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FORUMS Post Processing, Marketing & Presenting Photos Video and Sound Editing 
Thread started 23 Mar 2010 (Tuesday) 22:21
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First all 5DmkII/7D Wedding - C&C Welcomed

 
dche5390
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Apr 03, 2010 23:28 |  #31

Love. It.


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resoundproductions
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Apr 04, 2010 09:01 |  #32

Vndcatr wrote in post #9926057 (external link)
How much of the video was done with the 7D if you dont mind me asking

All of the bride prep shots, the ceremony shots that are locked down, the interviews, and the dancing shots are all 7D.

momendo wrote in post #9907487 (external link)
My selfish critiques. :D
- Less camera shake.
- More coloring to amp up the saturation and mood
- More high & low angles to mix up the scenes
- More rolling shots on a dolly

- Totally agreed on the camera shake. A few handheld shots with the naked camera worked their way in there, and the quality just doesn't cut it without some sort of stabilization. Proper support gear is one of the most crucial aspects to getting good video with these cameras.

- Saturation is boosted quite a bit already, I thought I was pushing the limit. I like contrasty, saturated images, so maybe I'll try bumping it up a bit more.

- It's a challenge to try and get the coverage you need on the spot AND focus on good framing and creative angles. Always something to work on for next time!

- I love the dolly shots too. The way we have our slider rigged up it's just too difficult for one person to use under time constraints. We're in the process of rethinking the mounting so that one person can utilize it. Those shots really add production value.

jjmucker wrote in post #9887610 (external link)
sorry if i missed it but did you use a tripod and video head for some of this. It looks great.

The interviews and ceremony were locked down. Most everything else is a combination of:
Handheld with the LCDVF
Monopod
Monopod with LCDVF
Glidecam 4000
DIY Slider
Shoulder Rig

Whatever route you go, don't expect to shoot decent video with a bare handheld DSLR. You need some sort of stabilization. My favorite way to shoot without a lot of gear is with a monopod and the LCDVF. I feel like I can get shots this way that almost look like they're on a tripod.

troybal wrote in post #9908687 (external link)
Do you have links to any of the other items that would be needed to do video with your DSLR? I found the LCDVF but wondering if you have other recommendations.

If I had to strip down to the bare necessities for fast, editorial style shooting they'd be:
LCDVF - Unbelievably helpful
Monopod - With a little practice you can achieve incredible stability
Rode Videomic - Dramatic improvement over the built-in mic.

Everything else is just gravy. The slider is a pretty inexpensive ($175 or so if you put it together yourself) way to add a lot of production value easily. The glidecam is great, but takes quite a bit of practice to get decent at. I don't feel like I'm quite there with it yet. You can easily spend $10,000 augmenting a DSLR for video with monitors, follow focus, shoulder supports, separate audio, etc., but some practice with a viewfinder and monopod will get you excellent shots on the cheap.

Rmitchell248 wrote in post #9923972 (external link)
The only Issue I had with it was the circling around the bride and groom gave me a nauseous feeling I think it happened twice. But I am also the type that cant watch somebody play video games or I get the same feeling.

I wonder if that's a result of the type of shot (the circling), or my mediocre glidecam work. I'm not that good at maintaining tight control of my framing while using it yet, so you definitely get some rolling movement, like it's moving through waves. I wonder if a little more controlled movement would minimize that nauseous feeling. The last thing I want a bride or groom feeling when they see their video is nauseous!

LSV wrote in post #9928436 (external link)
My question is, how the hell did you get smugmug to convert the video and still keep all the quality. I do anything and smugmug makes it blotchy

Smugmug does much better when you start with a high-quality file. I typically upload 720p h.264 .mov files that are around 400-500mb for a 3-4 minute video. Starting with a source that's more compressed usually results in sub-par quality online with smugmug. For some reason vimeo and youtube tend to fare far better.

Thanks for all of the kind words and critiques. I appreciate the feedback. This is a new market for us, and it can be hard to get objective opinions.


5DmkII | 7D | Tokina 11-16 | 35L | Sigma 50 1.4 | 85/1.8 | 135L | 70-200L 2.8 IS II | Oodles of video gear

  
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keegsmeister
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Apr 04, 2010 09:39 |  #33

Absolutely Amazing!


