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Thread started 03 Jan 2021 (Sunday) 07:52
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Serious Q: Why would someone choose Canon over Nikon knowing...

 
aladyforty
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Feb 20, 2023 20:22 |  #61

MatthewK wrote in post #19482863 (external link)
Found with Fuji that you have to turn down the Sharpness of the files (I use -2), and that gets rid of the plasticky look you're seeing. Tradeoff is you have to add a little sharpening back in post if you want the best results. I only shoot jpg out of my Fujis, more often than not I transfer files to my iPhone for sharing, edit them using the iPhone, and I add exactly +14 sharpness... 15 is too much, 14 is perfect :-P

Definitely see the green cast in my Nikon files (D500, Z9), especially since I use them to shoot birds in foliage. Easy fix in post w/ the tint slider.

Canon, on the other hand, has always had a red/magenta tint tendency. It used to be really bad back in the 5D2/3 days, where the camera would blow out the red channel if you weren't careful. With the R5, I don't see that as much, and the files are so awesome to work with.

Nowadays, the gap b/w Canon and Nikon is about zero, you can get amazing files out of both systems. All of the DR and AF advantages that Sony and Nikon had have been pretty much erased with the RF mount. More important things to base a system choice on now.

Of the three brands I shoot, Fuji is easily the most fun. The look you can achieve with it is sublimely beautiful (especially w/ the Fuji 35 f/1.4). At the same time though, having shot countless times alongside my wife's R5 + 24-70 f/2.8, the Canon files are a good notch better, they're so clear and lush; the Canon is ultimately the camera we choose if we're shooting for serious.

The thing is though... Canon used to have such an awesome lineup of lenses that possessed a more characterful, old school feel: the EF 50 f/1.2L, 135L, 35 f/1.4L, 85 f/1.2L II... they've completely abandoned any sense of character, instead choosing to compete w/ robot Sony in the pursuit of clinical perfection and winning test chart shooting awards (same with Nikon, they too have some legendary glass). That's why I devote my casual shooting to Fuji anymore, I am more than willing to give up boring clinical perfection, for more character and feel being imparted on my photos. Yeah, yeah, we can always adapt the classic glass, but it'd be nice to see them embrace some artful side of design in future product releases.


I still have not decided about dumping my Canon, been close a number of times and the one thing that has stopped me is the 135L I have. Paired with 5D3 the images are striking and the skin tones always perfect. I don't know about other peoples 5D3s but my images always have been just right skin tone wise. I've never seen a magenta hue at all or maybe I'm blind to it. I also own three other canon lenses so its hard to get rid of something that is not broken. I have an emotional attachment to the camera. With my Fuji, its more fun but getting the tones right on skin has taken me some work at times. Fuji is perfect for everything else, wildlife looks amazing, buildings look great, amazing colours for abstract. I may end up hanging onto the old canon yet, same as I hardly touch my old Fuji X100 but cant sell it. Am I abnormal or what? :-D


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Bob_A
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Feb 20, 2023 22:08 |  #62

TeamSpeed wrote in post #19482866 (external link)
One consideration about Nikon... several times over the yeas, their demise has been predicted, their financials aren't great. They are at the bottom of the marketshare list, or very near it. So the longevity of Nikon, as camera sales continue to dwindle, might be something to think about. Will Nikon be around in 10 years? Probably, but they and one other manufacturer are certainly at more risk than the others.

Old news. :-) Their focus on higher end products may have reduced their market share for camera sales, but seems to have made them quite profitable:

https://nikonrumors.co​m …perating-profit-yoy.aspx/ (external link)


There are other camera companies that will go under before Nikon. OM concerns me because they are no longer protected from downturns by being part of a large diversified tech company. Still, if I liked OM that wouldn’t prevent me from buying their gear.


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Post edited 7 months ago by TeamSpeed. (2 edits in all)
     
Feb 20, 2023 22:25 |  #63

Yet we have several articles this year about Nikon talking about their future, including the deadline in 2025 for no DSLRs.

Hopefully nothing comes of this, we need the competition!

