Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and our Privacy Policy.
OK
Index  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Guest
New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 05 Sep 2018 (Wednesday) 02:31
Search threadPrev/next
POLL: "How's the new EOS-R stack up for you?"
It's Amazing!
69
26.5%
It's kind of a let down
88
33.8%
It's trash
22
8.5%
It's good for the price
61
23.5%
It helped me pick a new body
20
7.7%

189 voters, 260 votes given (3 choices choices can be voted per member)). VOTING IS FOR MEMBERS ONLY.
BROWSE ALL POLLS
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

EOS-R - It's out. Thoughts?

 
this thread is locked
sploo
premature adulation
2,400 posts
Gallery: 1 photo
Likes: 460
Joined Nov 2011
Location: West Yorkshire, UK
     
Sep 10, 2018 04:51 |  #526

Talley wrote in post #18703737 (external link)
IBIS has the advantage of working for video and still though. The digital system on the canon is for video only but it does work really well from what I've seen.

Good point - though it occurs to me that the recent versions of Photoshop have (I think) a filter to reduce blur caused by camera shake (on a single image). If done in-camera with movement detected by an accelerometer (or at least with accelerometer metadata stored in the image file) it should be possible to improve a blurred image in post. Not as good as IBIS or IS, but better than nothing.

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18704282 (external link)
B - When going from a 30MP sensor to 4K you have to "dump" or "bin" a huge amount of the overall sensors data. Which method you choose each has it's pluses and minuses. If it were cost effective in the hardware, it would be BEST to have the option to chose either a central contiguous crop or an interlaced/lineskipped "FF" crop, (it is still a crop to get the aspect ratio from "ff" down to the wider 4K.)

Downsampling softens the images, cropping reduces usefulness of wide angle, etc. It's not a one is better for everyone. Often though, it is one is better for you.


My assumption is that the best option would be a good quality downsampling of all pixels, as line skipping would introduce some pretty nasty artefacts. Image frames can be sharpened in post, but removal of moire is much harder (I believe).

It's a shame they can't take a 6144x3240 crop from the sensor (just a 1.16x crop vs the whole frame), and downsample by 1.5x to produce a 4096x2160 video stream. A 35mm focal length becoming 40mm in 4K mode (1.16x crop) would likely get less flack than the rather large 1.7x crop.

Ah-keong wrote in post #18704605 (external link)
may I ask how does the RF lens mount on the EF-M line? or does it able to mount?

AFAIK There's currently no crossover with EF-M and the R system. I guess that might change in the future (if the registration distance means that it's physically possible to make an adaptor).

On the subject of EF to R adaptors - someone (I can't find the post right now) mentioned that it was likely we'll see cheap third party versions of the basic adapter. I think that's a good call, as it should be little more than an extension tube (with the communication pins). As often noted with cheap tubes; third party air is as good as Canon air ;)


Camera, some lenses, too little time, too little talent

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)
Ah-keong
Senior Member
Avatar
940 posts
Gallery: 69 photos
Likes: 1215
Joined Apr 2016
     
Sep 10, 2018 04:56 |  #527

looking at the Sigma 18-35mm and the 50-100mm, I hope Sigma release a say " 10-18mm f/1,8 ART " for crop  :p


Canon 7D2+grip | 18-35mm ART | EF-S 10-18mm | EF 70-200mm f/2,8L IS II | ZE 2/100mm | ZE 2/35mm | ZE 1,4/85mm | CV 3,5/20mm | Nikkor 60mm f/2,8D |
Olympus E-PL3 | 7-14mm f/2,8 |
Speedlite 430EX III-RT | 600EX-RT | YN 600EX-RT |
Manfrotto BeFree Travel Tripod |

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sploo
premature adulation
2,400 posts
Gallery: 1 photo
Likes: 460
Joined Nov 2011
Location: West Yorkshire, UK
     
Sep 10, 2018 04:57 |  #528

zamorac wrote in post #18704632 (external link)
My thoughts exactly! For what i shoot my 6D is still my favorite camera ever. I don't need the frame rate or AF of the 5D4. 6D2 also brings nothing for me compared to 6D classic. 1DX2 is way to big, heavy and expensive even to consider it. 5DS lacks dynamic range, high ISO and would probably force me to upgrade to sharper lenses.

