New shoot

Im practicing while trying to teach my daughter to model for me... let me know what is good and what needs work. Found an abandoned bridge in the middle of nowhere.

HTTP response: NOT FOUND | MIME changed to 'image/png'

IMAGE LINK: http://imageshack.us

I would suggest reading up on composition and posing.

The third pose looks pretty good to me, the only thing is it looks like her right arm is missing. You can't even see her hand behind her, so it appears her arm is just gone. Probably reposition that arm in the future,, but the pose/expression is nice. I would recommend looking into a book from http://www.amherstmedi​a.com/ on posing. You can find used ones on Amazon.com for about half the price of new and it'd give you both a good reference point to work with.

That third shot would also be awesome in late-afternoon or on a cloudy day, as the bright sunlight really washes out the background in this shot. Keep it up though, as this is how we all learn.

lulugus wrote in post #6148649
I would suggest reading up on composition and posing.

and lighting...

Cheers,

Ok... so the pose, the lighting and the composition are bad.

Well I guess I'll trash the posing guide I was using.

Got anything more concrete for me to work on? I have numerous books and have read a lot, but most I read deals with studio lighting - not outdoors.

Thanks,
David

A good easy way to use a flash outdoors is to manually expose for the background and then use E-TTL for fill flash. It is not easy to tell you how to pose your model. Have a look at posted examples from other members on this forum and you will see what poses work best. My way on inexperienced models is to let the model try a whole range of poses some suggested by me and some of her own, shoot a lot and you should be able to get a few keepers. Beware of a busy background, it will distract from your subject.

Best lighting is at the 'crack of dawn' for outdoor lighting. Also on the composition, imho your subject is too centered in the majority of the pictures which can be cropped. Also if you are shooting in RAW you can fix a lot of your exposure problems.

I notice a couple things: You're shooting with a 30mm lens from a ways away, which (even at f/2.5) leaves you with a long depth of field, making the background distracting. If you have a telephoto lens, try using that and standing further back. Depth of field is based on three things (primarily): Focal length (Longer = less DoF), distance to subject (Shorter = less DoF), and aperture (Wider = less DoF). Try a telephoto lens from further away, if you have one. Your daughter is also right in the middle of each frame:

1. Picture the first shot with all of your daughter in the frame, with more space to her right (so she's centered vertically but in the left-third of the image). She'd be looking into the frame, making for a stronger shot.
2. Picture the second one composed the same way you composed the first -- as a portrait with her looking up into "something" instead of looking at the border of the picture.
3. The third shot is actually very good, but might look better with a longer focal length (giving you more background blur, isolating her). It's a good shot as-is though.

Try adding more of the frame in the direction her eyes are pointing, and see if that doesn't make for some more compelling shots. Also try moving closer with your 30mm lens, or using an 85mm+ lens with a wide aperture if you're shooting with a "busy" background.

DavidMLevine wrote in post #6153179
Ok... so the pose, the lighting and the composition are bad.

Well I guess I'll trash the posing guide I was using.

Got anything more concrete for me to work on? I have numerous books and have read a lot, but most I read deals with studio lighting - not outdoors.

Thanks,
David

Let me see if I can help any further. . . In the first shot, your daughter looks awkward. While Awkward poses have their place in fashion, in this case it doesn't express anything. I personally would like it more if she had perhaps cut her eyes over at you, maybe turned her face a little more towards the camera, something along those lines. Always step back and take in how she looks to you, such as what impression is she giving you with her pose. If it's awkward or uncomfortable, then look at what it is that bothers you about the pose and try coaching her til she's posed in a way that looks pleasing to you. Posing guides are great, but it's up to the model to make them a success. And not every pose is for every model either, once again, posing is to enhance or highlight their key features and take away from ones that aren't so great. For instance, if a subject has a big nose, you wouldn't pose them at a profile angle, as that'd make it stand out more and they'll never like them.

There's too much space in the top of that photo as well, perhaps crop it to an 8x10 format or so.

The second one is hard to tell what the meaning of the pose is. It looks like she's either begging or looking up to God. The bars behind her are distracting to the photo, as they draw your eye away from her. Composition is about using elements to draw your eye to your subject and not away from it. Look at your photos and always ask yourself if that's what you see or if your drawn away by a distraction in the photo. The lighting in this photo does not add to the mood or help create it. It confuses the viewer.

The last one really isn't that bad, other than the harsh sunlight on the background and spilling onto her. Then the missing arm, but the pose is otherwise very good and she has a great expression on her face. You could've shifted slightly to your left to even up the railing in relation to your subject, but the composition isn't bad, just could use some minor adjustments. I'd say it's acceptable composition though.

In terms of lighting, I personally will do everything I can to NOT fire a flash outdoors. This is my personal taste, but very very few photographers can fire a direct-on flash and make it look really good. You almost always want to separate the flash from the camera, which works really great, but was always too much of a hassle for me, so I just do without. If you really want to learn how to use the flash outdoor mounted on camera, then practice and learn how to make it work as a fill light and make sure it doesn't become the key light. If you balance it to where the flash works as a fill light, filling in shadows, but not overpowering the key light (which would be ambient light), then you can achieve some really nice results. I never took the time to learn this, so I can't offer you much advise. I just bought faster lenses so I can shoot in lower light without it. But direct flash really flattens the image and hardly ever makes for a pleasing image unless it compliments the mood of the photo.

