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Thread started 02 Mar 2018 (Friday) 11:26
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Lightroom Question.

 
BigAl007
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Mar 02, 2018 11:26 |  #1

When I first got my current computer system back in the summer of 2016 I upgraded from Lr4 to CC, since I also got a new 5K display with the system and needed the HiDPI support.. Back then in the Loupe view if you selected the Fit option it would fit the image to the screen as you would normally expect, but any image that did not fill the available space was limited to 1:1 magnification. I actually really liked this, since if you have Fit selected you can use the mouse wheel to scroll through the images, and you could be certain that the image you were looking at had at most been resized downwards.

Shortly afterwards at some upgrade they changed the behaviour of fit so that it did what it implies, sized the image so that it would fit the available space, even if it meant that you were looking at an image at more than 1:1. The problem is that having a lot of images from my 300D at 3072×2048px and still using my old 20D as a second body/backup at 3504×2336px these all fit well within the available area on the screen, so I now see them at sizes well above 1:1, unless I "zoom in" and specify a magnification.

Having to keep checking how big an image actually is by looking at the size info is a bit of PIA, and sometimes I wonder why I had accepted a photo, only to find that I am viewing an image at 200% or more, if it were cropped from the 300D for example.

So does anyone know if t is possible to set Lr up so that it behaves like it used to do, and limits the Fit view to a maximum of 1:1? Since moving the next image by using the mouse scroll wheel is comfortable, as is having a larger image downsized to fit. This is not so much an issue when looking at a folder when all the images are from one camera, but in a smart collection when you don't know quickly which camera was used it makes a difference.

Thanks

Alan


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Wilt
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Post edited 3 months ago by Wilt.
     
Mar 02, 2018 12:33 |  #2

Huh? No FF dSLR from Canon has vertical resolution which fills the 5k monitor's 2880 pixel vertical.
As for your 300D at 3072×2048 and old 20D as a second body/backup at 3504×2336, OMG 15 year old technology?! mygoshman, upgrade yourself to a 50D and 5D!
You could have saved yourself problems by not buying 5K resolution monitor!

 :p


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davesrose
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Mar 02, 2018 13:18 |  #3

In the Navigator tab, you have a lot of zoom options. If you wanted to zoom in further then 1:1, you can select it after the "fit" or "fill" view, and then LR will toggle that when you toggle zoom levels. I think the preview image in the Navigator is good too for showing how much extra space the image takes up in a zoomed view. Not really sure how you mean a "fit" view should maintain a 1:1 zoom if the image is smaller then the panel, yet you want it to fit the screen (wouldn't you just keep it 1:1)? You can alternate between 1:1 and a larger zoom level by the ctrl+ or ctrl- shortcuts.


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BigAl007
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Mar 02, 2018 15:41 |  #4

Well I have a 50D as my main body now, but I still have a lot of existing images that still get viewed. The high resolution monitor is really nice to look at, and most programs work well with the Win 10 scaling system. I really wouldn't want to go back to a monitor that was running under 200 PPI on a regular basis.

My problem is that I really like using the mouse wheel to scroll though the images when in Loupe view, and this will only happen when I have Fit as the "zoom" option in the navigator tab. Any other setting and the mouse wheel changes to controlling the vertical scroll within the window. It doesn't matter that at 1:1 the image is too small to scroll, that is what it does.

I have some minor neurological issues that make using the scroll wheel for this the preferable method of input. If I try to hold a finger over a single key to make repeated presses I end up with my finger trembling and or twitching and involuntarily moving the image along by making unwanted keypresses. Also usually I'm sitting back in the chair so reaching the keyboard to make changes in zoom via keyboard less than ideal. So the old system, where the Fit zoom option was limited to a maximum of 1:1 was great. Larger images were shrunk down so that I could see them, but nothing was enlarged beyond 1:1 to actually make it fit.

I know that what the program used to do was not really what you would expect of a Fit zoom option, and what it does now is actually more correct, but for me it is a retrograde step. I don't care what you call it, just make it so I can move though images with the mouse scroll wheel, and large images fit the screen, and smaller images stop at 1:1 as a maximum magnification ratio.

I first noticed the change when I would go to zoom in on a section of the image, by clicking with the mouse, and it would switch to 1:1 view, and the image would suddenly get smaller, not larger!

Alan


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Wilt
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Post edited 3 months ago by Wilt.
     
Mar 02, 2018 15:48 as a reply to  @ BigAl007's post |  #5

Newer versions of Windows (Win 7 and later) arrive with the Microsoft Windows Speech Recognition software preinstalled. Have you given voice command a try, to overcome the thumb wheel twitch, as well as the lack of thumbwheel control to review images?

A web description:

"To switch on Windows Speech Recognition, go to your Start menu and in the search box at the bottom, type speech recognition. Click the option that pops up, and a window will open where you can enable the feature, as well as read a short text to give Windows an idea of what your voice is like. You can also access the feature through the Control Panel. Once everything is set up, a small status box will pop up. You’ll use that to switch Speech Recognition on and off.

To begin, just say clearly into the microphone “start listening.” The app then beeps and springs into action, waiting for your next command. You can tell Windows Speech Recognition to pretty much do anything on your PC. It can open browsers (including new tabs), apps, as well as Microsoft Office documents. Once you have a document open, you can dictate text and it will instantly appear there."


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BigAl007
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Mar 02, 2018 15:58 |  #6

Wilt wrote in post #18576091 (external link)
Newer versions of Windows (Win 7 and later) arrive with the Microsoft Windows Speech Recognition software preinstalled. Have you given voice command a try, to overcome the thumb wheel twitch, as well as the lack of thumbwheel control to review images?

