Canon and Sony body owners

Talley wrote in post #18581935
Fuji was for the wife. I haven’t shot it as a main rig. I’ve put several thousand shots through it so I’m familiar with it’s workings.

After having the Fuji stuff it’s left me not desiring the canon stuff. I’ve hardly shot. Wife don’t let me use her stuff much. That Fuji is a real joy to use but is lacking in several areas where Sony is very very strong at.

This isn’t some instant swap for me. It’s a natural evolving kit. As the kids grow my needs will change.

Fuji is more of a shooters camera. Less refined in some areas. Defiantly the travelist top choice or it should be.

Part of the swap choice was the a73 for the wife. I feel knowing her needs the FF will be a better fit for her. The Eyeaf will be another.

You have a wonderful gear sickness :P

Evolving kit is a perfect explanation of how a Canon shooter can transition.

If the "wife" isn't much of a prime lens shooter I do question if you can really take advantage of Sony mirrorless. G master glass is not small by any means. IMO your better off buying a body grip for the XT20 and purchase a fuji 16-55 as a universal zoom over sony for your wife OR keep on doing what she is doing with existing Fuji kit!

C'mon you know you want the sony and your wife will keep on using the Fuji LOL!!

My next question to Sony users is how do the sunflares (sun shining in lens) look with sony mirrorless? I find having fun artistic sunflares is something I do enjoy with my mirrored Canon body. Not sure if it's totally lens dependent or not.

I'm looking forward to see how some of the Canon Pro's venture into sony world......

AlanU wrote in post #18581949
You have a wonderful gear sickness :P

Evolving kit is a perfect explanation of how a Canon shooter can transition.

If the "wife" isn't much of a prime lens shooter I do question if you can really take advantage of Sony mirrorless. G master glass is not small by any means. IMO your better off buying a body grip for the XT20 and purchase a fuji 16-55 as a universal zoom over sony for your wife OR keep on doing what she is doing with existing Fuji kit!

C'mon you know you want the sony and your wife will keep on using the Fuji LOL!!

My next question to Sony users is how do the sunflares (sun shining in lens) look with sony mirrorless? I find having fun artistic sunflares is something I do enjoy with my mirrored Canon body. Not sure if it's totally lens dependent or not.

I'm looking forward to see how some of the Canon Pro's venture into sony world......

Nope she loves her 56 1.2 and uses it the most. Her next favorite is the 35 1.4. So for sony the 50/85 1.8 lenses are a very good equal for her on both size and cost

She videos with those lenses so the IBIS on the sony will be a massive improvement for her since she does handheld video kids doing stuff at their schools/functions.

Talley wrote in post #18581962
Nope she loves her 56 1.2 and uses it the most. Her next favorite is the 35 1.4. So for sony the 50/85 1.8 lenses are a very good equal for her on both size and cost

She videos with those lenses so the IBIS on the sony will be a massive improvement for her since she does handheld video kids doing stuff at their schools/functions.

True indeed. My intent is to go that exact route as the Fuji X-H1 is roughly the same price but not even close in performance (specs wise). I'll admit both systems have different render.

Paid a visit to visit a friend of mine.......and how convenient that it was a Sony Demo day

Well interesting finding. After speaking to the Sony rep he highly suggest purchasing the Sigma adapter over the metabone.

He has used both metabone and Sigma adapters alot with the new A7iii. He says that its very noticeable that the Sigma acquires AF faster. This is not saying the slow 100LIS or 85Lmk2 will be faster.....

Today I tested the A7iii (and A9) while walking around the store. This is not a tripod mounted setup but an actually walk around as if shooting an event. I was testing the A7iii with a Canon 24-70L f/4 zoom and the focus was noticeably quicker and snappier with the the Sigma adapter with Canon lens. I questioned my observation so one of the store reps tested it as well. We both swapped metabone and Sigma adapter. Seems both of us had to agree with the Sony rep that the sigma adapter with Canon lenses was snappier in acquiring auto focus.

With my limited play time today I will have to say the canon lenses I tested almost felt like using native 5dmk4 Canon body. It was so strange to admit the speed of the A7iii was insanely fast with no hint of lag whatsoever.

One of the camera reps shoots Fuji and Sony. Hands down the Sony AF and buffer was aggressive with incredible confidence. I took some photos of the Sony gear today and brought my Fuji X-t2. I will have to say after playing around with the A7iii and A9 for a good 1/2hrs my Fuji X-t2 felt hesitant and sluggish.

