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Thread started 12 Mar 2017 (Sunday) 11:11
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Getting started with SLR and photos are too "bright" in canon 700d

 
sandpiper
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Mar 12, 2017 17:58 |  #16

Khondokar Humayun Kabir wrote in post #18299140 (external link)
Then how to control to flash fired or stop this flash fired?

The simple answer is to turn it off. However, I suspect as you are using the camera in full auto mode that the camera is deciding for you and popping up the onboard flash as it sees fit.

The best thing is to take the camera OFF auto mode. As stated above, it is a dumb box which does things based on what it thinks the shot will need, but it doesn't know what it is looking at or how you want the shot to come out, so will often get it wrong. You don't need to fully manual, just start using the creative modes (Av, Tv, P etc), where you have a great deal of control and can get the results you want.

DSLR cameras are not at their best when left to their own devices, you really do need to learn the basics of photography and take some control.

Also, it is best to take the identical scene when comparing equipment. You have taken two very different shots there with the two cameras, they may have both been identical taking the same shot.




  
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Wilt
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Post edited over 2 years ago by Wilt. (2 edits in all)
     
Mar 12, 2017 18:01 |  #17

  • First photo was Program mode, Evaluative metering 'Pattern', and Flash status was
    'Flash fired, compulsory flash mode'
  • Second photo was Program mode, Evaluative metering 'Pattern', and strangely Flash status was
    'Flash did not fire, compulsory flash mode'



...so WHY did the flash NOT fire for photo 2, if camera was compulsory flash mode'?!

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Bassat
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Mar 12, 2017 18:49 |  #18

John from PA wrote in post #18299161 (external link)
Presumably both devices came with a manual so start there or explore a local camera club. Digital photography can be complex and intimating. I thought I knew a lot after almost 40 years in film photography but I had to start the learning process all over when I acquired my 1st digital.

We can help but don't expect to get a course in photography on this forum.

+1 to that. Started shooting in the late '60s. First digital around 2005. It was a new beginning, essentially.




  
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BigAl007
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Mar 12, 2017 18:56 |  #19

Wilt wrote in post #18299175 (external link)
  • First photo was Program mode, Evaluative metering 'Pattern', and Flash status was
    'Flash fired, compulsory flash mode'
  • Second photo was Program mode, Evaluative metering 'Pattern', and strangely Flash status was
    'Flash did not fire, compulsory flash mode'



...so WHY did the flash NOT fire for photo 2, if camera was compulsory flash mode'?!


Probably because in the first image the flash was popped up, and so fired, since that is what it is supposed to do. In the second it was in the closed position, and so of course could not fire, exactly as it should do. I'm pretty sure that if you have the onborad flash closed that is a compulsory not fired situation. With it open it is a compulsory fired, since you turned it on. I think sometimes the notice in the EXIF suffers from translation by non native speakers issues. Simple transliteration from Japanese to English is very difficult, I know I have taken several conversational Japanese classes over the years, well back in the 90's anyway, so have some experience in the area. English to Japanese is just as difficult.

I also notice that the first camera must have manual ISO set, since if it were auto it would be forced to go to ISO 400. I don't know what the default is, especially in Program mode, since I simply never use P, but one option for flash is to set the shutter speed to 1/60 when using a ETTL II flash. Forcing 1/60s along with ISO 1600 in a relatively bright room, and then adding flash, which as someone else mentioned may not be able to reduce the output enough to prevent serious overexposure.

One issue with the image is that there are some foreground objects that are very close to the flash, and they are always at risk of blowing out when flash is used. Remember that an item that is 1m from the camera/flash combination will receive FOUR TIMES the level of illumination from the flash than a subject at 2m! A subject at 2m also receives 4× the illumination than a subject at 4m.

Actually it would be much better if the OP could take the same photograph, from the same location, with completely identical settings on both cameras. This would require a little work, since when I say all settings, I mean EVERY menu setting, as well as identical setting for exposure mode, ISO, your know EVERYTHING. By taking two images from the same spot framing the image identically each time, it would beome much easier to see what is going on for us. With the two images being different, it is really hard to say what the differences between the two cameras are, since the two situations are completely different.

Alan


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Bassat
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Mar 12, 2017 19:01 as a reply to  @ BigAl007's post |  #20

Al,

All of my Canon bodies will float the ISO in "P" mode, from 100 to 1600, I think. You only get locked into 400 (on Auto) with Av, Tv, Manual, and maybe Bulb. I'm too lazy to dig out a manual right now.




  
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Mar 12, 2017 19:20 |  #21

Bassat wrote in post #18299231 (external link)
Al,

All of my Canon bodies will float the ISO in "P" mode, from 100 to 1600, I think. You only get locked into 400 (on Auto) with Av, Tv, Manual, and maybe Bulb. I'm too lazy to dig out a manual right now.


What with flash? I just pulled out my 50D, and set it to P with Auto ISO, and when I pop up the flash the ISO goes directly from 1600 down to 400, which is the behaviour I expected. The problem as I understand it is that in order for the ETTL II flash system to work correctly you first have to fix the ISO value, and Canon picked ISO 400 years ago. If you switch from Auto ISO to a manually selected ISO value though then the flash will work with any value you like, as long as you are within the window provided by the minimum and maximum power output of the flash gun.

