-Official- 1D MK III AF Thread.

tonylong wrote in post #5335162
GBRandy,

I'm one who has tracked with sympathy your difficulties and those that others have been having with the Mk III.

At the same time, I (with some trepidation) bought one after the rework and firmware upgrade, and have so far been satisfied. When I shoot under controlled conditions (high shutter speed and good support) I get good AI Servo performance. When I'm hand-holding, panning a moving object in less-than-good-light or at slower shutter speeds, using a big lens, well, my sharp shots are more hit-or-miss, as I would expect.

Put it all together, and I'd say I'm happy with my camera, but: I did shell out money for a professional quality body, and if I learned that there was a flaw in the body I would certainly want that flaw addressed. Maybe at this point my skills/lack of skills don't show up that flaw, but that shouldn't matter. So, if a Mk IIIn demonstrates a "fix" for a flaw in the Mk III, I think that all of us Mk III owners have a vested interest, whether we have personally identified a problem with out bodies or not.

Quite so.

Mark

I have two of these beasts and a 1DsMIII as well. I also have a 1DMIIN. I think the 1DMIIN AF focuses better irrespective of what Canon keeps chanting in the hopes that we will join in, particular on the first image of a burst. But that just doesn't magically negate all the splendid improvements in the rest of the technology. The body is lighter. The batteries are lighter and more powerful. The noise is a stop or two better. Live View. Lens calibration. HTP. Extended ISO. Registration of five CWBs. Improved UI. So, I'm not giving up my 1DMIIN and agree that there's still something less than optimal about the AF, but crud guys, have some balance. There's not going to be a lawsuit even with a horde of disgruntled users ... maybe a lot of guys switching to Nikon but no Canon class action ... there's nothing actionable here. IANAL. This is not legal advice.

DwightMcCann wrote in post #5335690
I have two of these beasts and a 1DsMIII as well. I also have a 1DMIIN. I think the 1DMIIN AF focuses better irrespective of what Canon keeps chanting in the hopes that we will join in, particular on the first image of a burst. But that just doesn't magically negate all the splendid improvements in the rest of the technology. The body is lighter. The batteries are lighter and more powerful. The noise is a stop or two better. Live View. Lens calibration. HTP. Extended ISO. Registration of five CWBs. Improved UI. So, I'm not giving up my 1DMIIN and agree that there's still something less than optimal about the AF, but crud guys, have some balance. There's not going to be a lawsuit even with a horde of disgruntled users ... maybe a lot of guys switching to Nikon but no Canon class action ... there's nothing actionable here. IANAL. This is not legal advice.

Careful, Dwight. That sort of talk will get you into trouble. I made a similar statement once and got labeled 'fanboy' for my troubles.

belmondo wrote in post #5335764
Careful, Dwight. That sort of talk will get you into trouble. I made a similar statement once and got labeled 'fanboy' for my troubles.

Yeah, I've been attacked for not whining, too! You just have to remember that happiness is genetic, not environmental!

DwightMcCann wrote in post #5335690
I have two of these beasts and a 1DsMIII as well. I also have a 1DMIIN. I think the 1DMIIN AF focuses better irrespective of what Canon keeps chanting in the hopes that we will join in, particular on the first image of a burst. But that just doesn't magically negate all the splendid improvements in the rest of the technology. The body is lighter. The batteries are lighter and more powerful. The noise is a stop or two better. Live View. Lens calibration. HTP. Extended ISO. Registration of five CWBs. Improved UI. So, I'm not giving up my 1DMIIN and agree that there's still something less than optimal about the AF, but crud guys, have some balance. There's not going to be a lawsuit even with a horde of disgruntled users ... maybe a lot of guys switching to Nikon but no Canon class action ... there's nothing actionable here. IANAL. This is not legal advice.

