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Thread started 02 Sep 2009 (Wednesday) 09:48
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Is a 20D any better than a 400D?

 
mountbatten
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Sep 03, 2009 15:16 |  #16

Still using my 20d and loving every moment of it check my photos here i prefer to spend more money on lenses than bodies might buy an ff one day anyway here is a link to some of my photos witha 20d enjoy
The price you where offered seems reasonable if all is in good working order

http://www.pbase.com/g​reatescape (external link)


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http://www.flickr.com/​photos/38017531@N07/ (external link)
Canon 70d, 20d Gripped, 17-40mmf4, 50mmf1.4, 70-200mmf2.8, 100mmf2.8 L IS Macro, 580ex, Sigma 150-600mm C, Genesis200 2 strobe kit.

  
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BTNorris
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Sep 04, 2009 01:15 as a reply to  @ mountbatten's post |  #17

Not to get personal, but say you get a 20d now: does your wife understand the need for a used 50d (or 7d, or ...) next [whenever]? I still love my 20d, but am wondering if you'll feel like you had enough of an upgrade.

You'll gain the ergonomics, 1/250 flash sync (vs. 1/200), etc.
You'll lose IR wireless remote, dust removal.

Which probably means it comes down to the ergo - just like most here have said.

Grip: I really wish I would have gotten one. I keep planning to upgrade; so I keep planning a grip for my NEXT camera. But the 20d just keeps treating me well...

So: Is this the camera you want to have for the length of time you'll likely keep it? If so, you'll likely be happy.


7D, 17-55, 50 1.4, 70-200, 10-22, Kenko Tubes, OPTIX xr, Einstein

  
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prinspaul
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Sep 04, 2009 05:12 |  #18

Terry_Hill wrote in post #8571203 (external link)
Thanks for the comments. I currently use a grip with my 400d which makes it way more comfortable to hold (and I really like the second set of shutter buttons for portrait) but I'm wondering if I'll need one on the 20D?

You DO need one if you prefer the 2nd shutter button for portraits...
but I agree, the only differens is about ergonomics...that's why I prefer xxD bodies over xxxD bodies. the IQ will be the same I guess.




  
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DStanic
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Sep 04, 2009 06:32 |  #19

The 20d and 30D (which share the same IQ and most features) are both great cameras but there is really no difference in IQ from the 400D. I know, I have both. I shoot with both at the same time sometimes. I love my 30D alot more, I dunno about the 20D.. they have such small LCD screens. I have not had any dust issues with my 400D but with my 30D I was required to buy a rocket blower to remove dust.

I would only buy the 20D if you want a second/backup camera (which is great if you want to shoot weddings). Otherwise keep what you got an upgrade to something newer down the road.


Sony A6000, 16-50PZ, 55-210, 35mm 1.8 OSS
Canon 60D, 30D
Tamron 28-75 2.8, Tamron 17-35, Sigma 50mm 1.4, Canon 85mm 1.8

  
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Terry_Hill
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Sep 07, 2009 08:11 |  #20

It looks like I'll be giving it a miss.....

I've had it over the week end and shot various bits and pieces with it nothing major but quick shots of my niece and nephews at the beach and some building pictures for work.

On the plus side the controls are far nicer and more intuitive, so much quicker to adjust various settings with the 2 jog wheels and the selection buttons placed up near the shutter button. The general feel of it is far nicer as well with it being a good size and weight in my hand.

On the down side the write speed seems very slow compared to the 400d this includes the image appearing on the rear lcd (which I didn't think would bug me but trying to check things are sharp on the small screen seems more difficult. The files aren't any larger so I'm guessing that it is just because it has a smaller buffer.

I also think it will not be long before I am looking to get what I don't like about it sorted by buying a 30 or 40d which would alo give me spot metering etc. with the larger screen and bigger buffers.

Thanks for all your comments.


"Skill in photography is acquired by practice and not by purchase" Percy W Harris

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MichaelBernard
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Sep 07, 2009 08:27 |  #21
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Terry_Hill wrote in post #8598185 (external link)
It looks like I'll be giving it a miss.....

I've had it over the week end and shot various bits and pieces with it nothing major but quick shots of my niece and nephews at the beach and some building pictures for work.

On the plus side the controls are far nicer and more intuitive, so much quicker to adjust various settings with the 2 jog wheels and the selection buttons placed up near the shutter button. The general feel of it is far nicer as well with it being a good size and weight in my hand.