Learn to "see" light. In other words, pay attention to the lighting on your subject and how it effects the mood of your shot. I learned by looking at photos on this forum and then seeing how they lit the subject. Unless they do a lot of PP to it or use more than two lights to light the shot, I can usually tell how they lit the shot and about where the lights were positioned. It's just a matter of light angles. This will help you when you are going for a particular look and feel to a shot and you will know where to start when configuring your lighting for the shot.

Outdoor lighting can be tough and it really depends on what you're trying to achieve in an image as to when the best time to shoot is. The softer light, when the light is below the horizion or behind clouds, generally works better for portraits. Direct sunlight works great for high-contrast shots, but I personally have a hard time keeping my exposure under control as it's easy to blow out your shadow detail while trying to not blow out your highlights. The LCD screen is difficult to see in this condition as well, so I try avoiding it unless I've got something in particular in mind requiring this light.

Most importantly, don't get discouraged. Just a couple of years ago I shot photos that resembled what you shot. We've all been there, minus a few naturally born talented photographers. The key is keep trying and learning and you'll see your photos evolve over time. It takes time and there's no short cuts that I know of, just experience and a lot of trial and error. These forums are one of the best ways to get feedback and to get pointers on what you should change or could do different next time. With this feedback and an eagerness to learn, you'll get to where you're going eventually. I hope this helps, as it's just my opinion for what it's worth.

imchilindave - wow.

It's posters like you that give me renewed hope in this forum. You really took your time to explain issues in detail and almost give a mini-photography class for the OP.

My hat's off to you, sir.

I do appreciate the help. This helps much more than the canned "looks great" answer I see all too often. I did take a bunch of different shots using both the 30 prime and a kit zoom lens. I did not want to post 30 pics and try to ask for criticism. My issues are probably consistant throughout the series so these 3 will do.

I am practicing and will post again next time with better results.

One other question - How much harder is it to do male shots? I am going to try to do shots of my son, but am a little intimidated by it. He is a good looking boy, but for some reason I have reservations. Either way I will go for it.

Thanks,
David

lulugus wrote in post #6154029
imchilindave - wow.

It's posters like you that give me renewed hope in this forum. You really took your time to explain issues in detail and almost give a mini-photography class for the OP.

My hat's off to you, sir.

You're welcome and no problem. You won't see many posts like that because it's very time consuming explaining all of that and most of us want to check out several other posts, which would take us all day to leave feedback like that on every shot. I sensed him getting dis-hearted about it and understand his frustration, so I decided to offer what little I have to offer for what it's worth.

DavidMLevine wrote in post #6155792
I do appreciate the help. This helps much more than the canned "looks great" answer I see all too often. I did take a bunch of different shots using both the 30 prime and a kit zoom lens. I did not want to post 30 pics and try to ask for criticism. My issues are probably consistant throughout the series so these 3 will do.

I am practicing and will post again next time with better results.

One other question - How much harder is it to do male shots? I am going to try to do shots of my son, but am a little intimidated by it. He is a good looking boy, but for some reason I have reservations. Either way I will go for it.

Thanks,
David

As mentioned above, it's a tendency to go through and leave "I like" remarks on the ones you like and to be nice and not say anything for the sake of not hurting someone's feelings on the ones you're not big on. Some people tend to be sensitive to critique, so no one wants to hurt anyone's feelings. I personally love critique, even if I think it's a great shot, as this is how I learn and know what other things to take in consideration the next time I'm shooting in a similar situation. But some post stuff to show it off and get offended when someone has something negative to say about their shot they're so proud of.
I'm just glad I was able to help.

Some quick post processing and cropping:

HTTP response: 504 | MIME changed to 'text/html'

HTTP response: 504 | MIME changed to 'text/html'

IMAGE LINK: http://imageshack.us

The only shot with some potential here is the 3rd one. The others just come of as snapshots.

Actually I'd disagree, I think #1 looks a thousand times better with the lighting adjustment and crop.

Personally, I don't think they are coming off as snapshots in the sense that you just started taking pix without any thought... I think you are just new and practicing. To me that's different.

My original feelings about #2 and #3 remain... #2 is just odd to me. The pose might work in a more artsy way... like I'm picturing a totally black background with something that resembles a "heavenly spotlight" shining down on her. But to put her kneeling this way on dirty concrete with rusty bars behind her, seems out of place. (Plus the gaussian blur around her on the ground looks unnatural.)

#3 Is unnaturally posed. She looks annoyed and bored, and the depth of field is showing way too much detail behind her. Also, the flash hit her pretty hard which makes her washed out.

I'd experiment more with the angles of the bridge/roadway and her that you've shown in #1. Maybe try to get her feet to show just a bit more if she's in that same position... maybe bring her right arm in front of her or up on her hip so that it's not just missing... that kind of thing. Play around a bit and see what you come up with. For me, I take like 200 pix and about 10 come out well. So keep on truckin', as they say