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FORUMS General Gear Talk Computers 
Thread started 20 Apr 2017 (Thursday) 09:24
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nekrosoft13
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Apr 28, 2017 13:49 |  #16
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Why buy Mac pro that thing is two years old with no new updates in sight....

Apple doesn't care about professional users it's all about iPads and iPhone.


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gjl711
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Apr 28, 2017 17:55 |  #17

philmar wrote in post #18341034 (external link)
Perhaps you need to give examples of the PC vendors that are made of decent components.

Asus makes some pretty impressive machines for not a whole lot more than the parts cost. Alienware, Digital Storm, and others have very nice machines as well.


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nekrosoft13
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Apr 28, 2017 18:08 |  #18
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gjl711 wrote in post #18341298 (external link)
Asus makes some pretty impressive machines for not a whole lot more than the parts cost. Alienware, Digital Storm, and others have very nice machines as well.

only decent thing about asus systems is the motherboard... usually of higher quality

alienware is still the same dell crap now

Digital Storm is good, but this is not your typical of the shelf systems, this is more like custom build system using better components for more money, its cheaper to build your own.


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wisv1k
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Apr 28, 2017 19:30 |  #19

I bought a digital storm machine for work. It was more expensive, sure, but not significantly so. Plus, time is money. There are definitely advantages to buying a pre-built machine from a reputable retailer. I would buy from them again in a second and make absolutely nothing by saying so.




  
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gjl711
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Apr 28, 2017 19:52 |  #20

nekrosoft13 wrote in post #18341307 (external link)
only decent thing about asus systems is the motherboard... usually of higher quality...

Huh!! Asus MB, Asus Gforce GPU, Intel processor, Western Digital hard drive Samsung SSD, Kingston ram. Antec PSU, that's pretty main stream and among the best price/performance brands out there.


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djh5331
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Apr 29, 2017 10:32 |  #21

I'll say this (Software Developer who's built multiple PCs), pre-built machines typically have lower quality parts but usually are a bit cheaper at the low end. There may be exceptions, of course. A few months ago, I was helping a friend look at upgrading his computer and wanted to do a price comparison between a pre-build semi-high end computer (e.g. Intel i7, SSD, meh RAM speeds, weak graphics card, all air cooled). In that particular case, building your own machine using the same low-grade parts actually ended up costing a little bit more than buying pre-built. On the other end, going for high end build, the cost of buying a pre-built was much more expensive than building your own. Obviously these are generalizations that can change based on where you live, where you shop, etc. I was looking mostly at MicroCenter for motherboard/CPU combos and then NewEgg and Amazon.

Beyond those price differences, there are huge advantages to building your own computer. You are able to build a computer exactly to your specifications and your liking, keeping in mind what you plan on upgrading in the future, are you going to overclock, how many HDD and SSD slots you need, etc. I personally have an all glass case (Corsair 570X) with RGB LEDs, custom PSU cabling, etc that looks amazing and is exactly what I wanted.

That said, the way you're asking this question I'm going to recommend you buy a pre-built. Sure you get lower grade parts, but it doesn't sound like you'd really enjoy building your own computer and want to put in the time it requires to really benefit from it. From that perspective, it's simple, buy pre-built.

As to the Mac vs PC debate, don't try to build a Mac, that's not for the faint hearted haha. I personally am very anti-Apple (mostly Macs more than iPhones), but that's no reason for you to not absolutely enjoy the experience of one. Have you tried using a Mac before? Do you enjoy the experience? Can you get the software that you need on it? I know a lot of people who absolutely love Macs and hate Windows and vice-versa. It all comes down to personal preference.

Finally, if you need any kind of help determining what kind of specs you need, I'd be more than willing to help.

Good luck!




  
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Hogloff
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Apr 30, 2017 17:51 |  #22
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djh5331 wrote in post #18341790 (external link)
That said, the way you're asking this question I'm going to recommend you buy a pre-built. Sure you get lower grade parts, but it doesn't sound like you'd really enjoy building your own computer and want to put in the time it requires to really benefit from it. From that perspective, it's simple, buy pre-built.

