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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 05 Sep 2018 (Wednesday) 02:31
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POLL: "How's the new EOS-R stack up for you?"
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EOS-R - It's out. Thoughts?

 
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Talley
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Sep 16, 2018 10:06 |  #991

I already bought the CPL adapter


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Sep 16, 2018 10:16 |  #992

I wonder if you can override the auto cropping for APS-C lenses. Some aren't too bad on a full frame.


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JeffreyG
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Sep 16, 2018 10:19 |  #993

umphotography wrote in post #18709080 (external link)
We are going to find out. And the reason I used metabones and Sigma was because that was conventional wisdom as to what works best on Sony when the A7iii was announced at $2300.00.

Does Sony even make an adapter for their bodies? If so Im wondering why everyone uses the other adapters ??

What? The situations are not even analogous. All they have in common is the word "adapter". Sony released FE mount bodies and FE mount lenses and would like to sell you both. 3rd party vendors backwards engineered both the Sony protocol and the Canon protocol to allow people to mate these two systems that were never designed to work together. Metabones and Sigma did this without the help of engineering departments at Sony or Canon.

Sony may have benefitted from this in getting people to switch, but it isn't an engineered system.

Canon is releasing a complete, engineered system of EOS R, EF lenses, and their own adapter. They know how all of the software works, because they designed it all. That is totally different.

I do seem to recall that the 1DMKIII designed by canon engineers had a lot of problems so there is that history from Canon. There is also the history of rushing updates to markets that were not all that much as far as update go. 50D, 6D2 come to mind on te prosumer side of the fence.

Well yeah, any camera can have problems. But assuming that because some 3rd party kludge system isn't perfect means Canon cannot make all of their own stuff work together doesn't make sense.

This is an entry level camera into the mirrorless market to which Canon is very new to the game. I dont have as much faith in the technology yet on canons part

Canon offers adapters to put EF lenses on M-mount cameras. It works fine, inasmuch as there is nothing wrong with the adapter. What is the problem is that most M-mount cameras are not great at focusing in general. But here it isn't the problem of the word "adapter", it's a problem that when you mount a ring-USM L lens on a camera with terrible AF speed, the adapted AF speed will also suck. But that ain't the fault of the adapter.


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Sep 16, 2018 10:19 |  #994

Cuttlefish wrote in post #18709081 (external link)
Can we safely assume that all lenses for we have for EF mount will work with the new EOS-R?

e.g. I have a Sigma 70-200 f2.8 DG APO HSM which I have used with my 7D (Yes, I understand the crop factor is applied) and I am interested in getting a Rokinon 14mm soon also?

I saw one report referenced in this thread that said a Sigma lens didn't work with the adapters, and one that said it did. So I suppose at this point, the answer is "nobody knows".

It would be in Sigma's best interest to have their lenses work with the Canon adapters, so if there is a firmware issue, I'm sure they will try to fix it as soon as they can. Expect them to start with their higher-end lenses (Art series) and go down from there.

The lens you reference (Sigma 70-200 f2.8 DG APO HSM) is discontinued, but it may still be supported, depending how long ago that was. I don't know if it works with the USB dock for firmware updates, so you may have to send it back to be "rechipped".

All this is assuming, of course, that it doesn't work with the R adapters. It might. Nobody knows for sure yet.

I have some personal experience with this. I bought a first or second generation Sigma 70-200 mm f/2.8 APO lens in around 1995 for my film EOS (100). When I went digital in 2004 with the purchase of a 20D, the camera reported some kind of error when I connected it. I contacted Sigma about rechipping it, but by that time it had been out of production for long enough that they wouldn't do it. Such is the lifecycle of electronics in the 21st century. :-(

Mike


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Sep 16, 2018 10:19 |  #995

umphotography wrote in post #18709086 (external link)
Yes they are making an adapter

Have you tested it and actually seen it work ?

has anyone yet ?

I sure have not seen it and a dam sure dont know how its going to perform

Yes I use the EF-EFm adapter with ef and ef-s glass on my M5. It works flawlessly.




  
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Sep 16, 2018 10:23 |  #996

mcoren wrote in post #18709096 (external link)
I saw one report referenced in this thread that said a Sigma lens didn't work with the adapters, and one that said it did. So I suppose at this point, the answer is "nobody knows".

It would be in Sigma's best interest to have their lenses work with the Canon adapters, so if there is a firmware issue, I'm sure they will try to fix it as soon as they can. Expect them to start with their higher-end lenses (Art series) and go down from there.

The lens you reference (Sigma 70-200 f2.8 DG APO HSM) is discontinued, but it may still be supported, depending how long ago that was. I don't know if it works with the USB dock for firmware updates, so you may have to send it back to be "rechipped".