On the down side the write speed seems very slow compared to the 400d this includes the image appearing on the rear lcd (which I didn't think would bug me but trying to check things are sharp on the small screen seems more difficult. The files aren't any larger so I'm guessing that it is just because it has a smaller buffer.

I also think it will not be long before I am looking to get what I don't like about it sorted by buying a 30 or 40d which would alo give me spot metering etc. with the larger screen and bigger buffers.

Thanks for all your comments.

All I hear are reasons to become better. I've personally been trying to train myself to not rely on the rear LCD or write speed (1dinosaurS speed FTL) but I can understand the 20d screen being frustrating. It was my biggest gripe with the rig. Honestly just set up your shots, pay attention to the meter, and shoot.


http://www.Michael-Bernard.com (external link)"I think that there will be people disappointed in any camera short of the one that summons the ghost of Ansel Adams to come and press the shutter button for them." -lazer-jock

  
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Player9
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Sep 07, 2009 08:55 as a reply to  @ MichaelBernard's post |  #22

Except for sports shooting, I would recommend that you stick with the 400D/Xti. The ergonomics argument is a wash; plenty of folks want the xxxD cameras because they are smaller and lighter, others must have the xxD cameras because they are larger and heavier. I will say that the 400D/Xti is noticeably less comfortable to hold than the 500D/T1i, which has the best feel of any of the Rebels.


60D, EF-S 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5, EF-S 18-135mm 3.5-5.6 IS, EF-S 55-250mm f/4-5.6 IS, Tamron 17-50mm f/2.8, EF 28mm f/1.8, EF 50mm f/1.8, EF-S 60mm f/2.8 macro, EF 85mm f/1.8, 430ex, 220ex, Alien Bee B400 (2), Alien Bee B800 (2)

  
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MichaelBernard
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Sep 07, 2009 09:19 |  #23
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Player9 wrote in post #8598327 (external link)
Except for sports shooting, I would recommend that you stick with the 400D/Xti. The ergonomics argument is a wash; plenty of folks want the xxxD cameras because they are smaller and lighter, others must have the xxD cameras because they are larger and heavier. I will say that the 400D/Xti is noticeably less comfortable to hold than the 500D/T1i, which has the best feel of any of the Rebels.

The ergonomics argument is a wash? Really? I dunno I kinda gathered this from your post:

1) you have small hands, have never shot with an XXd body, and or are a woman.

2) You didn't read this:

Terry_Hill wrote in post #8598185 (external link)
On the plus side the controls are far nicer and more intuitive, so much quicker to adjust various settings with the 2 jog wheels and the selection buttons placed up near the shutter button. The general feel of it is far nicer as well with it being a good size and weight in my hand.

Most people that have a chance to shoot with a xxd body say right away that the body feels better, changes are made faster, and generally the body is superior.


http://www.Michael-Bernard.com (external link)"I think that there will be people disappointed in any camera short of the one that summons the ghost of Ansel Adams to come and press the shutter button for them." -lazer-jock

  
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photomom2one
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Sep 07, 2009 15:18 |  #24

AudibleSilence wrote in post #8598422 (external link)
The ergonomics argument is a wash? Really? I dunno I kinda gathered this from your post:

1) you have small hands, have never shot with an XXd body, and or are a woman.

2) You didn't read this:



Most people that have a chance to shoot with a xxd body say right away that the body feels better, changes are made faster, and generally the body is superior.


I have to agree with that statement 100%!

I've been shooting with an XTI for a year now. Lately as I'm working more with manual controls and selecting focal points myself I am finding it very awkward.

This past Saturday I got to hold a 50D. Oh it was like a dream. Even tho the camera is much bigger than the XTI, it fit my hand (and I have small hands) like a glove and felt so much more balanced. I could see that it would be a real joy to shoot with. I"m sure I'd have less hand and shoulder strain holding something that fit so comfortably in my hand. I get cramps in my palm sometimes from trying to hold the camera and change settings while I'm looking through the eyepiece.


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50mm 1.8, 85mm 1.8, Sears 135mm 2.8
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DStanic
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Sep 07, 2009 22:15 |  #25

photomom2one wrote in post #8600147 (external link)
I have to agree with that statement 100%!

