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Thread started 17 Feb 2010 (Wednesday) 08:29
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what would you give for a 500$ wedding job?

 
Cotmweasel
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Feb 19, 2010 02:05 |  #31

Honestly I would only do a $500 wedding for a friend (and at that rate it would be VERY basic). everyone else would be much higher. though to be fair I ALWAYS use a 2nd shooter and will give them half (I only use people I know are as good as I am at the photo taking, and will listen to my instructions.) But if you're needing more experience it's better then doing one for free (which I get WAY too many requests for :p ). Also, your photos are pretty good :)


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S30L28
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Feb 19, 2010 04:43 |  #32

Chris wrote in post #9626668 (external link)
Your work looks much better than a $500 job. You have a great eye. And your processing is very good. Selling a wedding for $500 with your skill would be like a freebie.

+1

I shot as a second photographer with my first wedding and I was compensated $400.


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Zansho
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Feb 19, 2010 09:39 |  #33

Probably a couple of hours of shooting time, basic editing (white balance, cropping), and four 5x7's of their choice, and online gallery where they can purchase more if they're so inclined.

I won't provide a DVD/CD at that price, nor an album or photoshop retouching.


http://www.michaeljsam​aripa.com (external link) creating beautiful images for myself, my clients, and the world. Shooting with a mix of Canon, Fuji, and Sony.

  
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The ­ Mack
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Feb 19, 2010 10:39 |  #34

S30L28 wrote in post #9638667 (external link)
+1

I shot as a second photographer with my first wedding and I was compensated $400.

+1

I'll be helping a friend in October, $400 for a few hours.


...http://ericmackblog.co​m (external link)

  
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bigarchi
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Feb 19, 2010 12:10 as a reply to  @ The Mack's post |  #35

i'd do 4 hours of coverage. and wouldn't do it on a saturday during the wedding season unless like others said, last minute and didn't have anything else booked. but hopefully next season I wouldn't even do that much for that little. fingers crossed that this will be a decent portfolio building year for me :)


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Tarzanman
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Feb 19, 2010 13:01 |  #36

$500 isn't horrible if you can spend 100% of your time taking photos at the wedding and just turn over a memory card when you're finished shooting.

If the b&g are that strapped for cash, it is way for them to still eventually get the photos when they have enough cash to pay for someone to do post work/color balancing on them.

I'd say 4 hours of shooting photos, you giving them their images and walking off to enjoy the rest of your day.




  
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CanonGolfer
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Feb 19, 2010 13:15 |  #37

No offense to anyone but it sounds like some of you feel you are "too good" for a nice $500 wedding. I understand that expenses are expenses but to say to a cash strapped couple "I will give you 2 hours (at most), no CD (which last time I checked cost about 1 cent) and you still have to buy photos" doesn't seem like you are in it to help capture peoples special moments. Yes you still have to pay bills, rent, food and what not but is $500 one day worth more than $0 the next?

Assuming you do 4 hours of wedding shots, minimal PP and put them onto a CD, you are still averaging over $100 per hr for that job. How many other jobs that are fun, that don't involve being a professional athlete, can you make $100hr+ in this economy?


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sapearl
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Feb 19, 2010 13:24 |  #38

So, just shoot all JPG, no WB, exposure, shadow, highlight, etc. adjustment at all, burn straight to disk and hand it them?

I agree with Canon that work is work and that the pay rate is pretty decent at that. But if I spend an entire day, travel, taxes, overhead, wear and tear, etc. for a job, I will also spend another several hours at home editing, processing those images. I am not retouching them - but shooting RAW, there's necessary time for what goes into that part of the photofinishing.

But bottom line is - what's it worth to spend that time away from my family? I love the work, but I will work according to how I value my time, talent and ability.

Tarzanman wrote in post #9640779 (external link)
$500 isn't horrible if you can spend 100% of your time taking photos at the wedding and just turn over a memory card when you're finished shooting.

If the b&g are that strapped for cash, it is way for them to still eventually get the photos when they have enough cash to pay for someone to do post work/color balancing on them.

I'd say 4 hours of shooting photos, you giving them their images and walking off to enjoy the rest of your day.


