Post your 2020 landscapes!

HannahsDad wrote in post #19269299
=Hannah'sDad;19269299]​Here is the image above that I reworked yesterday and this morning. It's still not exactly what I want, but it is closer.
Scott

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Sorry to be negative, but I think your first version was far more pleasing than this one. To my eye, the line of brightly colored trees in the middle ground needs to be on fire from the direct sunlight. The edges of the lake don't really form lines leading anywhere. But if you brighten those trees, that will bring the eye to the center of the image. It's hard to convey what I mean in words. It's a visual thing. May I post a re-work that shows what I'm getting at?

HannahsDad wrote in post #19269299
=Hannah'sDad;19269299]​Here is the image above that I reworked yesterday and this morning. It's still not exactly what I want, but it is closer.

And with regard to what I changed about it, I noticed in the sky, to the right of the peak, some artifacts from masking in Photoshop, as well as some issues at the tops of some of the other peaks. I also cleaned up some of the tree line, so that there weren't so many dark, shadowy spots to "pull" your eye away from the intent. I wanted the eye to follow one of the two leading lines, either the riverbank on the left or right up to the mountain range.

Scott

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Thanks for sharing; that definitely punched it up quite a bit!

Peano wrote in post #19269591
='Peano;19269591]Sorry to be negative, but I think your first version was far more pleasing than this one. To my eye, the line of brightly colored trees in the middle ground needs to be on fire from the direct sunlight. The edges of the lake don't really form lines leading anywhere. But if you brighten those trees, that will bring the eye to the center of the image. It's hard to convey what I mean in words. It's a visual thing. May I post a re-work that shows what I'm getting at?

Thank you for the input. Of course you can post a version. By no means do think this is the definitive picture from this location. It's just my version, but if you think you can improve it, please show me what you think would make it better for competition. I would appreciate it!

Scott

Snydremark wrote in post #19269607
Thanks for sharing; that definitely punched it up quite a bit!

Thank you. We'll see if it can be improved! One of the things I was thinking about was vignetting the edges some to dial down the brightness there. Only thing is, I don't want to lose any detail in the trees on the right.

Scott

I'll offer this idea... it's not new lol...

You can use Contrast in your favor. So, think of it like this - Today we have this whole thing about "I MUST have everything in shadows revealed". Here's the problem. You then introduce more elements that can distract. Eventually the overall image loses it's 3-D feel because there's no contrast/deep shadows going on.

Classic art kind of reveals this concept more: https://www.the-art-of-composition.com …est-area-of-contrast.html

Contrast can create diagonals and can help the dynamics of the image.

Here's an analogy - Why does music today suck? Well, one reason (among many) is that the entire song is LOUD. HDR, with everything turned UP, is the equivalent. If you go back and listen to classical whatever, you'll notice songs have quiet points that then lead up to or have Loud/dynamic points, but at no point, is the ENTIRE song just LOUD. HDR, or revealing every detail within your shadow areas is kind of like the AutoTune of the photography world. Yes, in the process it seems like a good idea, but then when you take a few steps back, you're left with no dynamics. Shadows in images are a way for your eyes to reset, to rest, then your eyes flow back into the highlights and so on...

Conclusion: Contrast IS your friend!!!!!! I say GO for it, make areas completely BLACK, with NOTHING revealed. You'll then see that those areas can create shapes/leading lines/or can be used to juxtaposition the point of the image itself. Overall, I think of it like this: "Does this Add or Subtract from my image/idea/point?"

Most are not open to feedback, but I can tell you, that if you are, then you'll only grow, and will always be on a path of self improvement/best version. My images SUCK btw!

Some editing ideas:

1) Unzoom/make the image like a really small postage stamp on your computer. Then, ask yourself: "Does this jump out at me?" "Do I want to explore this further?" This will also help you see if the image overall is congruent or not, and spot areas that need work.

2) Check the image on your phone/other monitors/different days

3) Do what you're doing now - Asking for feedback / Fresh eyeballs

HannahsDad wrote in post #19269740
=Hannah'sDad;19269740]​Thank you for the input. Of course you can post a version. By no means do think this is the definitive picture from this location. It's just my version, but if you think you can improve it, please show me what you think would make it better for competition. I would appreciate it!

Scott

HannahsDad wrote in post #19269740
=Hannah'sDad;19269740]​Thank you for the input. Of course you can post a version. By no means do think this is the definitive picture from this location. It's just my version, but if you think you can improve it, please show me what you think would make it better for competition. I would appreciate it!