This is just one, there were more camera articles later in the year.
https://petapixel.com …ts-core-business-anymore/ (external link)


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Bob_A
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Feb 20, 2023 22:35 |  #64

aladyforty wrote in post #19483235 (external link)
I still have not decided about dumping my Canon, been close a number of times and the one thing that has stopped me is the 135L I have. Paired with 5D3 the images are striking and the skin tones always perfect. I don't know about other peoples 5D3s but my images always have been just right skin tone wise. I've never seen a magenta hue at all or maybe I'm blind to it. I also own three other canon lenses so its hard to get rid of something that is not broken. I have an emotional attachment to the camera. With my Fuji, its more fun but getting the tones right on skin has taken me some work at times. Fuji is perfect for everything else, wildlife looks amazing, buildings look great, amazing colours for abstract. I may end up hanging onto the old canon yet, same as I hardly touch my old Fuji X100 but cant sell it. Am I abnormal or what? :-D

Do you have anything similar to KEH Camera or MBP in Australia? In North America you can get $350 US for an X100 in excellent condition. You could probably get more selling on a camera forum.

I have a Fuji XE2S that I also need to get rid of. I took some great images with it, but absolutely hate the camera. Cheap build, weird control layout and the tripod mount is too close to the battery door. I also dislike processing its RAW files.

Honestly I can’t see any reason for anyone invested in Nikon, Sony or Canon to switch brands. And it just keeps getting better :-)


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Bob_A
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Feb 20, 2023 22:51 |  #65

TeamSpeed wrote in post #19483282 (external link)
Yet we have several articles this year about Nikon talking about their future, including the deadline in 2025 for no DSLRs.

Hopefully nothing comes of this, we need the competition!

This is just one, there were more camera articles later in the year.
https://petapixel.com …ts-core-business-anymore/ (external link)

Isn’t it reasonable that they would stop DSLR development? I’m certain Canon has a similar timeline.

I believe Nikon imaging is already less than 50% of their corporation.


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Feb 21, 2023 02:47 |  #66

This is the perspective from 2023 that addresses only the title of this thread. I did not consider the 1st post's message.

Canon's the #1 ILC maker that shipped >48% of all ILCs worldwide. Their RF mirrorless systems are odds on favorite to be 1 of 2 systems left standing 1-2 decades from now.

IMAGE: https://i.imgur.com/AuJ1X8W.png

Why? Because the digital camera market has shrunken down to only organizations like photo agencies, independent working photogs and enthusiasts.

Consumer market prefers iPhone or Android as their point & shoot or their Rebel.

At its all time high CIPA members shipped nearly 121.5 million units worldwide in 2010.

iPhone came out in 2007. Apple App Store & Android, as it looks today, in 2008.

I expect digital cameras to finally settle around 6-7 million from the 8 million last year.

Mirrorless being nearly 6 million. dSLR and point & shoots being ~1 million.

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Post edited 7 months ago by TeamSpeed. (2 edits in all)
     
Feb 21, 2023 04:55 as a reply to  @ Bob_A's post |  #67

I guess each of us will get something differently from that article, you with Nikon gear, and myself without. It is what it is, ultimately market share will drive their direction. I see risk, you don’t, that is fine.

We need Nikon to be around to provide some competition and take away from Sony. :)


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Feb 21, 2023 07:57 |  #68

Bob_A wrote in post #19483285 (external link)
Isn’t it reasonable that they would stop DSLR development? I’m certain Canon has a similar timeline.

I believe Nikon imaging is already less than 50% of their corporation.

I'm guessing Canon has already stopped dSLR development. Their last dSLR was three years ago with the Ti8 and 1DxMIII. Usually after this long between cameras, Canon Rumors is going crazy with new SLR rumors but there has been nothing except last year when they had an announcement about a closeout sale for the 1DXMKII.


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Feb 21, 2023 08:06 |  #69

Bob_A wrote in post #19483284 (external link)
Honestly I can’t see any reason for anyone invested in Nikon, Sony or Canon to switch brands. And it just keeps getting better :-)

Agreed on this point, each of the Big 3 have outstanding systems, it took a few years but Canon and Nikon have pretty much closed the gap on Sony. Now that they've established a baseline, only refinement from here on out. Great times to be a photographer!




