4-kylie-minogue...-photographer-ellen-von-unwerth.jpg
http://www.eroglamour.​com/glamour/20090525/k​ylieminoguephotographe​rellenvonunwerth/3-kylie-minogue...-photographer-ellen-von-unwerth.jpg
http://www.eroglamour.​com/glamour/20090525/k​ylieminoguephotographe​rellenvonunwerth/5-kylie-minogue...-photographer-ellen-von-unwerth.jpg




  
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windpig
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Jan 21, 2017 21:30 |  #4

what light to fill the dish


Would you like to buy a vowel?
Go ahead, spin the wheel.
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I'm accross the canal just south of Ballard, the town Seattle usurped in 1907.

  
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dylan84
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Jan 21, 2017 21:34 as a reply to  @ windpig's post |  #5

Oh i need to find that out. Do you have any idea by these looks?

herehttp://www.eroglam​our.com/glamour/200905​25/kylieminoguephotogr​apherellenvonunwerth/3​-kylie-minogue...-photographer-ellen-von-unwerth.jpg
https://romanceinthest​ars.wordpress.com …r-vogue-nippon-june-2010/ (external link)




  
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F2Bthere
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Jan 22, 2017 01:39 |  #6

This is a pretty good unit:

https://www.adorama.co​m/fplfsl360k1.html (external link)

I bought mine from Adorama. You can also buy it from other places. It is often called the Godox ad360. Adorama and cheetastand are the best places to buy (good customer service).

Beauty Dishes...you will get plenty of options. Favorites like Mola and the Profoto you showed are, indeed, expensive. But it's fine to start with a less expensive dish, which you can use to learn and decide if you need something else.

Probably the least expensive option which is designed for the Godox AD360 is this:

https://www.amazon.com …eywords=godox+b​eauty+dish (external link)

The Godox can easily be fitted to most brands of modifiers with the appropriate adapter.


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F2Bthere
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Jan 22, 2017 01:52 |  #7

There are plenty of 360 users on this forum. Here is a recent thread where a new person is asking about the flash. It will probably answer many questions a new person would have about it.

https://photography-on-the.net …read.php?t=1456​983&page=1


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dylan84
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Jan 22, 2017 03:27 as a reply to  @ F2Bthere's post |  #8

thanks very much F2Bthere :)




  
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tdlavigne
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Post edited over 2 years ago by tdlavigne. (4 edits in all)
     
Jan 22, 2017 06:04 |  #9

Mola Demi, or Speedotron 22" dish (knock off of the mola, but not quite as good). Unwerth uses some of the Mola's, I want to say the Setti was the one I saw in an old behind the scenes thing, but the Demi is just as good for half body and tighter crops IMO, and perfectly usable for full length in a pinch.

ETA, just saw the post about what lighting...depends on your budget. Unwerth from what I've seen (behind the scenes photos) uses Profoto, but at that level some also use Broncolor. A lot of it is just for appearances though, and you could get along fine with cheaper lighting like Speedotron or Elinchrom. If you have a fairly unlimited budget and want to emulate Ms. Unwerth then I'd start with a Profoto D4 2400 pack, 4 Acute D4 heads, Mola Demi and Euro (Setti too if you can), Fresnelspot, and several of the reflectors. Add some of the best retouchers in the business and you're all set :)

All kidding aside, the Profoto dish is nice, but most working fashion photographers swear by the Mola's. Buy once, cry once. Or you can do like I did, and buy every cheap dish ever made (including making your own) and spending hundreds of dollars and always wondering "How come my shots don't look like theirs?", before finally coming back around and spending the $$$. With that being said, I'd suggest just ponying up for the Profoto (or Mola), others will tell you you don't need it...but then again most people don't want to shoot the same things you're looking to shoot.




  
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F2Bthere
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Jan 22, 2017 17:02 |  #10

tdlavigne wrote in post #18252090 (external link)
If you have a fairly unlimited budget and want to emulate Ms. Unwerth then I'd start with a Profoto D4 2400 pack, 4 Acute D4 heads, Mola Demi and Euro (Setti too if you can), Fresnelspot, and several of the reflectors. Add some of the best retouchers in the business and you're all set :)

All kidding aside, the Profoto dish is nice, but most working fashion photographers swear by the Mola's. Buy once, cry once. Or you can do like I did, and buy every cheap dish ever made (including making your own) and spending hundreds of dollars and always wondering "How come my shots don't look like theirs?", before finally coming back around and spending the $$$. With that being said, I'd suggest just ponying up for the Profoto (or Mola), others will tell you you don't need it...but then again most people don't want to shoot the same things you're looking to shoot.

There is much soundness in your advice. Buying many inexpensive Beauty Dishes only to end up buying an expensive one in the end is a waste. But buying an expensive Beauty Dish (BD) only to figure out you prefer the light from a different type of modifier is also a waste.

I suggest buying one inexpensive BD and trying it out. Many people are satisfied with less than a Mola. And, in any case, a Mola is not "magical." A person with skills will create better images with a cheap modifier than an unskilled person will make with a costly modifier. And the skills can be developed with any beauty dish.

The BD I linked to costs about what it costs to RENT a Mola for a day. Buy it. Use it. Learn from it. Rent a mola (or Profoto) once you know how to use it and see if it makes a difference.

