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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 05 Sep 2018 (Wednesday) 02:31
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POLL: "How's the new EOS-R stack up for you?"
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EOS-R - It's out. Thoughts?

 
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davesrose
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Sep 22, 2018 22:42 |  #1306

Tom Reichner wrote in post #18713757 (external link)
Well then tell me what recent Canon body you can get for 50 percent of the original price just 18 months after release. I am telling you, that just doesn't happen anymore.


Well one model I've always been attached to is the 5D series. I bought the 5D about a year after it was introduced. It stayed over $3,000 until the 5D2 was introduced (and it was the only 5D model that was introduced for less then $3000). The Canon MSRP for the 5D series (even since the original) has never dropped like that.


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EF 135mm 2.0L, EF 70-200mm 2.8L IS II, EF 24-70 2.8L II, EF 50mm 1.4, EF 100mm 2.8L Macro, EF 16-35mm 4L IS, Sigma 150-600mm C, 580EX, 600EX-RT, MeFoto Globetrotter tripod, grips, Black Rapid RS-7, CAMS plate and strap system, Lowepro Flipside 500 AW, and a few other things...
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RDKirk
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Sep 22, 2018 22:46 |  #1307

Wilt wrote in post #18713616 (external link)
I think confusion is created because Strick's idea of 'mount' is the design of the bayonet lugs...that is only PART of the definition of 'mount'.
In the case of EF-S, the mount also includes the part of the lens protruding into the body past the bayonet lugs.
And, as we have seen with the EF-R, the mount definition also includes the design characteristics of the assembly which carries the electrical contacts...both reshape the carrier, as well as adding more contact pins.

Does the Nikon situation clarify the matter or obfuscate it?

Nikon claims that it has used the F-mount since 1959, but there is an entire alphabet of Nikon F-this and F-that and F-the other of all the various versions and interations of Nikon's painful and jerky transition to TTL metering, exposure automation, focus automation, et cetera, all in--from one viewpoint--the "F" mount.




  
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RDKirk
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Sep 22, 2018 22:51 |  #1308

Wilt wrote in post #18713776 (external link)
If reliant only upon nomenclature, then comes the problem that the camera would need to update its database as new EFS (and new crop image circle lenses) are introduced and the listed lenses expands, unless there is some 'key' that marks the naming convention for all crop lenses. Speculation does us no appreciable good, other than to amuse us! :lol:

Yes. They do update the database in the camera. You use the EOS Utility to do that online.

If you mount a lens that is not in the database, the camera tells you that in one of its menus.




  
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Wilt
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Sep 22, 2018 23:00 as a reply to  @ RDKirk's post |  #1309

OK, what are the chances that Canon bothers to list 3rd party (aftermarket) crop lenses?!


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Tom ­ Reichner
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Sep 22, 2018 23:19 |  #1310

davesrose wrote in post #18713777 (external link)
I bought the 5D about a year after it was introduced. It stayed over $3,000 until the 5D2 was introduced (and it was the only 5D model that was introduced for less then $3000). The Canon MSRP for the 5D series (even since the original) has never dropped like that.

What you say above is simply untrue.

I bought a brand new 5D from B&H for $1,800 in May of 2008. No rebate and not a refurb and not a gray market one, either.

The 5D Mark 2 wasn't released until October of 2008.

I think that somehow you haven't kept really good track of all the price changes over the years and the corresponding rates of depreciation for each Canon body. Maybe it's just not super important to you, and therefore you don't remember all of the dates and prices with great precision.


"Your" and "you're" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"They're", "their", and "there" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"Fare" and "fair" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one. The proper expression is "moot point", NOT "mute point".

  
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mdvaden
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Post edited 5 months ago by mdvaden. (5 edits in all)
     
Sep 22, 2018 23:26 |  #1311

RDKirk wrote in post #18713768 (external link)
Does the lens physically fit on a Canon full frame camera? if so, it is not "EF-S" mount, regardless of actual image size.

An EF-S mount will not physically attach to a Canon FF camera (without modification).

There are several things I shared ...

- It will fit to an EF-S mount

- Just like B&H did, noting "EF-S" mount .. figurative and general terms are part of daily communication.

- certain people will try and tell someone a "Vacuum" they just said, is not technically not a vacuum.

And if others want to call stuff by textbook terminology, that's fine too. One previous poster said it well that people get wrapped up in symantics. But your point has already been written once or twice and is old news for the day. But what you wrote is right.