Scott

Thank you. This is just a rough illustration, of course, because I didn't start with the image out of the camera. The main edits were 1) to enhance the fall colors of the trees and 2) to darken the blue in the sky. I did 1 (in Photoshop CS6) by painting on a blank layer set to Overlay blend mode. Just selectively painted each tree using different shades of yellow, orange and red -- plus some green on the evergreens. Keep brush opacity low, 10%. It's easy to overdo it in Overlay mode.

For the sky I used a deep blue photo filter and set that layer to Multiply mode, density pushed to 100% and layer opacity reduced to 50%. I put a black mask on that layer and painted the blue back in selectively using a soft brush at low brush opacity (10%).

Also selectively enhanced the reflection in the water with unsharp mask set to a large radius and low amount. The radius will depend on the size of the image; for this one I used 70 px and amount 35%.

You said this is for a contest, and I'm not sure how much they allow in the way of altering what comes out of the camera. My suggestions might be outside the rules, but they might be useful in other contexts.

markesc wrote in post #19269758
I'll offer this idea... it's not new lol...

You can use Contrast in your favor. So, think of it like this - Today we have this whole thing about "I MUST have everything in shadows revealed". Here's the problem. You then introduce more elements that can distract. Eventually the overall image loses it's 3-D feel because there's no contrast/deep shadows going on.

Classic art kind of reveals this concept more: https://www.the-art-of-composition.com …est-area-of-contrast.html

Contrast can create diagonals and can help the dynamics of the image.

Here's an analogy - Why does music today suck? Well, one reason (among many) is that the entire song is LOUD. HDR, with everything turned UP, is the equivalent. If you go back and listen to classical whatever, you'll notice songs have quiet points that then lead up to or have Loud/dynamic points, but at no point, is the ENTIRE song just LOUD. HDR, or revealing every detail within your shadow areas is kind of like the AutoTune of the photography world. Yes, in the process it seems like a good idea, but then when you take a few steps back, you're left with no dynamics. Shadows in images are a way for your eyes to reset, to rest, then your eyes flow back into the highlights and so on...

Conclusion: Contrast IS your friend!!!!!! I say GO for it, make areas completely BLACK, with NOTHING revealed. You'll then see that those areas can create shapes/leading lines/or can be used to juxtaposition the point of the image itself. Overall, I think of it like this: "Does this Add or Subtract from my image/idea/point?"

Most are not open to feedback, but I can tell you, that if you are, then you'll only grow, and will always be on a path of self improvement/best version. My images SUCK btw!

Some editing ideas:

1) Unzoom/make the image like a really small postage stamp on your computer. Then, ask yourself: "Does this jump out at me?" "Do I want to explore this further?" This will also help you see if the image overall is congruent or not, and spot areas that need work.

2) Check the image on your phone/other monitors/different days

3) Do what you're doing now - Asking for feedback / Fresh eyeballs

Chris -

I am always open to suggestions on how to improve an image. I agree that every detail does not need to come out, but, what has hammered me and other photographers during competition is the "jet" black of the shadows, where there is absolutely no detail. I have been subjected to it myself and have run this image past a number of professional photographers who also happen to be judges. They were consistent that the total lack of detail in the shadows was pulling down the image. I am not trying to HDR the image, but rather, stop they eye from going to the point of highest or lowest contrast, unless that is where I want the eye to go to. Feel free to edit either image and I will be happy to take a look at the result, I have seen your work, and it is impressive. So, have at it and help me improve this image, if you are so inclined!

Scott

Peano wrote in post #19269774
='Peano;19269774]Thank you. This is just a rough illustration, of course, because I didn't start with the image out of the camera. The main edits were 1) to enhance the fall colors of the trees and 2) to darken the blue in the sky. I did 1 (in Photoshop CS6) by painting on a blank layer set to Overlay blend mode. Just selectively painted each tree using different shades of yellow, orange and red -- plus some green on the evergreens. Keep brush opacity low, 10%. It's easy to overdo it in Overlay mode.

For the sky I used a deep blue photo filter and set that layer to Multiply mode, density pushed to 100% and layer opacity reduced to 50%. I put a black mask on that layer and painted the blue back in selectively using a soft brush at low brush opacity (10%).

Also selectively enhanced the reflection in the water with unsharp mask set to a large radius and low amount. The radius will depend on the size of the image; for this one I used 70 px and amount 35%.