And, to be fair, when looking at someone else's pictures, you cannot tell which brand of light modifier was used if that type is made by multiple brands (ok, there are some distinctive catch lights, but these can also be photoshopped in). What you can tell is the skill of the photographer.

I, too, have a strong preference for certain modifiers. But I started out with whatever was at hand and learned the basics of getting a proper exposure (this was on film), how to balance with or eliminate ambient, creating a pleasing lighting pattern (ok, at the start, not making an ugly pattern ;). ), how to feather, how to fill, how to add supplemental light, why it is better not to (this is personal taste, others will disagree), why sometimes it is better to use supplemental lights again ;), etc. I only learned what I preferred by having experience.

I think it is kind of like a first car. There is little benefit to owning, say, a Maserati, as your first car.

These are just my opinions. There probably isn't a bad answer. Figure out what you can afford or want to spend and make a choice :).


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tdlavigne
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Jan 22, 2017 22:14 |  #11

F2Bthere wrote in post #18252677 (external link)
There is much soundness in your advice. Buying many inexpensive Beauty Dishes only to end up buying an expensive one in the end is a waste. But buying an expensive Beauty Dish (BD) only to figure out you prefer the light from a different type of modifier is also a waste.

I suggest buying one inexpensive BD and trying it out. Many people are satisfied with less than a Mola. And, in any case, a Mola is not "magical." A person with skills will create better images with a cheap modifier than an unskilled person will make with a costly modifier. And the skills can be developed with any beauty dish.

The BD I linked to costs about what it costs to RENT a Mola for a day. Buy it. Use it. Learn from it. Rent a mola (or Profoto) once you know how to use it and see if it makes a difference.

And, to be fair, when looking at someone else's pictures, you cannot tell which brand of light modifier was used if that type is made by multiple brands (ok, there are some distinctive catch lights, but these can also be photoshopped in). What you can tell is the skill of the photographer.

I, too, have a strong preference for certain modifiers. But I started out with whatever was at hand and learned the basics of getting a proper exposure (this was on film), how to balance with or eliminate ambient, creating a pleasing lighting pattern (ok, at the start, not making an ugly pattern ;). ), how to feather, how to fill, how to add supplemental light, why it is better not to (this is personal taste, others will disagree), why sometimes it is better to use supplemental lights again ;), etc. I only learned what I preferred by having experience.

I think it is kind of like a first car. There is little benefit to owning, say, a Maserati, as your first car.

These are just my opinions. There probably isn't a bad answer. Figure out what you can afford or want to spend and make a choice :).

It's all relative, $300 for what is easily the most common modifier a fashion photographer uses is a drop in the bucket in the long run. If the OP is serious and wants to get anywhere, the simple fact is there are hundreds of thousands of aspiring "fashion" photographers out there. The only things that'll separate you from the others unfortunately is often A) the equipment you use, B) the people you work with, and C) your ability to B.S. your way through life. Can he work with a $40 BD? Probably. But I think the discerning AD's and clients will be able to tell something isn't quite right with the budget photographer (and that includes those using 10 year old bodies, budget lenses, Photoshop actions, so-so talent, etc) and while they probably couldn't tell you the difference between say a Fresnelspot and a toaster oven...they'll know there's something about the images they like just the same.

I wouldn't liken it to having a Maserati as one's first car, mostly because a car can get you killed if you don't know how to drive it. An expensive light modifier will at worst take up space until you either A) learn how to use it (it's not rocket science) or B) sell it. I would respectfully disagree that one should start with a lesser or entry level modifier (not to sound dismissive), as that can just as easily foul one's opinion on them. I know a lot of people who did the strobist thing, made a BD out of a white bowl and a blank cd, and they usually decided that BD's were overrated or not for them. Only problem is they never used a proper beauty dish. It'd be like buying a 1991 Ford Focus, having a horrible time driving, and deciding you don't like cars and would rather try bicycles after that.

True, no wrong answer...but I wish someone had told me early on not to waste my time on trying to find a budget or quick/cheap way to get the look of certain things, and emphasized just doing it right the first time. Would've saved me not only I'd wager a couple thousand $, but probably hundreds of hours in the long run. This is all probably moot though since it sounds like the OP hasn't decided on a lighting system yet anyway, so that could likely play into the choice as well.

P.S. No matter what you do/decide: Stay away from the PCB "High Output Beauty Dish"; it's useless crap. Not being elitist or anything...it really is a steaming pile. Almost everyone I know who has/had one says the same, and I also went through 2 copies (silver and white); they probably ranked below my DIY 12" dish I made from hot glue and a plastic bowl lol




  
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F2Bthere
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Jan 24, 2017 02:02 |  #12

This isn't exactly comparing two beauty dishes (it's beauty dish vs deep octa), but it's a good way to see somewhat subtle differences between modifiers. The DO in some configurations is like a beauty dish.

http://jakegarn.com …beauty-dish-vs-deep-octa/ (external link)

I think which you choose is a matter of taste. One of the best steps is coming to rely upon your own taste in modifiers (or lenses, for that matter). People can help you with technical differences and how easy (or hard) something is to set up, etc. But which modifier produces results more like what you are looking for--your eye needs to decide.

Otherwise, you just learn what we love :).


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On my images, of course, and on my words as well--as long as it's constructive :).
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Cheaper option? profoto 22-inch softlight reflector
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