  
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Feb 21, 2023 09:38 |  #70

dolina wrote in post #19483310 (external link)
This is the perspective from 2023 that addresses only the title of this thread. I did not consider the 1st post's message.

Canon's the #1 ILC maker that shipped >48% of all ILCs worldwide. Their RF mirrorless systems are odds on favorite to be 1 of 2 systems left standing 1-2 decades from now.

QUOTED IMAGE

Why? Because the digital camera market has shrunken down to only organizations like photo agencies, independent working photogs and enthusiasts.

Consumer market prefers iPhone or Android as their point & shoot or their Rebel.

At its all time high CIPA members shipped nearly 121.5 million units worldwide in 2010.

iPhone came out in 2007. Apple App Store & Android, as it looks today, in 2008.

I expect digital cameras to finally settle around 6-7 million from the 8 million last year.

Mirrorless being nearly 6 million. dSLR and point & shoots being ~1 million.

I highly doubt only 2 will remain in 10 years. At most we’ll see a few like OM and Pentax drop out. Maybe Panny.

In 20 years? Who knows.

I think we all know that unit sales across the board are going to keep falling for awhile longer.


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dolina
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Feb 21, 2023 10:10 |  #71

Bob_A wrote in post #19483465 (external link)
I highly doubt only 2 will remain in 10 years. At most we’ll see a few like OM and Pentax drop out. Maybe Panny.

In 20 years? Who knows.

I think we all know that unit sales across the board are going to keep falling for awhile longer.

We've seen Ricoh absorb Pentax and Minolta being bought out by Sony.

Nikon has reported some difficulties in the past (external link).

How many more years will consumers buy into nostalgia design of the Fuji X system? Although Fuji is smart by going up market with 0.79x medium format then price their bodies and lenses at par with 1-series bodies and RF L lenses. Makes me wish Canon made the RF system's image circle secretly larger for a future medium format system using RF L lenses.

Larger image sensors will always be better.

But going back I think in the long run Canon & Sony will be ~80% of the digital camera market while all other players fighting over scraps.

Leica will be impervious as their goods are inelastic. Heck I would not be surprised if the last 3 years were among their best.


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Feb 21, 2023 10:16 |  #72

dolina wrote in post #19483479 (external link)
We've seen Ricoh absorb Pentax and Minolta being bought out by Sony.

Nikon has reported some difficulties in the past (external link).

How many more years will consumers buy into nostalgia design of the Fuji X system? Although Fuji is smart by going up market with 0.79x medium format then price their bodies and lenses at par with 1-series bodies and RF L lenses. Makes me wish Canon made the RF system's image circle secretly larger for a future medium format system using RF L lenses.

Larger image sensors will always be better.

But going back I think in the long run Canon & Sony will be ~80% of the digital camera market while all other players fighting over scraps.

Leica will be impervious as their goods are inelastic. Heck I would not be surprised if the last 3 years were among their best.

I’ll buy ya lunch if you’re in my neck of the woods in 10 years if only two ILC manufacturers are left :-)


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Feb 21, 2023 10:19 |  #73

Bob_A wrote in post #19483481 (external link)
I’ll buy ya lunch if you’re in my neck of the woods in 10 years if only two ILC manufacturers are left :-)

Let's improve my odds.

~80% market share dominated by 2 brands that is possibly Canon + Sony. ;-)a


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Feb 21, 2023 11:59 |  #74

dolina wrote in post #19483482 (external link)
Let's improve my odds.

~80% market share dominated by 2 brands that is possibly Canon + Sony. ;-)a

That could happen. Funny thing, knowing how Sony has exited some product lines in the past, the two with the largest share might not include them  :p


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Feb 21, 2023 12:25 |  #75

Bob_A wrote in post #19483515 (external link)
That could happen. Funny thing, knowing how Sony has exited some product lines in the past, the two with the largest share might not include them  :p

Very unlikely. A few years back I read up that half of all smartphone cameras are from them.

That's at least a billion image sensor assemblies annually.

With money from at least a billion image sensors funds R&D for Sony's mirrorless cameras.

That's why were able to leapfrog everyone in the digital camera market.

But their ergonomics and menu system needs a lot of work.


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