You said this is for a contest, and I'm not sure how much they allow in the way of altering what comes out of the camera. My suggestions might be outside the rules, but they might be useful in other contexts.

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Hosted photo: posted by 'Peano in
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I really like what you have done to the image. I think it draws out the fall colors very well. My concern is with the shadows. And that is what several friends who have looked it have said, as well. I love what you have done and will try to replicate it (it is clear that you are much better at Photoshop than I am), but I still think I need to do something with the darkest of shadows. This is a "print" competition, which means that just about anything goes. You can manipulate the image to your heart's content, but anything in the image must have been taken by you. Here is a link to what is referred to as the "12 Elements of a Merit Image". It's a tough competition. I saw a great image get knocked down in score because the reflection in the water was too intense and took your eye away from the actual mountain. So, I will be trying out some of your edits and seeing if I can improve the "punch" of the image. Thank you very much for taking the time to do this and explaining it.

https://www.ppa.com …elements-of-a-merit-image

Scott

Yeah maybe I'm old School lol... Having started in the slide film era, you simply were forced to make "creative choices" and oftentimes shadow detail in favor of highlights was sacrificed.

However, there's some irony here:

On one hand you're the Artist, and it's you at the wheel. Then there's the choice of who's looking at the Art, and their interpretation. I believe that what's being lost today is the a bit of perspective on what makes a lot of classic art have a long shelf life. The imperfections, in my opinion, are just as important. I like it like this: It's a photograph, not reality.

Personally speaking, I think some photos lend themselves well if they have the right atmospheric conditions where there's some flatness and more is revealed because its' say foggy or something, but there can be said that contrast can be used as a tool in your favor.

HannahsDad wrote in post #19269778
=Hannah'sDad;19269778]​Chris -

I am always open to suggestions on how to improve an image. I agree that every detail does not need to come out, but, what has hammered me and other photographers during competition is the "jet" black of the shadows, where there is absolutely no detail. I have been subjected to it myself and have run this image past a number of professional photographers who also happen to be judges. They were consistent that the total lack of detail in the shadows was pulling down the image. I am not trying to HDR the image, but rather, stop they eye from going to the point of highest or lowest contrast, unless that is where I want the eye to go to. Feel free to edit either image and I will be happy to take a look at the result, I have seen your work, and it is impressive. So, have at it and help me improve this image, if you are so inclined!

Scott

HannahsDad wrote in post #19269786
=Hannah'sDad;19269786]​I really like what you have done to the image. I think it draws out the fall colors very well. My concern is with the shadows.... I still think I need to do something with the darkest of shadows.

Thank you. I'm not sure exactly which shadows you mean, but if it's the nearly black areas tucked in among the brightest trees, a simple fix is to clone them out:

Blackwater Falls in the Winter, 2020

IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/2m88​5VS

Peano wrote in post #19269864
='Peano;19269864]Thank you. I'm not sure exactly which shadows you mean, but if it's the nearly black areas tucked in among the brightest trees, a simple fix is to clone them out:

There's nothing wrong with some Zone 0 in photos. Shadows are a natural part of nature, and with light, shadow must exist.

AS_Photo wrote in post #19270199
There's nothing wrong with some Zone 0 in photos. Shadows are a natural part of nature, and with light, shadow must exist.

I agree with you, but the reality is that you get pinged when there is too much Zone 0 (all black) in the image. I have worked on this quite a bit more and this is what I am entering into competition. I need a Photoshop tutor in the Dallas area to help me with the nuances of it because I have reached my limit of what I am capable of doing.

HannahsDad wrote in post #19273292
=Hannah'sDad;19273292]​I agree with you, but the reality is that you get pinged when there is too much Zone 0 (all black) in the image. I have worked on this quite a bit more and this is what I am entering into competition. I need a Photoshop tutor in the Dallas area to help me with the nuances of it because I have reached my limit of what I am capable of doing.

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Love the reflections in the water! Even the cloud reflections!

HannahsDad wrote in post #19273292
=Hannah'sDad;19273292]
I agree with you, but the reality is that you get pinged when there is too much Zone 0 (all black) in the image. I have worked on this quite a bit more and this is what I am entering into competition. I need a Photoshop tutor in the Dallas area to help me with the nuances of it because I have reached my limit of what I am capable of doing.

I know a guy in Allen, Texas that does teaching and photoshop teaching, Jon Fischer, https://www.facebook.c​om/JonPFischerPhotogra​phy