Or most places where you can purchase all the components will build and install the drivers / OS onto the system. The place where I had my last PC built charged $50 to assemble and install the OS / drivers onto the computer and run a breakin / diagnostics on it. That's $50 well spent IMHO.

But...my next computer will be a MAC. Had enough problems with Windows to stay away.




  
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Kent ­ Clark
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May 01, 2017 10:06 |  #23

djh5331 wrote in post #18341790 (external link)
Beyond those price differences, there are huge advantages to building your own computer.

You're right, but let's be honest there are potentially huge disadvantages to building your own as well. Building a PC is easy, the components just plug in. And most of the time once you plug them in things work and you're off and running. But not infrequently things don't work after plugging them in and then you have to figure out what's wrong, is it the mother board, a cable, the bios, etc, etc? And once you figure that out you have to rectify it on your own, you have to deal with RMAs, manufacturers who won't admit their product could be malfunctioning and blame it on someone else, etc, etc.

And once your system is running, two years down the road when something goes wrong you have to deal with troubleshooting and varying warranty lengths and RMAs and manufacturers who won't admit their product could be at fault and blame it on someone else, etc, etc.

Some people enjoy that whole process but many don't. Many people need a system warranty to fall back on. Many people are money and hours ahead by buying from a reputable system integrator who takes responsibility for the whole package. The idea that building your own PC is obviously the right choice, so often found in internet forums full of people who enjoy tinkering with PCs, is just wrong.




  
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Hogloff
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May 01, 2017 10:29 |  #24
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Kent Clark wrote in post #18343462 (external link)
You're right, but let's be honest there are potentially huge disadvantages to building your own as well. Building a PC is easy, the components just plug in. And most of the time once you plug them in things work and you're off and running. But not infrequently things don't work after plugging them in and then you have to figure out what's wrong, is it the mother board, a cable, the bios, etc, etc? And once you figure that out you have to rectify it on your own, you have to deal with RMAs, manufacturers who won't admit their product could be malfunctioning and blame it on someone else, etc, etc.

And once your system is running, two years down the road when something goes wrong you have to deal with troubleshooting and varying warranty lengths and RMAs and manufacturers who won't admit their product could be at fault and blame it on someone else, etc, etc.

Some people enjoy that whole process but many don't. Many people need a system warranty to fall back on. Many people are money and hours ahead by buying from a reputable system integrator who takes responsibility for the whole package. The idea that building your own PC is obviously the right choice, so often found in internet forums full of people who enjoy tinkering with PCs, is just wrong.

You are exactly right. I've built a few PC's in my time, but not anymore. My last few PC's I had built for me for an extra $50. Money well spent as it would have easily taken me 4 hours to build and install the OS and drivers and configure. Time is a scarce resource for many...you can quickly spend a weekend deep in the guts of a computer that does not function properly.




  
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kf095
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May 01, 2017 12:18 |  #25

I was involved with computer graphics before After Effects became Adobe product. :) Back then we have to deal with custom upgrades and put all components together. Later on I deal with IBM servers and they where shipped in peaces. Single file server components were shipped, delivered separately and with well outdated drivers. Nothing has changed since. If you think it is like "plug and play" it isn't.

Also if you are not playing 3D games and not making videos .... regular computer with extra memory and with up to date multi-core CPU will do. Maybe updated video card, but it doesn't have to be a monster, because no real time 3D rendering is involved. More critical is correct monitor and calibration unit. This will make your customers to see it as you see it and to print without issues.


These days I deal with Dell. Good warranty and outstanding service. They will help with issues like "why fan is not on" and so on. The only issue with Dell I have is their on-sale desktop computers are often with CPU meant for light use laptops.

My daughter was looking for professional photography laptop in 2016. It appears some manufacturers have these laptops build with specs better than big names desktops.
She went with advanced ASUS laptop and has no problems with editing of hundreds of Canon 5D MKII RAW files after each assignment. It takes her couple of hours even if her approach is - take it as is, deal with it in editing. So, lot of editing is done, but her ASUS laptop handles it in real time. She is also using LR and PS. I printed her work recently. Everything was fine.


