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Thread started 20 Oct 2017 (Friday) 10:00
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So if we are done with LR, whats our choices?

 
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Feb 22, 2018 19:24 |  #346

sploo wrote in post #18570022 (external link)
Whenever I've looked into LR performance issues it's always (as a software engineer) given me the gist that they have a large legacy code base, with some likely not that well understood legacy functions.

It seems that way. They have a hard time fixing bugs. Some are carried forward to new version after new version. For example, sometimes renaming a file causes one or more photos to appear quite blurry. This bug has been around for many years. The workaround is to restart the program. Hopefully you do this before culling photos that look unsharp because of the bug.


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Feb 23, 2018 03:24 |  #347

I have been reading on other forums a few re-installs seem to have made a difference. Perhaps a corrupt file. I guess I'll see when I get home.


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kirkt
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Feb 23, 2018 07:08 |  #348

Adobe flagships, like Photoshop and Lightroom, are probably a hodgepodge of patches of aging code that could benefit from a fresh start. Combine that with users demanding that Lightroom do things it is clearly not intended to do, like detailed pseudo-pixel editing operations such as retouching and cloning, and the mess we see today is inevitable. I have, fortunately, never had problems with LR, primarily because I avoid using it. To me, this is the easiest way to ensure that I do not encounter the workflow bottlenecks that seem to plague the software with each update that claims otherwise.

If you go to the Luminous Landscape forum and read through this thread (started in 2013!):

If Thomas [Knoll] designed a new Photoshop for photographers now...
http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.ph​p?topic=78240.0 (external link)

you can only hope that Thomas Knoll and the folks at Adobe are busy conceptualizing and creating a new Photoshop - not a Lightroom, which does not permit image processing, but a full-fledged imaging application that gives the digital imaging user modernized tools for modern platforms and cameras. One does not need to reinvent Photoshop, but modernize and refine its approach, codebase and tools. Many other smaller outfits are doing or have done this, spurred on ironically by Adobe's choice to charge a subscription for its products, with the promise that the subscription model would spur continuous innovation and bug fixes. Well, we see where that has gone.

It is an interesting time in digital photography, with all of the innovation in cameras (minus Canon, who seem to have given up on innovating anything) and mobile photography and raw converters and image processors and computing power. Anyone who is old enough to have used some of the original digital cameras back in the day only has to pause and reflect for a moment to realize that we take an awful lot for granted when things do not appear to work perfectly. That said, Adobe really needs to step up its game if its marketing department wants to continue to be taken seriously - many subscribers, including me, likely continue to subscribe because of time and money and equipment invested in an Adobe-centric workflow, not because Adobe tools are the absolute best for the job.

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Quack ­ Me ­ Up
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Feb 24, 2018 12:04 |  #349

"IF" I decide to upgrade from my standalone version of Lightroom 4, is there any price reduction to go to Lightroom 6?




  
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Scoobert
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Feb 24, 2018 12:09 |  #350

Quack Me Up wrote in post #18571192 (external link)
"IF" I decide to upgrade from my standalone version of Lightroom 4, is there any price reduction to go to Lightroom 6?

Yes, I think you still get the discount when you skip versions.




  
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Scott ­ M
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Feb 24, 2018 17:26 |  #351

Quack Me Up wrote in post #18571192 (external link)
"IF" I decide to upgrade from my standalone version of Lightroom 4, is there any price reduction to go to Lightroom 6?

It should be $80 plus tax.


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clipper_from_oz
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Post edited 5 months ago by clipper_from_oz. (3 edits in all)
     
Mar 04, 2018 07:20 |  #352

sploo wrote in post #18570022 (external link)
Whenever I've looked into LR performance issues it's always (as a software engineer) given me the gist that they have a large legacy code base, with some likely not that well understood legacy functions.

I've seen too many reports over the years from people (sometimes with really high end systems) finding that LR crawls for some operations; with no one seemingly able to explain why, or fix it.

In general it works OK for me (I have the last standalone version, LR6), but I've never bothered upgrading my graphics card to something more powerful as I've not got much confidence it'd work better, and it would be entirely possible I made it worse.