Dwight,

i agree with you 100% on everything and i have said it before myself: the mkIII is an outstanding body and even as is, the positive FAR outweighs the negatives.

however, i do think that you are failing to understand why some users are so upset. for some buyers, $4500 is tons of money and not everybody has the luxury of having 5 bodies and simply switching back and forth. for some people, buying this camera took a lot of work and all people want in return is to get what canon promised. nobody likes to buy something that is not as good as the item that it replaced and even though the mkIII is better than the mkIIn in about 99% of the situation, you have to keep in mind that the 1% is exactly what made the 1 series what it is.

i don't think that you will find anybody here (yes, even in this long thread) that said that the mkIII is not an amazing camera that can wipe the floor with the mkIIn in 99% of the situations. in fact, even all the people that have been VERY vocal from the get go are all saying that they WISH that Canon will fix the camera BECAUSE it is the best body that they have ever used. i had a pleasure of owning a mkIII that wiped the floor with my mkIIn in the AF department which is exactly the reason why i am so freaking pissed at Canon. IF the mkIII works as it should, there isn't a body on the market that can even touch it in my opinion (well maybe 1 or 2 can compete).

i think that now what we are seeing is the real damage. the real damage is not a camera that can't focus but a camera that you can't trust. i talked to quite a few great shooters in here and pretty much we all said the same thing. even if our cameras work as it should, we still find ourselves questioning every single OOF shot or every single hiccup that would have been perfectly normal in any other body. now i agree with you that this is simply idiotic to do but that is the human nature and i have no problem admitting that this is what happened to me. the mental games are much worse for me than the actual AF issues and i believe that i am not alone on this. to be honest, i think that the only way that this will go away for me is with a brand new camera. there have been simply too many fixes that didn't quite work for me to be comfortable.

of course, that is just me and what works for me. i know many shooters with a mkIII that are thrilled every single time they shoot with the camera and they have amazing results to show for it.

Blonde, I don't disagree with anything you've said. I just think that it is amazingly childish, self centered, egotistical, immature and impolite for the same guys to keep harping incessantly about their upset in this thread. They should start a "Cruel World, the 1DMIII Isn't What I Had My Heart Set On!" thread. At this point it doesn't matter to me how justified they are ... they are abusing everyone else who is trying to use these forums as intended. They were NOT intended for months and months of whining and the moderators tried to stop it repeatedly, but these guys are so into the ME, ME, ME, Look at poor ME mentality that they just don't care about anyone else. IIRC there is a saying that you shouldn't complain to anyone who can't do anything about your problem ... well, these guys should take a lesson.

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #5287669
I don't know if there is anything we can do,.. other than to allow people with issues to post these issues and NOT try to silence them for having a different viewpoint or a bad camera.

This insistence on trying to force those with issues into silence via bullying them repeatedly will serve no one.

Canon does read this and other forums, and if people are not able to show there issues without being hammered by the peanut gallery, they may stop reporting there issues, and Canon may then have no reason to continue to search for solutions.

I said this the first time in June of '07, and several times since.

It's the people that are "**** and moaning and whining and complaining " that are going to get Canon to act on this, and these people are all doing us a service by continuing to put themselves out on a limb, and expose themselves to others ridicule and attack. These are the same complaints that have gotten Canon's ear and helped to bring about the efforts thus far.

I think this can be construed as the semi-official policy here.

I only question whether or not there will be anything of value for the members to find in this thread. Nothing new is being posted. The cumulative affects of people saying the same things over and over is apparently for Canon's benefit only, and this thread has effectively been transformed into a sort of petition for the airing of grievances.

Well, I disagree with CDS ... Canon could care less about POTNers whining. They are looking at the big time Pros who are starting to abandon them. Any solution will be addressed to big organizations that buy a huge amount of equipment and influence others like myself. Those guys may get vouchers for upgrades but we won't. Using "influence Canon" as a justification to abuse everyone else is simply self serving poppycock. For myself, I am done with this thread. It is useless and a blight on POTN.