Alan


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Bassat
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Post edited over 2 years ago by Bassat. (2 edits in all)
     
Mar 12, 2017 20:26 as a reply to  @ BigAl007's post |  #22

Ok, Alan. I guess I should have looked at the manual FIRST. I just checked: 6D, 5D4, 1D4. All of them default to ISO 400 in P mode with two exceptions. 1.) ISO 400 will result in overexposure. and 2.) Using bounce flash, where it will set ISO from 400 to 1600, as it sees fit.

Apologies. I should know better than to rely on MY memory. If I do that again, may the fleas of a thousand camels infest my armpits. :)

EDIT:
Damn my pits are getting itchy! I completely forgot we were talking about the POP-UP flash on Rebel! Bounce flash a POP-UP!?!?!?!?!?! Someone please, pass the flea powder, quickly.




  
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John ­ from ­ PA
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Post edited over 2 years ago by John from PA. (2 edits in all)
     
Mar 12, 2017 21:38 |  #23

No offense to the OP intended by title, but you may wish to get a copy of the book titled "Canon EOS Rebel T5i/700D For Dummies". The book is very basic and offers camera operational information as well as sufficient basic photography information that enables the user to understand why a given setting is used.




  
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Wilt
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Mar 12, 2017 22:04 as a reply to  @ Bassat's post |  #24

I wonder if the Title Fairy can change your name to 'Pinnochio'


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Mar 13, 2017 04:34 |  #25

Bassat wrote in post #18298959 (external link)
It is not the camera. The camera is only a stupid box that does what it is told to do. Get yourself a book on photography. Read about the exposure triangle. Learn how exposure compensation, aperture, shutter speed, and ISO affect your image. You have a very capable camera. You have to learn how to tell it what you want it to do. Oh, and practice. A lot.

^ ^


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Mar 13, 2017 05:33 |  #26

I had forgotten that iso 400 is the standard value in auto for flash firing. if you think someone has messed with the settings on the camera the ISO setting should be the first place to start. it will be in the red part of the menu system. check that it is on auto ISO and not set to 1600.
Next thing I would check would be the metering system. check that it is on evaluative metering and not spot metering or centre weighted average.
if these two things are on their correct settings in AUTO mode then the camera should have an easier time making judgements for itself. However using this camera in auto is a waste of its talents, and will produce results not much better than a good smart phone. My next suggestion to you is a good book on your camera. I used a "dummies guide" with my first DSLR and it helped me immensely improve my understanding, as someone else mentioned this book earlier this is the one I would recommend. IT WILL HELP and is a lot cheaper than buying a course as long as you take the time to read it.




  
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john ­ crossley
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Mar 13, 2017 06:00 |  #27

Khondokar Humayun Kabir wrote in post #18299140 (external link)
Then how to control to flash fired or stop this flash fired?

To stop the flash firing push it back down onto the top of the camera.

To recap: the image from the first camera is over-exposed because the flash fired and you are using an ISO of 1600. To get a well exposed image turn off the flash and shoot at a lower ISO as seems to be what you did with the second camera.


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Mar 13, 2017 06:20 |  #28

Bassat wrote in post #18299289 (external link)
Ok, Alan. I guess I should have looked at the manual FIRST. I just checked: 6D, 5D4, 1D4. All of them default to ISO 400 in P mode with two exceptions. 1.) ISO 400 will result in overexposure. and 2.) Using bounce flash, where it will set ISO from 400 to 1600, as it sees fit.

Apologies. I should know better than to rely on MY memory. If I do that again, may the fleas of a thousand camels infest my armpits. :)

EDIT:
Damn my pits are getting itchy! I completely forgot we were talking about the POP-UP flash on Rebel! Bounce flash a POP-UP!?!?!?!?!?! Someone please, pass the flea powder, quickly.


Don't worry I have learnt something new too, since I didn't know about the lowering of the ISO if it would otherwise overexpose. I just checked that option out, since it was after midnight when I did the test, and getting anything to overexpose at ISO 400 with an f/2.8 zoom was unlikely. I did also do the test with the pop up flash, since that was what the OP was using.

I also tried my external Sigma EF 500 DG ST flash in ETTL II mode, and that set the ISO to 400 for both direct and bounced use. Mind you it seems to be a quite limited flash, and may well not be telling the camera that it is in bounce mode.

The thing is that I might have used the Green Box mode a couple of times the first day I got my 300D back in Jan 2005, and I stopped using Program mode after a week or so, when I found it annoying that it would always pick a different aperture and shutter speed combination than I would prefer for any situation, and rolling it round every time is just not on. So I just went back to using mostly Av mode. Or Manual, I use M a lot for my aviation shots, as well as when I'm shooting aircraft, and for flash work in both ETTL II and manual flash mode.

The 300D, and my 20D, also only allow Auto ISO in Green Box mode. GB mode takes control of the flash unit too and I think they are also stuck at ISO 400 when the flash is popped up. They are though cameras dating from over 12 years ago, so it is not surprising that they are so limited.

Alan


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Mar 13, 2017 07:09 |  #29

john crossley wrote in post #18299584 (external link)
To stop the flash firing push it back down onto the top of the camera.

Provided you are in a mode where the camera will not pop it up when it wants to, that works.


Anders

  
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john ­ crossley
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Mar 13, 2017 07:19 |  #30

apersson850 wrote in post #18299612 (external link)
Provided you are in a mode where the camera will not pop it up when it wants to, that works.

Which the OP was.


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