A web description:

"To switch on Windows Speech Recognition, go to your Start menu and in the search box at the bottom, type speech recognition. Click the option that pops up, and a window will open where you can enable the feature, as well as read a short text to give Windows an idea of what your voice is like. You can also access the feature through the Control Panel. Once everything is set up, a small status box will pop up. You’ll use that to switch Speech Recognition on and off.

To begin, just say clearly into the microphone “start listening.” The app then beeps and springs into action, waiting for your next command. You can tell Windows Speech Recognition to pretty much do anything on your PC. It can open browsers (including new tabs), apps, as well as Microsoft Office documents. Once you have a document open, you can dictate text and it will instantly appear there."


No because when I got the computer system I didn't bother with getting a webcam or anything, as I never use such a thing. I had one built in on my old laptop, and never ever used it in the ten years I had the system. I might pick one up now though and see if it helps. Or I could just see if I can get a splitter that will allow me to plug the 3.5mm TRRS plug from my mobile phone earbuds/mic combo into the computers two 3.5mm jack inputs. As you say talking to the system could be much simpler than always dealing with the keyboard and mouse.

Could be really good if I could find a way to also make it control the sliders in the dev module.

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Wilt
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Mar 02, 2018 16:04 as a reply to  @ BigAl007's post |  #7

No microphone jack on your PC? Wow, I thought I had an 'old beast' (more than 10 years old), but even mine has a microphone jack so we can Skype thru it.


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BigAl007
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Mar 02, 2018 17:11 |  #8

Wilt wrote in post #18576102 (external link)
No microphone jack on your PC? Wow, I thought I had an 'old beast' (more than 10 years old), but even mine has a microphone jack so we can Skype thru it.


Oh yes it's got a mic in jack, and a stereo jack out, both 3.5mm, although I'm the sort who is much more at home with ¼" jack plugs/sockets.

The phone headset has a TRRS plug, so that you get left and right audio to the ear, and a mono mic connection through the one connector. The computer has a TRS jack for the headphone output. I guess it also has TRS on the mic side, so that you can do stereo input. So I would need to either get a mic, or an adapter that will let me use the headset from the mobile phone.

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Wilt
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Post edited 3 months ago by Wilt.
     
Mar 02, 2018 18:01 as a reply to  @ BigAl007's post |  #9

You could get a product like Dragon, and use the headset that comes with that. Then, when you are not using the headset for voice command input, you can use it to dictate what you want to get into your word processing program. I

I just pulled out the Dragon headset (never used it before), and it plugs into a special (provided) adapter which then plugs into USB port.
I also just pulled out a headset which I use with Skype, and plugged it into the mic and earphone jack, and tried activating speech recognition in Windows. Seems to work reasonably, although I did not try the Scroll function. I did go thru part of the introductory tutorial and told it 'Next' when I wanted to go to the next page of the tutorial. I may consider starting to use it myself.


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Post edited 3 months ago by tzalman. (2 edits in all)
     
Mar 03, 2018 03:24 |  #10

Wilt wrote in post #18575971 (external link)
Huh? No FF dSLR from Canon has vertical resolution which fills the 5k monitor's 2880 pixel vertical.

Huh?
5DS/R: 8688 x 5792 pixels
5D4: 6720 x 4480 pixels
5D3: 5760 × 3840 pixels
5D2: 5616 x 3744 pixels
1DS2: 4992 x 3328 pixels
1DS3: 5616 x 3744 pixels
1DX: 5184 x 3456 pixels
1DX2: 5472 x 3648 pixels


Elie / אלי

  
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Mar 03, 2018 06:07 |  #11

tzalman wrote in post #18576363 (external link)
Huh?
5DS/R: 8688 x 5792 pixels
5D4: 6720 x 4480 pixels
5D3: 5760 × 3840 pixels
5D2: 5616 x 3744 pixels
1DS2: 4992 x 3328 pixels
1DS3: 5616 x 3744 pixels
1DX: 5184 x 3456 pixels
1DX2: 5472 x 3648 pixels

And not forgetting the 6D and 6D2...


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tzalman
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Mar 03, 2018 07:34 as a reply to  @ graham121's post |  #12

Oh yeh, them too.


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BigAl007
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Mar 03, 2018 10:15 |  #13

Actually any sensor with 12.4 MP (4320×2880px) in a 3×2 format will fill the vertical space of the monitor. The physical size of the sensor is imatterial in this scenario. The size of the sensor really only matters if you want to calculate the optical magnification of the system, from sensor to screen. The screen is 435mm high, so the optical magnification from my Canon APS-C sensors with their nominal 22.5×15mm sensors is 29×, and of course for a 35mm frame it would be 18.125×. Personally I shoot with APS-C sized sensors because I want the highest possible linear resolution for my money. Often being FL limited at 600mm I have to add a 1.5× (removing 33.33% linearly, or 55.55% by area) so that I am using a 15×10mm area of sensor, for a magnification of 43.5× to fill the screen.

What is nice about this is that if I open the final image in Ps, or even in ACR, in full screen mode I can get a very good idea of what a 300PPI print is going to look like if I set the zoom to 73%, and the display will easily fit up to A3 or 16×12. That is one facet of Lr that is less than ideal, the limited number of zoom levels available. Other than Fit and Fill you are limited to 1:1 (100%), 1:2 (50%), 1:3 (33.33%) 1:4, 1:8, and 1:16, and of course the same sequence in the opposite direction. Most of the time it matters very little, but when you have a monitor physically capable of displaying the image at the physical size you are going to print, displaying the image at that size would be nice.

It's not such an issue on a more normal resolution monitor, after all 1:3 as a viewing option is pretty close to exactly matching a 100 PPI display to the size of a 300 PPI print. Even a 27" 2560×1440 resolution monitor is going to be fairly close at 1:3 with it's 109.5 PPI.

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