An earlier thing I shared about B&H was that they referred to the 18-35mm available for "EF-S" mount. They choose to include a bit of figurative writing style alongside the technical information.


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mdvaden
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Sep 22, 2018 23:35 |  #1312

davesrose wrote in post #18713777 (external link)
Well one model I've always been attached to is the 5D series. I bought the 5D about a year after it was introduced. It stayed over $3,000 until the 5D2 was introduced (and it was the only 5D model that was introduced for less then $3000). The Canon MSRP for the 5D series (even since the original) has never dropped like that.

Was the 5D one of the slowest depreciating camera bodies that you recall for DSLR? Or was that somewhat normal?


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joeseph
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Sep 22, 2018 23:39 |  #1313

davesrose wrote in post #18713601 (external link)
Jake (CyberDyneSystems) even took the time to give you links that described the difference with EF-S mount. Why don't you read those...or watch the video right on top of your post?? The EF-S mount protrudes so you can't mount it to a FF body (at least without modifications or adding to an extension tube). APS-C bodies (as Jake's link shows) has a recessed area to accept EF-S lenses...and the mount ring of the APS-C is the same diameter as EF (so APS-C bodies can accept EF or EF-S mount lenses).

I hear what you're saying, but think you're muddling the term APS-C with EF-S. (EF-S mount bodies are a subset of APS-C bodies & can't/shouldn't be used interchangeably)


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Wilt
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Sep 23, 2018 00:01 as a reply to  @ mdvaden's post |  #1314

5Dn series has been one of the atypical models, dropping in used value far more slowly than bodies like the nnD prosumer (before the 70D and 80D were reclassified as NOT 'prosumer').

It used to be that cameras like 350D, 40D and 1Dn dropped in used price by about 35% per year, a half-life of two years. The 5D did not drop at that rate.

BTW, the above statement has zero bearing on any decrease of MSRP (new camera price) over time.


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Wilt
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Post edited 5 months ago by Wilt. (3 edits in all)
     
Sep 23, 2018 00:04 |  #1315

joeseph wrote in post #18713810 (external link)
I hear what you're saying, but think you're muddling the term APS-C with EF-S. (EF-S mount bodies are a subset of APS-C bodies & can't/shouldn't be used interchangeably)

But in 2004 Canon set a direct relationship between the 1.6x crop sensor, also known as APS-C, and the fact that ALL of the Canon APS-C bodies (20D and later) accepted EF-S mount lenses (and EF mount lenses), while FF bodies never accepted unmodified EF-S mount lenses.
The May 2000 Canon D30 did have an APS-C sensor but did have the EF mount. So did the Feb 2003 Canon 10D.


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joeseph
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Sep 23, 2018 00:45 |  #1316

Wilt wrote in post #18713818 (external link)
But in 2004 Canon set a direct relationship between the 1.6x crop sensor, also known as APS-C, and the fact that ALL of the Canon APS-C bodies (20D and later) accepted EF-S mount lenses (and EF mount lenses), while FF bodies never accepted unmodified EF-S mount lenses.
The May 2000 Canon D30 did have an APS-C sensor but did have the EF mount. So did the Feb 2003 Canon 10D.

let's just agree that there are a number of APS-C sensor cameras that are not EF-S mount ?


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Wilt
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Sep 23, 2018 00:56 |  #1317

joeseph wrote in post #18713826 (external link)
let's just agree that there are a number of APS-C sensor cameras that are not EF-S mount ?

Sure, they are not Canon brand!


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Sep 23, 2018 01:46 |  #1318

joeseph wrote in post #18713826 (external link)
let's just agree that there are a number of APS-C sensor cameras that are not EF-S mount ?

Better to agree on some things than to all become a "Banned" of Brothers with text across our Avatars !!


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Sep 23, 2018 02:01 |  #1319

mdvaden wrote in post #18713849 (external link)
Better to agree on some things than to all become a "Banned" of Brothers with text across our Avatars !!

Nobody will be banned for stating facts,for example: Only Canon makes EF-S lenses. That's what that is, a fact.
Most people understand what a fact is and therefore don't attempt to debate them.


Dave
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welshwizard1971
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Sep 23, 2018 04:15 |  #1320

I think this EF-S mount argument is going in circles and killing the thread, could we stop taking about it now please, or someone start a separate thread for different Canon mounts? I've understood the difference for a decade, I thought it was pretty obvious, no idea why it's suddenly so confusing and contentious...


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EOS-R - It's out. Thoughts?
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