Today's I was anticipating some drawbacks with the Sigma adapter with Canon lenses. Hard to fully tell at this moment but for run/gun situations I really feel Canon glass will be absolutely have no problem at all.

I installed a Sony 16-35 f/4 and 55 f/1.8 and will have to say the weight was a fantastic balance. The G Master 85 f/1.4 was a monster and so was the G master 16-35 f/2.8.

Hand grip ergonomics was pleasing and comfortable in my hands. Unlike the tiny bump I'm not getting use to from all of my Fuji gear. Sigma just announced a tonne of new primes that fills in the blanks that Sony does not have apparently. Sounds like Sigma is trying to get more Sony users to jump on Sigma glass.

Just in case your wondering the A7iii has the bolt on grip extender so your pinky has a place to sit. I actually did not mind having my pinky curled under the body of the camera.

As a 5dmk4 shooter I'll have to say even the A7iii today appeared to deliver in crazy confident AF. My friend laughed and thinks I'll sell/dump my Fuji and slowly convert to a Sony shooter. I will say the Sony gave me a smile today.....

nqjudo wrote in post #18579052
Mike,

Like yourself I'm a Canon shooter but I'm not really married to the system. I've integrated mirrorless Oly, Fuji and Sony into my kit at different times and it didn't work well for me for the most part. My goals differ from yours in that my interests are mostly travel and wildlife. I see a lot of very tough if not extreme environments and my list of limitations or concerns with Sony probably wouldn't be the same as yours so I'll try to stick to things we may have in common.

I have been eyeing two choices. Either making a major investment in glass (I think I read a post where you were looking at the 400ii DO too) or moving toward an A9. I know a local wildlife photog who uses the A9 and I've been out with him for many sessions and have used the A9 with native glass quite a bit now. Personally I find that the A9 performs very well - even for BIF. The AF system is very robust but my perception is that Canon may have the edge in lower light. If we compare the 5D4 to the 1DXii I think based on your posts you believe the two are further apart than I do in terms of AF. That said, I think the A9 is just as capable as either depending on who is doing the shooting with a little room for condition-specific give and take. In your work you'll likely enjoy the silent shooting and lack of blackout too. EC is a breeze and battery life will be of little concern.

The concerns I have about the A9 are more personal and practical-based as an individual who has a large investment in one system. First, whether I like it all the time or not, Canon is the only system that can cover all my bases. I did turn an A7rii into a useless pile of electronics during a trip in harsh and variable conditions. Initial reports were that the A9 was supposed to be fully weather sealed but at one point that was dropped and we started hearing things like 'weather resistant', etc. This is unfortunate and probably the only major finger-pointing that can be done toward the body. For something touted as a direct competitor to the 1DXII it seems like a giant oversight. This is a huge concern and the first nail in the coffin in my decision to purchase the A9 or not because the service I received from Sony for the A7rii issue was nothing short of a nightmare. I also had an emergency situation in Southern Africa last year and I was able to purchase a Canon charger in rural Namibia. Sony is up and coming but they do not yet enjoy the ubiquity that Canon does in terms of service or general availability. I only have one incident to refer to but I can't see a working pro relying on the kind of service that I received from Sony. This could play into your equation. As stated previously Canon covers all my bases so I find the inclusion of a different supplier into the mix an unnecessary one that adds to confusion and eliminates the redundancy I enjoy with sticking to one system. One weakness that even Sony proponents will admit to is the menu system. I personally didn't find it intuitive and while I might get used to it over time I found using two vastly different bodies impractical. This, on top of dealing with two different mounts. I think the best approach if you want to go Sony is to abandon Canon altogether rather than mixing the two.

The results? When comparing shots with my friend or those taken by myself with either body there really wasn't much of a difference. We were both confused at times about who took which shot with which camera. We see this a lot on the forum where people make a big fuss about switching systems and post photos that are no different than before (although I don't deny that they may enjoy a more pleasant user experience). There is no denying that the A9 is iconoclastic in terms of tech. Maybe I'm not adept enough to take advantage of all the bells and whistles but in the end I didn't find a reason compelling enough to make me jump ship. The extra FPS was nice but not a dealbreaker.