I've been shooting with an XTI for a year now. Lately as I'm working more with manual controls and selecting focal points myself I am finding it very awkward.

This past Saturday I got to hold a 50D. Oh it was like a dream. Even tho the camera is much bigger than the XTI, it fit my hand (and I have small hands) like a glove and felt so much more balanced. I could see that it would be a real joy to shoot with. I"m sure I'd have less hand and shoulder strain holding something that fit so comfortably in my hand. I get cramps in my palm sometimes from trying to hold the camera and change settings while I'm looking through the eyepiece.

That's the thing. I'm just an average guy (5 foot 8) with average hands, and the 30D feels good without a grip. Yes, eventually i would like to buy one for shooting portrait, but I like how "small" it is compared to my Rebel w/grip. I can't shoot the Rebel without the grip, it's just too small nothing to hold on to!


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Terry_Hill
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Sep 08, 2009 07:26 |  #26

AudibleSilence wrote in post #8598247 (external link)
All I hear are reasons to become better.....

Thats pretty much why I'm sticking with what I have.

In the future when I think the 400d is holding me back (in as much as I want a feature or need the ability to make quicker changes) I'll know it's time to change and I will go for one of the newer XXD bodies and jump to a level with Spot metering etc. to open up new avenues of learning as well as get the nicer control system.

As for the grip I'm 6'3" and even though I have small hands for my size you can see why the grip was one of my first purchases for the 400d! I think I would probably get one for my next body as well (or just save really hard and go straight for a 1D series!) what ever that may be.


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MichaelBernard
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Sep 08, 2009 08:48 |  #27
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Terry,

I saw a 30d for $400 this morning. I think you should move up to a 30d and keep the XTi as a back up. The wheel vs. button speed difference is going to help you in the long run. I applaud you for not upgrading JUST 'CAUSE :D It shows a mature approach to this that most do not have. The XTi is a fine camera, my only concern here is speed/handling for you. Outside of that you are fine with what you have.

Keep up the awesome progress :)


http://www.Michael-Bernard.com (external link)"I think that there will be people disappointed in any camera short of the one that summons the ghost of Ansel Adams to come and press the shutter button for them." -lazer-jock

  
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DStanic
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Sep 08, 2009 11:56 |  #28

AudibleSilence wrote in post #8604503 (external link)
Terry,

I saw a 30d for $400 this morning. I think you should move up to a 30d and keep the XTi as a back up. The wheel vs. button speed difference is going to help you in the long run. I applaud you for not upgrading JUST 'CAUSE :D It shows a mature approach to this that most do not have. The XTi is a fine camera, my only concern here is speed/handling for you. Outside of that you are fine with what you have.

Keep up the awesome progress :)

The 30d is a fine camera. I can't really tell any difference in IQ between it and the Xti. I still carry my XTi in my "small" bag for taking wherever.. and use it as a second camera during weddings and such. :)

The multi-dial on the 30D is great, I actually change AF points alot now instead of just focusing and recomposing on the XTi. Much faster to change the settings..


Sony A6000, 16-50PZ, 55-210, 35mm 1.8 OSS
Canon 60D, 30D
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shannyD
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Sep 08, 2009 12:02 |  #29

Terry_Hill wrote in post #8571203 (external link)
Thanks for the comments. I currently use a grip with my 400d which makes it way more comfortable to hold (and I really like the second set of shutter buttons for portrait) but I'm wondering if I'll need one on the 20D?

on the 400d i needed a grip.. for a girl.. i have big hands.

i did upgrade to a 50d< and dont need a grip.. i think the grip would actually be too much for me.




  
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JPM ­ Photography
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Sep 08, 2009 16:12 |  #30

250 British pounds = 412.77500 U.S. dollars
if I am correct on this calculation and the assumption that you were talking about 250 pounds, then this is a really high price....
http://www.keh.com …CC=2&CCC=1&BCL=​&GBC=&GCC= (external link)
look here, this one is only 379 plus shipping. Now I know this is in the US and I have no idea if camera gear is more expensive in UK or anything, I am just thinking out loud :D


60D gripped, T2i gripped, Tokina 12-24 f/4, Pentax SMC 50 f/1.4, Nikon Standard Speed Set: 24, 35, 85, 105, 135, 180, Canon 580ex, Calumet Genesis 200
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Is a 20D any better than a 400D?
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