I am still amazed how good 6D classic images can turn out and how reliable this camera is. For now I don't see a Canon model that would make me spend around $2000 and give me major improvement over 6D.

You would see a significant low ISO dynamic range improvement with the 5D4 or 1Dx2 (or even the 80D for that matter; it humbled my 5D3). Quantitatively the 5D4 is around 0.5-0.66 of a stop better than the 5D3 at very high ISO settings (12,800+); but with the improvements in the character of the noise I'd qualitatively put it nearer 1 stop better.

The 6D was a tiny bit better than the 5D3 at high ISO settings, so a 5D4 or EOS R would bring you a pretty substantial step forward in image quality (if that floats your boat).

PS I've not used the 5DS, but I've seen a fair few comments from shooters that the extra resolution allows some pretty aggressive noise reduction; such that it does compete well with a 5D3 at high ISO settings (if you compare two similarly sized prints).


Camera, some lenses, too little time, too little talent

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sploo
premature adulation
2,400 posts
Gallery: 1 photo
Likes: 460
Joined Nov 2011
Location: West Yorkshire, UK
     
Sep 10, 2018 04:58 |  #529

Ah-keong wrote in post #18704654 (external link)
looking at the Sigma 18-35mm and the 50-100mm, I hope Sigma release a say " 10-18mm f/1,8 ART " for crop  :p

10-18 f/1.8 would be nice.

I love the 18-35 on a crop body; great lens.


Camera, some lenses, too little time, too little talent

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
samueli
Goldmember
Avatar
1,011 posts
Gallery: 11 photos
Likes: 133
Joined Feb 2009
Location: Macomb County, Michigan, USA
     
Sep 10, 2018 07:56 as a reply to  @ sploo's post |  #530

Charlie wrote in post #18704463 (external link)
Fuji went in hard with video, and likely have the strongest package available, possibly beating Panasonic. I've watched a few popular YTer's that swear on Panasonic, and they have super high quality OOF video lol.

Panasonic is still in rumor stage with their next release. Nothing to compare to yet.

Charlie wrote in post #18704485 (external link)
Problem is that you certainly don't want to grow your adapted list, but native collection. Usefulness is out the door real fast once you convert to native.

I just spent $2500 not two months ago on two new EF lenses, to fill major gaps. Canon has essentially ditched me as a customer. I if get the R, my new lenses that I expect to useful for many years to come will be second rate on EOS R. I don't want to play the adapter game at this price point, nor should I be required to as a long time Canon customer.




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Left ­ Handed ­ Brisket
That's my line!
Avatar
9,253 posts
Gallery: 12 photos
Likes: 2049
Joined Jun 2011
Location: The Uwharrie Mts, NC
Post edited 5 months ago by Left Handed Brisket.
     
Sep 10, 2018 08:03 |  #531

samueli wrote in post #18704711 (external link)
my new lenses that I expect to useful for many years to come will be second rate on EOS R

i think you (and most of the internet) are jumping to conclusions.


PSA: The above post may contain sarcasm, reply at your own risk | Not in gear database: Auto Sears 50mm 2.0 / 3x CL-360, Nikon SB-28, SunPak auto 322 D, Minolta 20

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
samueli
Goldmember
Avatar
1,011 posts
Gallery: 11 photos
Likes: 133
Joined Feb 2009
Location: Macomb County, Michigan, USA
Post edited 5 months ago by samueli. (3 edits in all)
     
Sep 10, 2018 08:06 |  #532

Left Handed Brisket wrote in post #18704715 (external link)
i think you (and most of the internet) are jumping to conclusions.

Not really. Someone above already has concerns using an adapter in a mixed system - 3 discreet items and only two hands. Not an experience I care to have at this price and investment.




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sploo
premature adulation
2,400 posts
Gallery: 1 photo
Likes: 460
Joined Nov 2011
Location: West Yorkshire, UK
     
Sep 10, 2018 08:14 |  #533

samueli wrote in post #18704717 (external link)
Not really. Someone above already has concerns using an adapter in a mixed system - 3 discreet items and only two hands. Not an experience I am paying for at this price point.