All this is assuming, of course, that it doesn't work with the R adapters. It might. Nobody knows for sure yet.

I have some personal experience with this. I bought a first or second generation Sigma 70-200 mm f/2.8 APO lens in around 1995 for my film EOS (100). When I went digital in 2004 with the purchase of a 20D, the camera reported some kind of error when I connected it. I contacted Sigma about rechipping it, but by that time it had been out of production for long enough that they wouldn't do it. Such is the lifecycle of electronics in the 21st century. :-(

Mike

All my sigma lenses have worked just fine with the M5 and Canon adaptor.




  
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davesrose
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Sep 16, 2018 10:23 |  #997

umphotography wrote in post #18709080 (external link)
Does Sony even make an adapter for their bodies? If so Im wondering why everyone uses the other adapters ??

Sony makes an A mount to E mount adapter. That's the most analogous to Canon making an EF to R adapter: brands make adapters for their own lenses.


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JeffreyG
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Sep 16, 2018 10:26 |  #998

mcoren wrote in post #18709096 (external link)
I saw one report referenced in this thread that said a Sigma lens didn't work with the adapters, and one that said it did. So I suppose at this point, the answer is "nobody knows".

It would be in Sigma's best interest to have their lenses work with the Canon adapters, so if there is a firmware issue, I'm sure they will try to fix it as soon as they can. Expect them to start with their higher-end lenses (Art series) and go down from there.

The lens you reference (Sigma 70-200 f2.8 DG APO HSM) is discontinued, but it may still be supported, depending how long ago that was. I don't know if it works with the USB dock for firmware updates, so you may have to send it back to be "rechipped".

All this is assuming, of course, that it doesn't work with the R adapters. It might. Nobody knows for sure yet.

I have some personal experience with this. I bought a first or second generation Sigma 70-200 mm f/2.8 APO lens in around 1995 for my film EOS (100). When I went digital in 2004 with the purchase of a 20D, the camera reported some kind of error when I connected it. I contacted Sigma about rechipping it, but by that time it had been out of production for long enough that they wouldn't do it. Such is the lifecycle of electronics in the 21st century. :-(

Mike

This is a good point, while it is reasonable to assume Canon EF lenses will work fine adapted to the EOS R, it does not then follow automatically that 3rd party EF mount lenses will always work fine on the RF. Canon has screwed 3rd party lens manufacturers in the past.

That's an interesting business point. A decade ago, I think Canon looked at screwing 3rd party lens manufacturers as good business sense. System flexibility wasn't a huge bonus in selling people into a system, and once in the EOS system Canon wanted to sell you lenses.

Now.....I would say that system flexibility and 3rd party offerings have been a big part of the Sony E-mount success story. So should a camera OEM even help 3rd party lens makers?


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Sep 16, 2018 10:29 |  #999

umphotography wrote in post #18709086 (external link)
Yes they are making an adapter

Have you tested it and actually seen it work ?

has anyone yet ?

I sure have not seen it and a dam sure dont know how its going to perform


The EF to M adapter has been around for years. Plenty have used it, I have one and use it on a M3. Saying that a Canon adapter with a Canon lens, on a Canon body will not work is the same as saying that a Canon lens on a Canon body won't. But lets keep taking about how a Sony A-whatever doesn't work with a brand x adapter with and brand Y lens...yeah, that is comparable.


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JeffreyG
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Sep 16, 2018 10:35 |  #1000

davesrose wrote in post #18709099 (external link)
Sony makes an A mount to E mount adapter. That's the most analogous to Canon making an EF to R adapter: brands make adapters for their own lenses.

Yeah.....actually the LA-EA4 adapter from Sony is the one weird thing out there. For people not familiar, the LA-EA4 mounts Sony A-mount lenses on E-mount (mirrorless) bodies. Built into the LA-EA4 is a complete pellicle mirror and AF system. The conclusion here is that the Sony A-mount lenses do not work well with the hybrid AF system in the mirrorless cameras.

But we do know that Canon EF lenses focus well with PDAF, which is the system employed in the EOS R.

Overall - love the R or hate the R, I don't think the adapted EF lenses (Canon branded ones at least) will be a kludge.


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Sep 16, 2018 10:39 |  #1001

JeffreyG wrote in post #18709101 (external link)
This is a good point, while it is reasonable to assume Canon EF lenses will work fine adapted to the EOS R, it does not then follow automatically that 3rd party EF mount lenses will always work fine on the RF. Canon has screwed 3rd party lens manufacturers in the past.

That's an interesting business point. A decade ago, I think Canon looked at screwing 3rd party lens manufacturers as good business sense. System flexibility wasn't a huge bonus in selling people into a system, and once in the EOS system Canon wanted to sell you lenses.