The final nail in the coffin in my desire to buy an A9 is cost. It is hard to justify the switch for little or no gain (IMO). I believe my interest in the A9 was genuine and I maintained an open mind during the evaluation process. We're comparing different technologies but still looking at fantastic cameras all around. In the end though the Sony vs Canon thing feels a lot like Canon vs Nikon. Same old. It is a lot of rhetoric about amazing cameras that offer steller results. You've pressed more than a few shutter buttons in your time. You will find Sony to be a completely different experience but I don't think it will improve your results.

That's my experience, Mike. I'm not the best writer but I hope I was able to provide some insight. Let us know how it goes.

I had no issue at all with your post, until I reached the bolded verbiage.

Your writing, for the purposes of this forum, is excellent.

mickeyb105 wrote in post #18582359
I had no issue at all with your post, until I reached the bolded verbiage.

Your writing, for the purposes of this forum, is excellent.

Thanks!! English actually isn't my 1st language and I usually experience some trepidation when writing on forums. The tone of the written word is tough to interpret at the best of times and I've gotten myself in trouble unintentionally more than a few times.

Mike - FYI I took the 1DXII and the 100-400ii out today with my friend. He had his A9 and the 100-400 G Master. We put them on the scale and the difference was about 2.5 pounds in favour of the Sony. I didn't have the 5D4 with me but comparing the specs it works out to about half a pound for that particular combo. Sorry I don't have any comparators that you might use on a regular basis but I thought you'd be interested nonetheless.

nqjudo wrote in post #18582853
Mike - FYI I took the 1DXII and the 100-400ii out today with my friend. He had his A9 and the 100-400 G Master. We put them on the scale and the difference was about 2.5 pounds in favour of the Sony. I didn't have the 5D4 with me but comparing the specs it works out to about half a pound for that particular combo. Sorry I don't have any comparators that you might use on a regular basis but I thought you'd be interested nonetheless.

How was the performance compared to the 1dx2 compared to the Sony that he had ??

umphotography wrote in post #18583080
How was the performance compared to the 1dx2 compared to the Sony that he had ??

The 1DXII won the day but... it's complicated. One of the problems I've encountered with mirrorless is ergonomics. I shoot with a liner or mitten/liner system from about mid-October to April when I'm not travelling in a warmer climate (one reason I discount the advantage of touch screens). I find holding and manipulating the A9 akward and a bit uncomfortable than a larger body in that scenario. Second, I spent a good part of my time today experimenting with various AF configurations on the A9 (there are some interesting and useful options) so it isn't really fair to make my conclusion on that basis. What I can say for sure is that having both dialled in as best I can for the given scenario I'm still getting better performance from Canon in low light. They are both locking on but the 1DXII had more 'tack sharp' shots low light images than the A9. I may be missing some tweak on the A9 there as well though. Regarding the weight difference it isn't uncomfortable to hand hold either but the weight distribution/balance seemed a bit more comfortable on the A9. I'll probably have another opportunity with the A9 later this week if there is anything specific you want me to check out.

nqjudo wrote in post #18583150
The 1DXII won the day but... it's complicated. One of the problems I've encountered with mirrorless is ergonomics. I shoot with a liner or mitten/liner system from about mid-October to April when I'm not travelling in a warmer climate (one reason I discount the advantage of touch screens). I find holding and manipulating the A9 akward and a bit uncomfortable than a larger body in that scenario. Second, I spent a good part of my time today experimenting with various AF configurations on the A9 (there are some interesting and useful options) so it isn't really fair to make my conclusion on that basis. What I can say for sure is that having both dialled in as best I can for the given scenario I'm still getting better performance from Canon in low light. They are both locking on but the 1DXII had more 'tack sharp' shots low light images than the A9. I may be missing some tweak on the A9 there as well though. Regarding the weight difference it isn't uncomfortable to hand hold either but the weight distribution/balance seemed a bit more comfortable on the A9. I'll probably have another opportunity with the A9 later this week if there is anything specific you want me to check out.