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Jimconnerphoto
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Feb 19, 2010 13:39 |  #39

CanonGolfer wrote in post #9640882 (external link)
No offense to anyone but it sounds like some of you feel you are "too good" for a nice $500 wedding. I understand that expenses are expenses but to say to a cash strapped couple "I will give you 2 hours (at most), no CD (which last time I checked cost about 1 cent) and you still have to buy photos" doesn't seem like you are in it to help capture peoples special moments. Yes you still have to pay bills, rent, food and what not but is $500 one day worth more than $0 the next?

Assuming you do 4 hours of wedding shots, minimal PP and put them onto a CD, you are still averaging over $100 per hr for that job. How many other jobs that are fun, that don't involve being a professional athlete, can you make $100hr+ in this economy?

Many people have this same reasoning.
Let me explain this way.
Say one day you bought 50 hot dogs for $.25 each for a grand total of 12.50. You typically sell these dogs for $1.
Your profit is $.75 per dog for a grand total of $37.50?
Your running costs for that day are $15.00. In that you have advertising, rent, equipment, insurance, utilities and misc office supplies.your profit becomes 22.50 which is .45 cents a dog.
Now, would it make sense to sell the dog for $.35 since you would obviously make $.10 a dog and be able to sell every one of them quickly?
Only if you were at the end of your day and the dogs were going to spoil that night would it makes any sense once so ever to drop your prices that low. If you ignore all of your incidental costs you might lead yourself to believe those dogs will double your money if you sold them for $.50. It is simply not true.
In the wedding photography situation I have 52 Saturdays (instead of dogs) and it cost me a certain amount in advertising, labor, rent and utilities just to get a prospect in the door. No to mention how many prospects actually book out of the meetings I schedule. This $500 wedding didn't just meet you in the supermarket while standing in line.
If you have an idea of how much money it costs you to book a wedding you can make a educated decision.
That said, If I have a Saturday this weekend I would probably seriously consider at least negotiating because historically it is no longer considered bookable since it is a few days away.


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The ­ Mack
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Feb 19, 2010 13:44 |  #40

CanonGolfer wrote in post #9640882 (external link)
No offense to anyone but it sounds like some of you feel you are "too good" for a nice $500 wedding. I understand that expenses are expenses but to say to a cash strapped couple "I will give you 2 hours (at most), no CD (which last time I checked cost about 1 cent) and you still have to buy photos" doesn't seem like you are in it to help capture peoples special moments. Yes you still have to pay bills, rent, food and what not but is $500 one day worth more than $0 the next?

Assuming you do 4 hours of wedding shots, minimal PP and put them onto a CD, you are still averaging over $100 per hr for that job. How many other jobs that are fun, that don't involve being a professional athlete, can you make $100hr+ in this economy?

Welcome to a photography forum.


...http://ericmackblog.co​m (external link)

  
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CanonGolfer
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Feb 19, 2010 13:47 |  #41

zagiace wrote in post #9641023 (external link)
Many people have this same reasoning.
Let me explain this way.
Say one day you bought 50 hot dogs for $.25 each for a grand total of 12.50. You typically sell these dogs for $1.
Your profit is $.75 per dog for a grand total of $37.50?
Your running costs for that day are $15.00. In that you have advertising, rent, equipment, insurance, utilities and misc office supplies.your profit becomes 22.50 which is .45 cents a dog.
Now, would it make sense to sell the dog for $.35 since you would obviously make $.10 a dog and be able to sell every one of them quickly?
Only if you were at the end of your day and the dogs were going to spoil that night would it makes any sense once so ever to drop your prices that low. If you ignore all of your incidental costs you might lead yourself to believe those dogs will double your money if you sold them for $.50. It is simply not true.
In the wedding photography situation I have 52 Saturdays (instead of dogs) and it cost me a certain amount in advertising, labor, rent and utilities just to get a prospect in the door. No to mention how many prospects actually book out of the meetings I schedule. This $500 wedding didn't just meet you in the supermarket while standing in line.
If you have an idea of how much money it costs you to book a wedding you can make a educated decision.
That said, If I have a Saturday this weekend I would probably seriously consider at least negotiating because historically it is no longer considered bookable since it is a few days away.

Point well taken and I understand your analogy.
Would you rather buy a .25 hot dog and try to sell it for 1.50 (not knowing weather or not it will sell, maybe in the long run costing you .25)
Or take that hot dog and sell it for .75 knowing that it will more than likely sell. Now I'm not saying to undercut anyone but either way it is profit for you, granted one is more than the other. I am simply stating that in today's economic times, can a lot of people afford to hold off to try and sell that hot dog for 1.50 when they could have sold 2 hot dogs at .75 and made close to the same profit?