But surely you either pop the EF lens off the adaptor (which is still on the camera) and put on another EF lens, or pop the EF lens + adaptor off the camera and put on an R lens? Not really different to using a lens + TC.

I would be surprised if a (modern) EF lens on the R was significantly worse that using the same EF lens in Liveview on a (modern) Canon DSLR. There's certainly no major reason for a difference in performance - given the R mount is EF plus some extra pins (I believe).


Camera, some lenses, too little time, too little talent

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
iazybandit
Goldmember
2,105 posts
Likes: 57
Joined Apr 2011
Location: New York
     
Sep 10, 2018 09:19 |  #534

Ah-keong wrote in post #18704605 (external link)
may I ask how does the RF lens mount on the EF-M line? or does it able to mount?

RF lenses can NOT mount on to EF-M bodies and EF-M lenses can NOT be mounted onto RF bodies.


Canon :: 5D Mark IV | EOS M5
Glass/Gear :: Canon 24-70L II | Canon 50mm f/1.8 STM | EF-M 22mm | EF-M 11-22
FULL GEAR LIST | FEEDBACK
FS: Varavon Monopod and Camtrol Prime Stabilizer | Tolifo LED Light, Luxi for All Light Meter, Ruggard Journey 34 Shoulder Bag

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sploo
premature adulation
2,400 posts
Gallery: 1 photo
Likes: 460
Joined Nov 2011
Location: West Yorkshire, UK
Post edited 5 months ago by sploo.
     
Sep 10, 2018 09:27 |  #535

iazybandit wrote in post #18704746 (external link)
RF lenses can NOT mount on to EF-M bodies and EF-M lenses can NOT be mounted onto RF bodies.

A quick bit of searching tells me EF-M has an 18mm flange/registration distance. With the R mount being (I understand) 20mm, it means you won't be able to use a EF-M lens on an EOS R.

It's unlikely you'd get an R lens on an EF-M body either; as it'd need an adaptor just 2mm thick. Having said that, I think someone did once manage an adaptor for using Nikon F lenses (46.50mm mount distance) on an EF body (44mm mount distance), so that would have to be just 2.5mm in order to get infinity focus.

EDIT: That said, I think the Nikon F mount has a smaller diameter than EF, so some of the F-to-EF adaptor could have been built to sit inside the opening of the camera's EF mount.


Camera, some lenses, too little time, too little talent

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
patrick ­ j
Goldmember
1,235 posts
Gallery: 29 photos
Likes: 1529
Joined Mar 2009
Location: Denver
     
Sep 10, 2018 09:41 |  #536

Just saw this at Canon Rumors, an interview with a Canon exec. Have to wait and see when it's tested if the DR is improved.

Mr. Kiyota : The number of pixels itself is the same as EOS 5D Mark IV, but the sensor itself is newly developed. The content has changed a lot, such as adoption of a new dual pixel CMOS AF and arrangement of microlenses according to EOS R system. (Google Translated)

Mr. Kiyota : First of all, I will introduce EOS R as a well-balanced middle class, but of course I am thinking about the higher and lower models than that. In particular, since other companies are issuing higher pixel models, we believe that there will be many requests from those competing models. (Google Translated)


Flickr (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
CyberDyneSystems
Admin (type T-2000)
Avatar
49,319 posts
Gallery: 155 photos
Likes: 5889
Joined Apr 2003
Location: Rhode Island USA
     
Sep 10, 2018 09:46 |  #537

Ah-keong wrote in post #18704605 (external link)
may I ask how does the RF lens mount on the EF-M line? or does it able to mount?

As of now, Canon has no plans to make this happen.
Will a 3rd party do it?


GEAR LIST
CDS' HOT LINKS
Jake Hegnauer Photography (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
patrick ­ j
Goldmember
1,235 posts
Gallery: 29 photos
Likes: 1529
Joined Mar 2009
Location: Denver
     
Sep 10, 2018 09:48 |  #538

rogue.guineapig wrote in post #18704558 (external link)
I love my 6D... I felt like I had advantages to the 5D3, and like for the money I had a seriously great rig. I am a 6D fanboy.