Precisely the problem I now face with my old macbook pro. I need to upgrade this June as I upgrade every 3 years for work and Im not so sure upgrading will help my issues in Lightrooms develop function. Talking to Adobe and also reading the ADobe threads it is clear there are still many users out there with new 2017/2018 top of the line MacbookPros as well as high specc'd Imacs that are also experiencing develop module slowdowns etc . I think it also depends on what tools you use as to what you can expect to suffer slowdown wise regardless of specification of hardware. Like the multiple tool same image in conjunction with global sharpening and NR. That scenario slowdown is reported across all macs regardless of year of Macbook Pro release. And it seems the newer the mac bigger the problem according to one tech I spoke to inAdobe. He infact told me this after he tested my catalogue on a new Mac they had in Tech support. And not only did he experience my issues on this newer test mac they had but he believed the slowdown was infact worse than what they had seen on a previous test they did on a similar model to mine. Some said had something to do with utilisation of the multi core chips but to date Adobe arnt saying much apart from that its a "known" issue


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Mar 04, 2018 08:18 |  #353

clipper_from_oz wrote in post #18567341 (external link)
Adobe have lost the plot...I have been waiting in hope they fix the problems and now its worse. .LR Classic 7.2 thats just been released is a bloody disaster in the develop module. Once global sharpening and noise reduction is done on a large RAW you cant use more than a couple of brush tools on the same image before it starts lagging and slowing down to be almost unuseable etc . and when that happens tools like clone and heal are 100% useless as they take over 30seconds to render in some instances . Crazy stuff

And Adobes fix for this? Well adobe tech support say to do global sharpening noise reduction at the end of everything. What a useless fix especially if you you need use the brush tool for local/selective sharpening noise reduction because how in the hell can someone see what global sharpening /noise has been done first before doing the local sharpen for say an eye or some other selective part of the image that global cant fix without affecting something else !!

Clearly their tech support and Product engineers have no idea of real world users work flows In LR. They are more worried about window dressing the fixes like making export and import marginally faster yet neglecting to fix the main engine of the thing which is the develop module . In addition to this Adobe are now stating that some of these local edit tools should be used lightly to stop slow down and I wonder why the hell they ever put in these features in LR if they cant be used as they were designed to be . Im betting Classic will fold in 12 months time because no one can fix the issues due to the old coding. I bet coding in Lightroom Classic would be like one big pile of spagetti with all the butchering thats gone on since version 5

We are then destined to be stuck with that other useless image editing programme called CC which Adobe are pushing as way for them to claw some additional revenue via forcing people to get more cloud storage due to that being a requirement to work!. That and a crippled develop function is an absolute joke .

I understand people have different experiences with Lr but for whatever it's worth I'm getting no lag, slowdown, or anything else with 7.2. I did with 7.1 so something definitely was improved...for me. I have global sharpening and noise happening on import for my starting settings.


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Mar 04, 2018 08:49 |  #354

jcothron wrote in post #18577206 (external link)
I understand people have different experiences with Lr but for whatever it's worth I'm getting no lag, slowdown, or anything else with 7.2. I did with 7.1 so something definitely was improved...for me. I have global sharpening and noise happening on import for my starting settings.

I have those auto apply and Auto (in the basic widow), my Clarity default (+12), Lens corrections and Camera profile.


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Mar 04, 2018 19:10 |  #355

PhotosGuy wrote in post #18479880 (external link)
And as I pointed out, they also made CS2 free: https://photography-on-the.net …showthread.php?​p=18476816
I would bet that most people only use about 5% of what PS is capable of, & I'm one of them, so I left the upgrade path long ago.


I also use CS2 along with LR5.7 I find this is fine for my needs as I do not find myself in the market for brand new cameras - requiring the lattest LR edditions, and although CS2 is quite old I still find it a good companion of LR5.

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Post edited 5 months ago by mwsilver. (6 edits in all)
     
Mar 04, 2018 21:23 |  #356

I'm continuing to fall in love with DXO PhotoLab, especially it's ease of use. Here are two versions of the same problematic raw image, one completely unprocessed the other processed in PhotoLab in under 5 minutes. I was very pleased with the details I was able to retrieve from the deep shadow areas with virtually no really objectionable noise, and sharpening with no obvious artifacts. Since so much of what DXO Photolab does can be automated with templates, you can very quickly have a strong starting point which may require only a few additional tweaks. And since I never used Lightroom as an asset management system, I was always frustrated by the additional effort of importing the files into the catalog. Not having to import files into DXO Photolab is a big time saver for me. Finally, although I did not use them in the image below, local adjustments using the U point technology borrowed from the NIk software works very well, and auto masking is very effective in practice.