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AlanU
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May 01, 2017 13:07 |  #26

You can simply buy a basic high quality computer components with the latest i5 or i7 chipset. Load it with 32gb ddr4 ram and a intel/samsung SSD hard drive and an additional traditional mechanical spinner Hard drive like a 4-6 TB hard drive. A basic Nvidia 1060 or higher video card loaded with 3-4gb ram (more is nice $$$$). Also purchasing an efficient power supply is beneficial. That system would give you great service for years!

Keeping it simple will still give you incredible performance especially with just using LR or PS.

I build all of my computers for personal use. I'd casually go to your favourite computer shop and speak to an experienced tech. They would gladly give you a list of "known products with little RMA (returned merchandise authorization)" Basically low comeback produce. For example Seagate barracuda drives (bad) is never going into my computers due to statistics of higher RMA.

Ask the tech for his/her "personal tech picks" if they were to build a solid system. You will be certain you'll have a good system going that route.

If you buy a "boxed" computer from DELL you'll be able to talk to tech support. This is something you cannot get when you build it yourself.

You must pick something that you are comfortable with.......


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Kent ­ Clark
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May 01, 2017 13:14 |  #27

I think Puget Systems is at the top of the custom PC builder pyramid. They have great reviews, they seem to offer great service based on those reviews. You can customize a PC with a variety of excellent top shelf parts. But you really pay for that.

I customized one of their Serenity Pro quiet PCs and it came out to $2029. That includes setup, burn in, lifetime labor and tech support and 1 year parts warranty, plus some custom silencing mods. It uses the integrated graphics in an i5 7600k cpu, a good Asus Z270 motherboard, 500gb Samsung 960 EVO m.2 SSD, Seasonic PSU, Fractal Design Define R5 case, 16gb Crucial DDR4-2400 ram. I would call this a solid mid tier pc and is pretty much what I would build for my own LR/PS computer if I were building right now.

I went to pcpartpicker and found the exact components in that build, it comes to $1156. Maybe add on a little more if you want to buy all of your parts from one vendor, but it's about a 75% markup. This link to pcpartpicker will let you see the individual components:

https://pcpartpicker.c​om/list/hHxnJV (external link)

This puts some real numbers in the discussion of building vs buying prebuilt and some people wondering about the pros and cons might find it helpful.




  
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Nathan
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May 02, 2017 16:16 |  #28

nekrosoft13 wrote in post #18341111 (external link)
Why buy Mac pro that thing is two years old with no new updates in sight....

Apple doesn't care about professional users it's all about iPads and iPhone.

Because you can replace components. Someone buying a Mac Pro is unlikely someone who's going to replace it in two years with a new model


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AlanU
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May 02, 2017 19:51 |  #29

Nathan wrote in post #18344672 (external link)
Because you can replace components. Someone buying a Mac Pro is unlikely someone who's going to replace it in two years with a new model

In all honestly your not far off........


Many Apple users appreciate the familiarity with newer upcoming products with marginally better performance.

I'm not disrespecting any apple user saying this. It's almost part of the Apple culture.

I know very few people upgrading a current PC system by swapping CPU's and such. However swapping to SSD drives and adding ram is dead simple with a PC.

Everyone is entitled to choose their tools :)


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EverydayGetaway
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May 02, 2017 22:43 |  #30

AlanU wrote in post #18344832 (external link)
I know very few people upgrading a current PC system by swapping CPU's and such. However swapping to SSD drives and adding ram is dead simple with a PC.

Everyone is entitled to choose their tools :)

True, this does seem to be almost entirely a gaming PC thing. I've changed my CPU and motherboard configuration 3 times in the past 2 years and have another CPU on it's way (hopefully this week) :lol: But I also hunt good used deals and like to tinker to eek out every little bit of performance... something I never desired to do (nor could have done) on my Macs. Thankfully this is an option available to PC users, not a requirement... if you buy a properly put together and/or spec PC it'll last you many years without tinkering with any of the hardware.


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