I posted the link to RG's site as it seemed good information for the Mark III buyers and prospective buyers. After that it's been some opinions, some ah-hahs, and that's it. But that's the nature of a public forum.
I keep on checking back on this post to keep up to date, if I see that post that references a Canon letter or a post on RG's site that says the Mark III is all good to go in all situations then I'm off to B&H and buying one, instantly.

DwightMcCann wrote in post #5337025
Blonde, I don't disagree with anything you've said. I just think that it is amazingly childish, self centered, egotistical, immature and impolite for the same guys to keep harping incessantly about their upset in this thread. They should start a "Cruel World, the 1DMIII Isn't What I Had My Heart Set On!" thread. At this point it doesn't matter to me how justified they are ... they are abusing everyone else who is trying to use these forums as intended. They were NOT intended for months and months of whining and the moderators tried to stop it repeatedly, but these guys are so into the ME, ME, ME, Look at poor ME mentality that they just don't care about anyone else. IIRC there is a saying that you shouldn't complain to anyone who can't do anything about your problem ... well, these guys should take a lesson.

Dwight,

i don't disagree with anything you've said. i just don't understand why all the guys that are thrilled with their body are hanging out in a thread about AF problems jumping on people that complain about their camera

i am only kidding of course, i do see your point about the constant complaints. however, i can tell you that your idea for the new thread is not going to work and will be locked VERY quickly...

DwightMcCann wrote in post #5337183
Well, I disagree with CDS ... Canon could care less about POTNers whining. They are looking at the big time Pros who are starting to abandon them. Any solution will be addressed to big organizations that buy a huge amount of equipment and influence others like myself. Those guys may get vouchers for upgrades but we won't. Using "influence Canon" as a justification to abuse everyone else is simply self serving poppycock. For myself, I am done with this thread. It is useless and a blight on POTN.

You're making the thread what it is though. Opinionated comments creating the mud.

Here's a fact that I'm taking from RG's site. Recently the Mark III failed in a low contrast, flat, warm day etc. etc. Well for me, the most money I've earned is from soccer pictures. I live in Washington which has it's days full of flat and low contrast. All the new features in the world won't make a non-AFing camera worth two sh*ts. Does it keep me away as much as I want one? Hell yes it does. On the other hand, you're probably more than happy with it considering what you shoot, and that's completely ok! Just don't knock those that are having issues because they are real.

Do I keep checking to see if there's an all clear? Of course. I need piece of mind in spending 4000 dollars.

GBRandy wrote in post #5334780
Nothing personal, just using your words as representative of many others....but if you are quite happy and the upgrade was 100% worth it, why would you stand in line to file a class action suit?

An interesting twist / turn about if you think about it. The same collection of people who claim the MKIII is perfect in every way would now be in line to sue Canon if they released a revision that fixed the problems they never had?

Jon hit the nail on the head.

Randy, I have never, not once, said/stated/claimed/af​firmed or otherwise implied that all 1DMkIII bodies are OK. I've never even claimed my particular MkIII is flawless, only that I'm very happy with it.

I have followed several long threads (here, FM and god help me even DPR) with input from well respected shooters who have had issues with the 1DMkIII. There are dozens of people with chronic problems, even more damning (IMHO) is the apparent lack of total adoption by various media.

I have no doubt that there is some percentage of 1DMkIII bodies that are defective, and in fact appear almost irreparable despite multiple trips to both service facilities. These are the people ripe for a class action, and with lawyers more prolific than fleas on a junkyard dog its almost a foregone conclusion. I'm actually surprised it hasn't happened already, but an early release (less than 18 months) of a 1DMkIIIn with no sign of similar issues would certainly be the impetus to force the issue.

I also have no doubt that some larger percentage is user error or unrealistic expectations.

I don't get 90%+ images in focus using AI Servo with my MkIII (50% seems about average).

Does that mean my MkIII is defective?

Would it change your opinion if I said my keeper rate with my 20D was below 30% and that I don't shoot in AI Servo with any regularity?