Thanks for this. Much appreciated. Low light capabilities of the 1Dx2 are indeed amazing and a difficult thing for any MFG to match. I know the D5 guys are blown away as well. D5 is better than the 1Dx2 by a full stop. One thing is for sure I dont think you can Buy a bad camera in the upper brackets for selections. And I will stand by my statements earlier when the 1Dx2 and D5's came out

The bodies are excellent and the MFG's are going to lock you into a brand with expensive glass and performance with their own products. Sony Is no different as apparent by the comments of performance with native glass v/s use of adapters. Sony is going to play the same game

Lots of stuff to consider But no Doubt Sony has turned up the heat with the A7iii release at $1999 and an A9 Af system in it. That is turning heads big time.

umphotography wrote in post #18583579
Thanks for this. Much appreciated. Low light capabilities of the 1Dx2 are indeed amazing and a difficult thing for any MFG to match. I know the D5 guys are blown away as well. D5 is better than the 1Dx2 by a full stop. One thing is for sure I dont think you can Buy a bad camera in the upper brackets for selections. And I will stand by my statements earlier when the 1Dx2 and D5's came out

The bodies are excellent and the MFG's are going to lock you into a brand with expensive glass and performance with their own products. Sony Is no different as apparent by the comments of performance with native glass v/s use of adapters. Sony is going to play the same game

Lots of stuff to consider But no Doubt Sony has turned up the heat with the A7iii release at $1999 and an A9 Af system in it. That is turning heads big time.

You make some good points. I had my weekly outing with a couple of friends today. They both shoot Nikon. We don't usually discuss gear but I brought up this thread and the question of Sony which we discussed at length during the drive. The consensus was that all the cameras are just so, so, good now that in reality the point of diminishing returns came a long time ago. We've got more choices now but they are all good choices to have. I've gone between Canon and Nikon a couple of times in the past and each time I realized that for all my effort of selling, buying and retraining my brain I was really just exchanging one set of pros and cons for another. Right now my gear does 100% of what I need it to do. It makes it hard to justify any kind of change. The future of all this is going to be interesting but I'll be watching it from the sidelines.

Tomorrow I meet my buddy with the a9. We'll be shooting medium-sized BIF on fairly complex backgrounds. I'll report back if there is anything significant.

Mike - I said that I would report back if I came across anything significant and I did notice a few things that you might be interested in. We had tons of action and today was a more typical scenario for me. I got to evaluate things differently than I had before.

Before today the birds we’ve been shooting were against fairly clean backgrounds. I’ve mostly been using ‘flex spot / lock-on’ on the a9 for tracking. Basically you pick a focus area or spot and once you acquire a subject the AF will automatically track across all the AF points which is the entire frame on the a9. It is a really excellent feature that works surprisingly well in good conditions. Today the camera struggled with smaller subjects, competing backgrounds and interfering objects. I lost focus a lot so the previous advantages of the AF tracking were negated. For fun I tried to use larger selection areas, etc. to see if the camera would pick up the subject better but as expected that didn’t work out very well. Re-acquisition was very fast when possible but I it wasn’t a desirable solution. I resorted to a more typical stationary AF selection and followed subjects manually which worked well. The a9 does have a lot of nice customization options and while it is possible to assign alternate AF configurations to custom buttons the AF tweaking doesn’t go as deep as Canon so the a9 lost out a little there. I hadn’t noticed the difference in wake up times with the slower pace of my previous use but it was palpable today. With the a9 being slower I missed out on a lot of initial action shots. I needed to wear something thicker than liners today and it was quite tough ergonomically. There were times when I just couldn’t stop myself from performing unwanted actions. Run-ins with the EC dial were most common.

In discussing the wake up lag my friend mentioned that when using studio strobes the mechanical shutter is also quite lag. This is something I have no hands on experience with though.

Today changed my perception of the a9 a little. I still think it is a great camera with broad appeal but there is a sharp decline in my understanding of the sticker price – particularly since I was using the 7D2 today (your favourite ).

That’s going to be it for my a9 adventures for the next month or so but I think I’ve done all the playing around that I need to. I hope somewhere I’ve offered something of use to you. Keep us posted on how things develop with your decision. It would be interesting to know if you are able to integrate Sony into your work.

nqjudo wrote in post #18584793
Mike - I said that I would report back if I came across anything significant and I did notice a few things that you might be interested in. We had tons of action and today was a more typical scenario for me. I got to evaluate things differently than I had before.