....Now I'm hungry :P


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Jimconnerphoto
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Feb 19, 2010 14:02 |  #42

CanonGolfer wrote in post #9641057 (external link)
Point well taken and I understand your analogy.
Would you rather buy a .25 hot dog and try to sell it for 1.50 (not knowing weather or not it will sell, maybe in the long run costing you .25)
Or take that hot dog and sell it for .75 knowing that it will more than likely sell. Now I'm not saying to undercut anyone but either way it is profit for you, granted one is more than the other. I am simply stating that in today's economic times, can a lot of people afford to hold off to try and sell that hot dog for 1.50 when they could have sold 2 hot dogs at .75 and made close to the same profit?

....Now I'm hungry :P

lol, I am hungry too.
Yes, you do have to consider your market. Like Starbucks, they figured there was a market for $5 coffee. Like Sparklets, selling us $1 water.
I have only so many Saturdays to offer. My time is my product. If I sell all of my Saturdays for the rate of $500 I would be at the rate of poverty.
But even at a fantastic rate of $500 per event how would I book "Every" Saturday? I would have to do some serious marketing and sales. They say you are going to spend 75% of your time in business in marketing and selling your product. In my business it is that or more. So I will not have reduced my marketing expenses. It may not seem like it, but it does cost money to make money.
In the other perspective, I can do half of the weddings, (26) and charge $1000, I know have decreased my labor by 50%, my marketing expenses will still be relatively the same.
Now, just for giggles, let me double my price. At $2000 (National average for wedding photography is roughly $2100) I have to book 13 weddings to be at the same level.. I have decreased my labor by yet another 50%. I am still at poverty level but I now have almost 40 additional days in which I can book additional events and make more money. I am now at a level where I can feed myself and possibly 1 or 2 of my kids.

Throughout this entire scenario my marketing expenses will remain consistent with the per client charge. It will only change if I create a more effective or less effective marketing campaign.


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Zansho
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Feb 19, 2010 14:04 |  #43

CanonGolfer wrote in post #9640882 (external link)
No offense to anyone but it sounds like some of you feel you are "too good" for a nice $500 wedding. I understand that expenses are expenses but to say to a cash strapped couple "I will give you 2 hours (at most), no CD (which last time I checked cost about 1 cent) and you still have to buy photos" doesn't seem like you are in it to help capture peoples special moments. Yes you still have to pay bills, rent, food and what not but is $500 one day worth more than $0 the next?

Assuming you do 4 hours of wedding shots, minimal PP and put them onto a CD, you are still averaging over $100 per hr for that job. How many other jobs that are fun, that don't involve being a professional athlete, can you make $100hr+ in this economy?

You apparently have never done a Cost of Doing Business analysis. I'm doing this for a living, and CoDB is something that is an essential part in determining what I charge. Trust me, it's not $100.00/hour.


http://www.michaeljsam​aripa.com (external link) creating beautiful images for myself, my clients, and the world. Shooting with a mix of Canon, Fuji, and Sony.

  
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Jimconnerphoto
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Feb 19, 2010 14:23 |  #44

Zansho wrote in post #9641146 (external link)
You apparently have never done a Cost of Doing Business analysis. I'm doing this for a living, and CoDB is something that is an essential part in determining what I charge. Trust me, it's not $100.00/hour.

You probably know, its been posted on the forum many times and maybe even in this thread but there is a quick and dirty COB online to give you an idea.
http://www.nppa.org …practices/cdb/c​dbcalc.cfm (external link)

Edit,
Fun Experiment: try to add numbers in the fields with a total days per year you expect to bill for shooting at 60 or so and see how dificult it would be to get the Your Overhead Cost for a Day of Shooting to be equal to $500


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Zansho
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Feb 19, 2010 14:53 |  #45

You also don't know what it costs me to do business on a daily basis, lol. I do my CoDB every 6 months, and adjust my prices from there.

That link is actually not bad. But there are a lot of other things that are involved in running a daily photography business for the professional that makes it their livelihood, not their weekend job. It's different for the weekend warriors as opposed to those who depend on it for a living.


http://www.michaeljsam​aripa.com (external link) creating beautiful images for myself, my clients, and the world. Shooting with a mix of Canon, Fuji, and Sony.

  
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what would you give for a 500$ wedding job?
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