The reason I'm rather pissed about this R is that my 6D is nearing the end of it's life and I have no good options to repeat the experience/value-to-price ratio the 6D gave me.
I felt no reservations, no hesitations, no drawbacks, and no concerns when I bought the 6D. Looking back, I have 0 regrets about it.
If I gotta drop $2,000 on a body, I sure would like to repeat that feeling with the next upgrade, but as it stands, it doesn't look likely.

Kind of curious where the EOS R falls short. Better AF, 50 percent more resolution, updated sensor, all your lenses will work, and it's a few hundred dollars more than your 6D was.


Flickr (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
CyberDyneSystems
Admin (type T-2000)
Avatar
49,319 posts
Gallery: 155 photos
Likes: 5889
Joined Apr 2003
Location: Rhode Island USA
Post edited 5 months ago by CyberDyneSystems. (2 edits in all)
     
Sep 10, 2018 09:54 |  #539

patrick j wrote in post #18704753 (external link)
...

Mr. Kiyota : The number of pixels itself is the same as EOS 5D Mark IV, but the sensor itself is newly developed. The content has changed a lot, such as adoption of a new dual pixel CMOS AF and arrangement of microlenses according to EOS R system. (Google Translated)...


No tests yet, but If we counted the number of times Canon has released a new body and insisted that the slight changes do to metering, AF etc, = "New Sensor" Canon would be 5 generations ahead of where thy are now.

they essentially NEVER admit when they reuse a sensor or sensor tech. They always insisted as each 18MP body was introduced, that it was "new and improved" but it never was. The independent testing always reveals the same IQ.

I am confident that for the new Mirrorless R there ARE differences in the manufacture of this sensor from the 5D4, DPAF, clearly, but my bet is that the part that makes up an image, has likely not changed one IOTA. If it has, someone will have to prove it to me to believe it.


GEAR LIST
CDS' HOT LINKS
Jake Hegnauer Photography (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
gossamer88
"something else"
Avatar
1,037 posts
Gallery: 66 photos
Likes: 649
Joined Aug 2014
Location: NYC
Post edited 5 months ago by gossamer88.
     
Sep 10, 2018 09:55 |  #540

patrick j wrote in post #18704753 (external link)
Just saw this at Canon Rumors, an interview with a Canon exec. Have to wait and see when it's tested if the DR is improved.

Mr. Kiyota : The number of pixels itself is the same as EOS 5D Mark IV, but the sensor itself is newly developed. The content has changed a lot, such as adoption of a new dual pixel CMOS AF and arrangement of microlenses according to EOS R system. (Google Translated)

Mr. Kiyota : First of all, I will introduce EOS R as a well-balanced middle class, but of course I am thinking about the higher and lower models than that. In particular, since other companies are issuing higher pixel models, we believe that there will be many requests from those competing models. (Google Translated)

Here are some highlights of the interview (canonwatch.com):


  1. The Canon EOS R sensor is not the same as the sensor featured on the EOS 5D Mark IV. The EOS R sensor is a new development.
  2. The image quality of the Canon EOS R will beat any other Canon DSLR camera thanks to new sensors, new processors and new, high performing lenses
  3. Canon did not add on sensor stabilisation (IBIS) because of the costs, and heating and size issues. They might consider adding on sensor stabilization on future models
  4. There will be more EOS R models in the line-up. Expect lower and higher end models to be released in the future
  5. Canon is considering making a 8k Cinema EOS R camera

Canon 5D Mark IV | Tamron 24-70mm G2 | Tamron 70-200mm G2 | 85mm 1.8 | 50mm STM | 35mm f/2 IS | Powershot G9 X | iPhone 7
flickr (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

113,007 views & 1,660 likes for this thread
EOS-R - It's out. Thoughts?
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Index   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset

Not a member yet?
Register to forums
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.1forum software
version 2.1 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member was a spammer, and banned as such!
288 guests, 257 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 15144, that happened on Nov 22, 2018

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.