Now.....I would say that system flexibility and 3rd party offerings have been a big part of the Sony E-mount success story. So should a camera OEM even help 3rd party lens makers?

Very good points these. In the past, companies wanted to be the "one stop source" for everything. Buying from a third party meant less sales for the OEM, which was considered bad.

These days, companies prefer to just focus on what they can do well ("core competency" is the business school term), and they depend on an expanded "ecosystem" of third party accessory manufacturers to keep people interested in their products. For evidence, just look at all of the third party cases, dongles, storage, chargers, etc. lining the walls in the back of an Apple retail store.

Another example, more on topic: Canon will happily sell you their excellent 100-400L II for around $2K, but it's to their benefit that Sigma and Tamron make similar quality alternatives for less than $800. It keeps Canon cameras viable for people who can't justify paying the OEM lens price.

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Sep 16, 2018 10:41 |  #1002

umphotography wrote in post #18709086 (external link)
Yes they are making an adapter

Have you tested it and actually seen it work ?

has anyone yet ?

I sure have not seen it and a dam sure dont know how its going to perform

I've seen reviews by several reliable photographers who have tested it with adapters and seen them work. I don't recall one negative yet about the adapters. So I'm more inclined to be "dam" sure the adapters will work. One photographer noted using the 85mm 1.4 adapted and claimed it worked no less than properly.

If an anomaly happens, a small tweak would be easy to implement.


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Sep 16, 2018 10:54 |  #1003

umphotography wrote in post #18709086 (external link)
Yes they are making an adapter

Have you tested it and actually seen it work ?

has anyone yet ?

I sure have not seen it and a dam sure dont know how its going to perform

Have you tested it and seen it not work?

Has anyone yet?

If there were hiccups during the small sample size of photogs using it, can we reliably and accurately separate the variable of the body itself from the adapter--especially given a sample size that's so limited?
Can we separate statistical noise of "hiccups" from body or adapter functionality at this point?
No.

I'm no Canon fanboi, and no fan of the EOS-R, but I see no reason to complain about OEM adapter functionality yet when said functionality has no reason to be doubted.
I got PLENTY of beef with this new system, but I've not seen evidence that it should include adapter problems.
Price? Well, thaaat's another story. I'll complain about a $400 adapter. :-D


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Sep 16, 2018 11:21 |  #1004

JeffreyG wrote in post #18709063 (external link)
The point that has only been stated about 1000 times, is that Metabones and Sigma are not, in fact, Sony. And it is totally plausible that driving a Canon or Sigma lens through a Metabones adapter by interpreting Sony AF protocol is not going to be perfect.

But that doesn't make it a logical progression to think that a Canon lens, driven through a Canon adapter, by a Canon camera, all of which was engineered by one department specifically to work together, is going to have the same problem. I'd actually be quite surprised if an EF lens on the EOS R worked any different than the same lens on a 6D in the same conditions.

The adaptation to an EF lens to the RF mount should work.

I think the performance of the EOS R will be based more on the actual "NEW" mirrorless body and software/firmware. How the mirrorless technology will work in general will be different from using a mirrored body.

Based on my experience and if you're "stuck" using single card bodies I'd take a Canon 6d/6dmk2 any day over an EOS R. The mirrored body will have extremely fast AF centerpoint (I tend to focus / recompose during fast paced stressful times). The red focus assist is rock solid in brutally dark environments like receptions. No shutter lag whatsoever ...bam! bam! bam! during an event. Mirrored bodies just dont seem to ever hunt much and at least mirrored technology takes advantage of the external flash red focus beam. Mirrorless just doesn't utilize red focus assist to the same degree.

Partly due to my lack of owning GMaster glass the results should be faster but there is still an ever so slight propigation delay when you press the shutter button on my Sony and even my Fuji X-t2. Fuji's quad core processor now has silly fast AF and operation of the camera body!!

If the EOS R performs well reliably this is still not fully determined as no one owns an EOS R. I still would imagine hunting issues with the EOS R as it is mirrorless. Seems like there is a higher percentage of hunting in the mirrorless world especially in low contrast, low light situations. At this moment I see great advantages still using mirrored bodies with external flash (bouncing) having red focus assist beam. I absolutely hate the piercing white LED that some Mirrorless bodies use for focus assist.


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Sep 16, 2018 12:41 |  #1005

Cuttlefish wrote in post #18709081 (external link)
Can we safely assume that all EF lenses for we have will work with the new EOS-R without an adapter?

e.g. I have a Sigma 70-200 f2.8 DG APO HSM which I have used with my 7D and I am interested in getting a Rokinon 14mm soon also?

No, they all need that ring adapter thing. There is some debate on this thread about how well a third party lens will work, what I've seen in a few youtube reviews is that Canon lenses at least work perfectly with the ring. Both EF-S and EF lenses will work on the EOS R.


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