As to your question/insinuation..​. I would indeed "be in the line" if there was independent "proof" that there is a systemic problem with every 1DMkIII produced.

But short of that or a way to positively identify the "lemons" I'll steer clear of the lawyers, interacting with them is so very rarely rewarding.

All I have to say is..........103 pages.....mostly complaints............​.yea great camera.

This has got to be some kinda of record.


"Yes it is......the most customers we have pissed off at once" -Canon


Had one......you can keep it...........now carry on.....

belmondo wrote in post #5335764
Careful, Dwight. That sort of talk will get you into trouble. I made a similar statement once and got labeled 'fanboy' for my troubles.

Lol, you have an elephant's memory my friend. I did apologize, sort of, and have come full circle with all of the controversy by simply staying out of the arguments. tat is a big deal for me to have patience. I still have my return slip to send it in and have delayed sending it in, as my warranty will be extended from the date of repair, giving me ,maybe an extra nine months or so of extra warranty time. But I am only delaying in hopes they get better at the repair center and I am not very active lately in shooting.

I still plan on coming down belmondo. Probably within the next four weeks. I can let you have a go at my camera to test it and see how it compared to yours, if you wish.

I am looking very seriously at the condos adjacent to the Palmer private golf course in La Quinta. I'd like to have one that cold be rented out part of the season.

Peace

Joe

blonde wrote in post #5336939
Dwight,

i agree with you 100% on everything and i have said it before myself: the mkIII is an outstanding body and even as is, the positive FAR outweighs the negatives.

however, i do think that you are failing to understand why some users are so upset. for some buyers, $4500 is tons of money and not everybody has the luxury of having 5 bodies and simply switching back and forth. for some people, buying this camera took a lot of work and all people want in return is to get what canon promised. nobody likes to buy something that is not as good as the item that it replaced and even though the mkIII is better than the mkIIn in about 99% of the situation, you have to keep in mind that the 1% is exactly what made the 1 series what it is.

i don't think that you will find anybody here (yes, even in this long thread) that said that the mkIII is not an amazing camera that can wipe the floor with the mkIIn in 99% of the situations. in fact, even all the people that have been VERY vocal from the get go are all saying that they WISH that Canon will fix the camera BECAUSE it is the best body that they have ever used. i had a pleasure of owning a mkIII that wiped the floor with my mkIIn in the AF department which is exactly the reason why i am so freaking pissed at Canon. IF the mkIII works as it should, there isn't a body on the market that can even touch it in my opinion (well maybe 1 or 2 can compete).

i think that now what we are seeing is the real damage. the real damage is not a camera that can't focus but a camera that you can't trust. i talked to quite a few great shooters in here and pretty much we all said the same thing. even if our cameras work as it should, we still find ourselves questioning every single OOF shot or every single hiccup that would have been perfectly normal in any other body. now i agree with you that this is simply idiotic to do but that is the human nature and i have no problem admitting that this is what happened to me. the mental games are much worse for me than the actual AF issues and i believe that i am not alone on this. to be honest, i think that the only way that this will go away for me is with a brand new camera. there have been simply too many fixes that didn't quite work for me to be comfortable.

of course, that is just me and what works for me. i know many shooters with a mkIII that are thrilled every single time they shoot with the camera and they have amazing results to show for it.

Blonde,

I agree with everything you say. For me this camera has been a sharp learning curve, and if truth be told I am not sufficiently adept in the skill dept. None the less this camera represented a once in a lifetime purchase for me given the cost, and I must admit I was deeply upset at the amount of grief it has caused me. I do understand your point about doubting mentally, but by the same token I still believe there are underperforming MK3 cameras out there that are still giving their owners grief, and we should all recognise that fact and not lambast them as moaners or whingers.

Finally I wioll say I wish I had half of your skill - but am working on it. I am going to sticlk with my current blue dot body, and keep taking pictures trying less to worry about the ones i miss for whatever reason. This cam has in my view tremendous potential.

Mark