Before today the birds we’ve been shooting were against fairly clean backgrounds. I’ve mostly been using ‘flex spot / lock-on’ on the a9 for tracking. Basically you pick a focus area or spot and once you acquire a subject the AF will automatically track across all the AF points which is the entire frame on the a9. It is a really excellent feature that works surprisingly well in good conditions. Today the camera struggled with smaller subjects, competing backgrounds and interfering objects. I lost focus a lot so the previous advantages of the AF tracking were negated. For fun I tried to use larger selection areas, etc. to see if the camera would pick up the subject better but as expected that didn’t work out very well. Re-acquisition was very fast when possible but I it wasn’t a desirable solution. I resorted to a more typical stationary AF selection and followed subjects manually which worked well. The a9 does have a lot of nice customization options and while it is possible to assign alternate AF configurations to custom buttons the AF tweaking doesn’t go as deep as Canon so the a9 lost out a little there. I hadn’t noticed the difference in wake up times with the slower pace of my previous use but it was palpable today. With the a9 being slower I missed out on a lot of initial action shots. I needed to wear something thicker than liners today and it was quite tough ergonomically. There were times when I just couldn’t stop myself from performing unwanted actions. Run-ins with the EC dial were most common.

In discussing the wake up lag my friend mentioned that when using studio strobes the mechanical shutter is also quite lag. This is something I have no hands on experience with though.

Today changed my perception of the a9 a little. I still think it is a great camera with broad appeal but there is a sharp decline in my understanding of the sticker price – particularly since I was using the 7D2 today (your favourite ).

That’s going to be it for my a9 adventures for the next month or so but I think I’ve done all the playing around that I need to. I hope somewhere I’ve offered something of use to you. Keep us posted on how things develop with your decision. It would be interesting to know if you are able to integrate Sony into your work.

Great report. Thanks for this. This definitely gives me a little cause for concern. As I have mentioned, the 1Dx and 1Dx2 AF systems are soooooo Good for Canon shooters. more to think about

http://www.canonrumors​.com

Sony Executive: Expects Canon and Nikon full frame mirrorless by this year

By Richard | March 13, 201

I’m sure this is quite worrying for Sony. Up to now they have had this particular niche market for themselves; now it seems that Sony’s expecting competition soon. DPReview interviewed Sony’s Senior General Manager of the Digital Imaging Business Group, Kenji Tanaka who has this to say; Q: One of the reasons that companies like Sigma ...


The previous CR post:

Canon wants a 50% marketshare

By Richard | March 13, 2018
Canon Business General

Canon recently did their annual corporate strategy conference and there’s a pretty surprising statement from Canon in the middle of their speech summary. They were extremely bullish when it came to the camera side of the company as they dropped the gauntlet when it comes to mirrorless and their overall marketshare stating;
.. in our core camera business, in addition to our overwhelming share of the DSLR market, we will go on the offensive and work to expand our sales in the mirrorless camera market, which is exhibiting remarkable growth. This will allow us to reach our goal of 50% marketshare of the entire interchangeable lens camera market.

Left Handed Brisket wrote in post #18584844
http://www.canonrumors​.com

Sony Executive: Expects Canon and Nikon full frame mirrorless by this year

By Richard | March 13, 201

I’m sure this is quite worrying for Sony. Up to now they have had this particular niche market for themselves; now it seems that Sony’s expecting competition soon. DPReview interviewed Sony’s Senior General Manager of the Digital Imaging Business Group, Kenji Tanaka who has this to say; Q: One of the reasons that companies like Sigma ...


The previous CR post:

Canon wants a 50% marketshare

By Richard | March 13, 2018
Canon Business General

Canon recently did their annual corporate strategy conference and there’s a pretty surprising statement from Canon in the middle of their speech summary. They were extremely bullish when it came to the camera side of the company as they dropped the gauntlet when it comes to mirrorless and their overall marketshare stating;
.. in our core camera business, in addition to our overwhelming share of the DSLR market, we will go on the offensive and work to expand our sales in the mirrorless camera market, which is exhibiting remarkable growth. This will allow us to reach our goal of 50% marketshare of the entire interchangeable lens camera market.

I imagine by the time canon catches up in features, I'll be quite the old man. I'm already over a decade older than when I started shooting canon, waiting that long, simply isnt feasible. You only have one life to live.

I find no pleasure when shooting with a clearly gimped system that requires complementary systems to satisfy my different shooting scenarios. I have the original EOS-M, that was suppose to be my "smaller" complimentary system. So glad I'm done with all that noise, the M went through how many iterations, and still vastly inferior to Sony? At that pace, fool me once........