Note I also was able to quickly and easily straighten the verticals, although I wish their implemention of that tool was a bit more like that in Lightroom or Capture One. In some respects DXO Photolab is less feature-rich than its competitors, but I'm so pleased with the end results and the ease of getting them that I'm happy to live without those other features.

It's important to mention that I use DXO Photolab Elite version which has a few indispensable tools and features that are not in the standard version. I also have their available add in packages, one of which is the perspective tool which unfortunately is not built into the base program.


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Mar 06, 2018 01:15 as a reply to  @ mwsilver's post |  #357

Very impressive work.
I'm also on DxO Photolab but find highlights recovery rather difficult.
Smart lighting works but it's not one click magic tool and those selective sliders are
somehow not selective enough for my taste - for example highlights slider affects mid tones
far more then I would like.
So when I move highlights slider to the left my photo goes dull and dark. If you do the same in LR
it only affects highlights. The same with Capture One.
At least till I figure this out I do all highlights recovery in LR or Capture One.
Google is very short on DxO tutorials and Youtube also. Otherwise I must say I like DxO.

Would you be so kind to give me a hint, how do you recover highlights in DxO so I will get the same
results as I get in LR or Capture One.
I would appreciate any hint.




  
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Mar 06, 2018 03:14 |  #358

LR. I did noting but crop and export this shot. Everything auto applied at import as I stated in post #354. When I get home I'll push the crop.


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Mar 06, 2018 11:21 |  #359

Mathmans wrote in post #18578637 (external link)
Very impressive work.
I'm also on DxO Photolab but find highlights recovery rather difficult.
Smart lighting works but it's not one click magic tool and those selective sliders are
somehow not selective enough for my taste - for example highlights slider affects mid tones
far more then I would like.
So when I move highlights slider to the left my photo goes dull and dark. If you do the same in LR
it only affects highlights. The same with Capture One.
At least till I figure this out I do all highlights recovery in LR or Capture One.
Google is very short on DxO tutorials and Youtube also. Otherwise I must say I like DxO.

Would you be so kind to give me a hint, how do you recover highlights in DxO so I will get the same
results as I get in LR or Capture One.
I would appreciate any hint.

Without seeing the image you're referring to and not being certain about what you need to accomplish it's hard to say exactly what the issue may be for you. For starters here's a link to working with those controls. It's from an Optics Pro 10 tutorial, but the concepts in Photolab should be identical. It may not provide you with any information you didn't already have, but perhaps there may be something there which will help. Your results may also be slightly impacted by your use of the various contrast and sharpening controls Did you try turning smart lighting off and then play around with the highlight slider? The thing that I'm attempting to master at this point is the effect different controls have on one another.. I've occasionally noticed some unexpected results and then spend some time figuring out how I got there.

http://www.dxo.com …-shadows-dxo-opticspro-10 (external link)


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kirkt
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Post edited 5 months ago by kirkt. (2 edits in all)
     
Mar 06, 2018 13:42 |  #360

Mathmans wrote in post #18578637 (external link)
Very impressive work.
I'm also on DxO Photolab but find highlights recovery rather difficult.
Smart lighting works but it's not one click magic tool and those selective sliders are
somehow not selective enough for my taste - for example highlights slider affects mid tones
far more then I would like.
So when I move highlights slider to the left my photo goes dull and dark. If you do the same in LR
it only affects highlights. The same with Capture One.
At least till I figure this out I do all highlights recovery in LR or Capture One.
Google is very short on DxO tutorials and Youtube also. Otherwise I must say I like DxO.

Would you be so kind to give me a hint, how do you recover highlights in DxO so I will get the same
results as I get in LR or Capture One.
I would appreciate any hint.


Have you tried using the "highlight priority" exposure adjustment, or the spot-weighted tool in the Smart Lighting engine? Also, adding a small amount of ClearView can further boost contrast in recovered highlights. Tonal range sliders do overlap and I think if you search around you will find folks that agree with you that there is too much cross talk between each tonal range.

Also remember that now PhotoLab has local adjustments with auto masking and control points to isolate whatever it is that you need to get under control - you can select the highlights of an area and simply use exposure to bring them down. Doing this too much will start to affect contrast in that area, so use gently.

There is a difference between recovering highlights and reconstructing highlights. DXO is probably not as good at this point at performing the latter compared to ACR or C1.

kirk


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So if we are done with LR, whats our choices?
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