Keegan.
5DMK2+50D | 70-200mm f/2.8L and f/4L IS USM | 24-70mm f/2.8L | 17-40mm f4L | Canon 50mm f/1.4 | Sigma 15mm f/2.8 fisheye | 580EX2 | 430EX |
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muscleflex
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Apr 04, 2010 14:10 |  #34

nice vid!


:cool:Canon 1D MK III:cool: | Canon EOS 20D | Canon 16-35 II [COLOR=red]L [COLOR=black]| Canon 100-400 [COLOR=red]L IS | [COLOR=#000000]Canon 50mm II 1.8 | Canon 580 EX II

  
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DarthVader
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Apr 04, 2010 14:57 |  #35

I've seen many videos with circling stuff. Don't worry...you did just fine. Nice job!.

resoundproductions wrote in post #9930047 (external link)
I wonder if that's a result of the type of shot (the circling), or my mediocre glidecam work. I'm not that good at maintaining tight control of my framing while using it yet, so you definitely get some rolling movement, like it's moving through waves. I wonder if a little more controlled movement would minimize that nauseous feeling. The last thing I want a bride or groom feeling when they see their video is nauseous!

Thanks for all of the kind words and critiques. I appreciate the feedback. This is a new market for us, and it can be hard to get objective opinions.


Nikon/Fuji.
Gear is important but skills are very important :)

  
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ReneC
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Apr 05, 2010 21:28 |  #36

Loved:

Audio mix (I'm an audio guy, and that mix needs some props)
music choice
video length/editorial decisions - the whole flow was very tight and interesting
glidecam shots
b-roll coverage decisions - esp the high up shots, the empty chairs, the focus rack on the rings at the end
dialogue clips - esp the hair thing and the give her all the money thing
color grading
the spinning thing
the shot of them running through the sparklers and the soft focus effect that happens when they pass by up close
the audio love given to the production

Didn't love:
camera shake on the wine glasses
seeing the still photo guy everywhere
seeing the lav mics during the interviews

-----
overall very very nice work!




  
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myjunk
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Apr 06, 2010 23:18 |  #37

It's still Great man.. Love it.. Videos has more impact then picture slideshows ever will.




  
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Digital ­ Panda
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Apr 07, 2010 14:59 |  #38

thIS is WONDERFUL!

Do you think having IS on the lenses would have helped? (such as 17-55 IS)


Canon 5DIII | 16-35mm f/4L IS | 70-200mm f/2.8 L IS II | 15mm f/2.8 Fisheye | 24mm f/1.4 L II | 100mm f/2.8 L macro IS
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daycent
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Apr 09, 2010 12:49 |  #39

It's very good, but I would have liked to have seen a shallower depth of field, especially on the outdoor shots. Did you use a Vari-ND at all? The shallow depth of field thing is the whole point of using a DSLR I would have thought. I also think the grading is a bit subtle. This combined with the depth of field issue doesn't distinguish this enough from "normal" video cameras for my liking.

No offence intended, I still liked it :)


www.brianhealyphotogra​phy.com (external link)

  
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phenom_1819
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Apr 09, 2010 13:11 |  #40

WOW. I believe this one video has completely changed my opinion of video. This is simply amazing. Still waiting for it to load completely, so I've only watched bits and pieces... but so far am just blown away.


Cal -- Yakima, WA
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7D, 18-135mm IS STM, 50mm f/1.8 STM

  
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resoundproductions
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Apr 10, 2010 00:45 as a reply to  @ phenom_1819's post |  #41

ReneC wrote in post #9940269 (external link)
Loved:

Audio mix (I'm an audio guy, and that mix needs some props)

Didn't love:
camera shake on the wine glasses
seeing the still photo guy everywhere
seeing the lav mics during the interviews

I was a recording engineer/ music producer full-time for about six years, so I have a passion for good audio and really focus on that aspect of each project. Makes me feel good that it gets noticed. Thanks!

The wine glass shots are from the rehearsal the night before the wedding, so unfortunately we only had the naked camera for those shots. The more work we do, the more it becomes apparent that you need good support for EVERY shot with these DSLRs. There have definitely been times when we have to debate whether or not to use a good shot because of camera shake. We just got the vest and arm for our glidecam, so hopefully no handheld shots will sneak their way in to future vids.

If nothing else, we've been learning TONS about how to be unobtrusive by watching still photographers at events. This particular wedding had four photogs (family friends of the bride and groom), so it's definitely a challenge sometimes.

We grabbed the interview segments during dinner, so we were trying to be quick to let the bridal party get back to eating. Next time we'll take the extra minute per interview to hide the lav (we've tried a shotgun on a stand before, but the quality from the lavs is noticeably better).

Thanks for the feedback!

Digital Panda wrote in post #9951614 (external link)
Do you think having IS on the lenses would have helped? (such as 17-55 IS)

In my experience, it's not camera movement that is the enemy, it's micro shake that comes from purely handheld shots. The only place that I find IS really handy is for smooth, slow lateral movement on a tripod (or for smoothing out tripod bumps). Other than that we much prefer to keep the camera moving in a controlled way, either on a tripod, glidecam, slider, monopod, shoulder rig, etc.

daycent wrote in post #9964250 (external link)
It's very good, but I would have liked to have seen a shallower depth of field, especially on the outdoor shots. Did you use a Vari-ND at all? The shallow depth of field thing is the whole point of using a DSLR I would have thought. I also think the grading is a bit subtle. This combined with the depth of field issue doesn't distinguish this enough from "normal" video cameras for my liking.

The vari-nd was in another bag that day (DOH!), so we had to make do with stopping down or going with a higher shutter speed depending on the situation. I would have liked shallower DOF for some of the shots, but we've been stopping down a bit more lately. I find that slightly deeper DOF (f/4-f/5.6 on the 5D, and f/2.8-f/4 on the 7D) gives an image that is still pleasing (and quite film-like) without the focus problems that come with shooting video wide open. I'm at a point where I can't stand focus hunting in these videos, which is practically unavoidable at really wide apertures.

The DOF possibilities are definitely a big part of why we switched over to DSLRs, but there are many others too. A BIG one is the unobtrusiveness factor. We can shoot high quality video while going virtually unnoticed because of the small form factor of these cameras. Price point is another factor. We also do a lot of hybrid still/video gigs, which was a HUGE selling point.

You're the second person to comment on the grading being a bit subtle. Initially I thought I had maybe even pushed it too far, so it's good to know that there's room to take it a bit further. I'll definitely try for a bit bolder grading on our next project.

Thanks again for all of the suggestions, comments, and kind words. I can only imagine how much harder this line of work would be without so many great, helpful communities of passionate people out there.


5DmkII | 7D | Tokina 11-16 | 35L | Sigma 50 1.4 | 85/1.8 | 135L | 70-200L 2.8 IS II | Oodles of video gear

  
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mikeassk
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Apr 10, 2010 03:04 |  #42

It took a while to load, so I started reading the comments here, which built it up quite a bit, and I was not let down. Simply amazing.


Stuff

  
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40dnewbie
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Apr 10, 2010 05:25 |  #43

Gret stuff! I have yet to put my 5DII video skills to test. I like what you did to compile video and stills to create a wonderful summary of the event.


1DMKIII, 5D mk III, 7D mk II, 70D, 50 1.8, 17-40 F4 L, 24-70 f2.8 L, 24-105L, 70-200 f2.8 L IS, 85 1.8, 100-400 4.5-5.6L, 600EX II-RT, (2)580EX II, (2)430EX
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ReneC
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Apr 10, 2010 14:00 |  #44

resoundproductions wrote in post #9967793 (external link)
I was a recording engineer/ music producer full-time for about six years, so I have a passion for good audio and really focus on that aspect of each project. Makes me feel good that it gets noticed. Thanks!

You audio experience shows and adds tons of credibility to the project. Crappy audio would ruin all of your pretty pictures.

resoundproductions wrote in post #9967793 (external link)
The wine glass shots are from the rehearsal the night before the wedding, so unfortunately we only had the naked camera for those shots. The more work we do, the more it becomes apparent that you need good support for EVERY shot with these DSLRs. There have definitely been times when we have to debate whether or not to use a good shot because of camera shake. We just got the vest and arm for our glidecam, so hopefully no handheld shots will sneak their way in to future vids.

I don't necessarily think that all HH shots are bad, its just the obv shake that can get distracting. IS lenses would probably help, or otherwise some sort of lightweight steadicam rig could do it. I saw some guys shooting up a Stars game with a 5dMkII and a 7D a few weeks ago, both equipped with little dangling steadicam rigs. They were still very mobile and active as they stepped around tons of crowd and crew.

resoundproductions wrote in post #9967793 (external link)
We grabbed the interview segments during dinner, so we were trying to be quick to let the bridal party get back to eating. Next time we'll take the extra minute per interview to hide the lav (we've tried a shotgun on a stand before, but the quality from the lavs is noticeably better).

Shotgun on a stand never works, you need an actual boom operator to get good sound that way. That said, properly acquired shotgun sound is the best quality sound you'll get out in the field, and can be less obtrusive on the guests since you don't have to touch them before shooting them. Were you running dual system, or was the audio straight to camera?

Also, if you're going the lav route, you may want to invest in slightly better lavs. The countryman and sanken lines are both super high res and are significantly smaller than the ones you have going on there. This is not to say that your audio didn't sound good - it did - but a further investment in the audio end will pay greater and more tangible dividends than most others. Really nice lavs sound better, are easier to hide, and don't look as obtrusive when you can't hide them.

Just my .02

resoundproductions wrote in post #9967793 (external link)
Thanks for the feedback!


np!




  
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resoundproductions
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Apr 10, 2010 14:17 |  #45

ReneC wrote in post #9969785 (external link)
I don't necessarily think that all HH shots are bad, its just the obv shake that can get distracting. IS lenses would probably help, or otherwise some sort of lightweight steadicam rig could do it. I saw some guys shooting up a Stars game with a 5dMkII and a 7D a few weeks ago, both equipped with little dangling steadicam rigs. They were still very mobile and active as they stepped around tons of crowd and crew.

We just added the vest and arm to our glidecam rig, and it is making a huge difference being able to wear it for a half day instead of 45 seconds. This wedding was done before we had it.

ReneC wrote in post #9969785 (external link)
Shotgun on a stand never works, you need an actual boom operator to get good sound that way. That said, properly acquired shotgun sound is the best quality sound you'll get out in the field, and can be less obtrusive on the guests since you don't have to touch them before shooting them. Were you running dual system, or was the audio straight to camera?

Audio was to a Zoom H4n. We do go with a boom operator sometimes, but weddings seem to be the wrong place for it. Not only does it increase our costs to pay someone else, but it tends to be pretty intrusive when the sound guy has more gear and a bigger footprint than the camera operators. The lavs allow us to be much more discreet. I've spent a lot of time with nice mics, and would love to bring some schoeps or high end audio technica mics out to every gig, but it just isn't always possible.

ReneC wrote in post #9969785 (external link)
Also, if you're going the lav route, you may want to invest in slightly better lavs. The countryman and sanken lines are both super high res and are significantly smaller than the ones you have going on there. This is not to say that your audio didn't sound good - it did - but a further investment in the audio end will pay greater and more tangible dividends than most others. Really nice lavs sound better, are easier to hide, and don't look as obtrusive when you can't hide them.

Better lavs (and additional transmitter/receivers) are on the list, but aren't in the cards until we pick up a few more bookings. I've got my eye on the countryman mics because they're so incredibly tiny and I like the way they sound and are built. I'm pretty happy with the sony for what we paid for it, but eventually we'll go for something a little higher end. I'd love some preamps that are a bit better than what's in the zoom too. It's not a bad unit by any stretch, but the pres are a bit noisy and I think that a couple of portable units (DAV BG-1 comes to mind) would do quite a bit better.


5DmkII | 7D | Tokina 11-16 | 35L | Sigma 50 1.4 | 85/1.8 | 135L | 70-200L 2.8 IS II | Oodles of video gear

  
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