Exclusivity contract in public places?

TooManyShots wrote in post #11880002
I just don't see this photographer would have any ground or whatsoever... The league? The entire little league? All the little league teams? Of course not and not sure if that's possible. With a particular team maybe but that does not bar you from taking shots of the other teams. I am no legal expert

You apparently have no idea how youth sports leagues operate. This isn't Major League Baseball; individual teams aren't likely to be free to sign their own contracts. A contract with the entire league is probably the only relationship possible.

asysin2leads wrote in post #11881477
This.

It is a public park. You have the right to shoot from anywhere you wish, provided you do not go on the field of play or the dugouts. He might have exclusive rights to provide the official photos for the league, but you have the right to sell YOUR photos as well.

Can he count on you to pick up his legal fees if you're wrong? Are you a lawyer?

Hi guys ...back again !!!
Well I see good advices here thanks to all for that
When I talked to the parents they seem not to know anything about model release or even that there was a contract for photography,,, I told them that I was not an official photog,,, and they said that they didnt matter, they only want ther kids pic taken....
Best think for now is call the organizer and ask them for this...
MOOSE good point...thanks
Now I have some parents calling me asking for pics... Since this town(miami) is a litle bit tricky(people like to give you the bad part always) I have to walk with carefull

You can certainly shoot the photos. The water gets muddy when you decide to make it a commercial venture and sell your photos. While the legality is questionable, I do think it a bit low handed of you if the team/league has a contracted photographer. You'll basically be taking the sales from him or her from a league they probably worked hard to book. Instead, why not go out and find a kids league that needs a game photographer to welcome you in?

jra wrote in post #11884579
You can certainly shoot the photos. The water gets muddy when you decide to make it a commercial venture and sell your photos. While the legality is questionable, I do think it a bit low handed of you if the team/league has a contracted photographer. You'll basically be taking the sales from him or her from a league they probably worked hard to book. Instead, why not go out and find a kids league that needs a game photographer to welcome you in?

Yes that is truth, Thanks for your point...
I'll never do that. That's why I asked the parents if they know about the photographer for the league..,and they said NO. On the other hand I was shooting a game that wasnt covered by any photographer. I live relativily close to this field and sometimes I just go there to take pictures for my own, not for sale. Out of the league games, sometimes parents wants the picture of their kids and I sale them. This time it seems it was the play off of the league (I didnt know it) and when the guy told about the contract I went to the other field and continue shooting there from outside. Some parents ask me for the photo and told they didnt know about any "official photographer for the league" thats why I am asking the opinios of people.

ernestoqr wrote in post #11884899
Yes that is truth, Thanks for your point...
I'll never do that. That's why I asked the parents if they know about the photographer for the league..,and they said NO. On the other hand I was shooting a game that wasnt covered by any photographer. I live relativily close to this field and sometimes I just go there to take pictures for my own, not for sale. Out of the league games, sometimes parents wants the picture of their kids and I sale them. This time it seems it was the play off of the league (I didnt know it) and when the guy told about the contract I went to the other field and continue shooting there from outside. Some parents ask me for the photo and told they didnt know about any "official photographer for the league" thats why I am asking the opinios of people.

This is getting fishy here....how could parents not knowing if there are the official photographers? How are they going to buy the prints? Two, how the official photographers making any sales? Look, is possible this photographer is like you except that he is trying to corner his market by using scare tactics. Ask the league officials about this the so-called official photographer.

TooManyShots wrote in post #11884928
This is getting fishy here....how could parents not knowing if there are the official photographers? How are they going to buy the prints? Two, how the official photographers making any sales? Look, is possible this photographer is like you except that he is trying to corner his market by using scare tactics. Ask the league officials about this the so-called official photographer.

yes I will after president's day (nobody is at that office today)

TopHatMoments wrote in post #11880479
If the photog has a deal in play with a league, such as they get a cut of the profit to put back into the league.

Geeze what a gray dark area. If nothing else I would call the league and find out if they did go the route of release signing at player registration and under what constraints it falls.

You can take them all day but, if you can't sell them ?

Post #3

ernestoqr wrote in post #11884899
On the other hand I was shooting a game that wasnt covered by any photographer. I live relativily close to this field and sometimes I just go there to take pictures for my own, not for sale. Out of the league games, sometimes parents wants the picture of their kids and I sale them. This time it seems it was the play off of the league (I didnt know it) and when the guy told about the contract I went to the other field and continue shooting there from outside. Some parents ask me for the photo and told they didnt know about any "official photographer for the league" thats why I am asking the opinios of people.

I guess I'm getting confused, I thought the contracted photographer (or at least one of his/her employees) is the one that approached you and informed you of the situation? If there were multiple fields in play, I would guess the photographer would be rotating from field to field in an attempt to capture as many kids in play as possible to help boost sales. I would also think he/she would do their best to make sure every single parent and grandparent there knew about them and how to purchase images.

I would take the advice given above....if you want to continue shooting with this league for profit, approach who ever is in charge and get the real story. It will be much more satisfying when you have proper permission and you'll probably be afforded a much better vantage point. It the story is true and the league has already contracted a photographer, go out and find yourself another league if you're motivated to continue doing this.

moose10101 wrote in post #11884289
You apparently have no idea how youth sports leagues operate. This isn't Major League Baseball; individual teams aren't likely to be free to sign their own contracts. A contract with the entire league is probably the only relationship possible.

Can he count on you to pick up his legal fees if you're wrong? Are you a lawyer?

Why would he need a lawyer? Public park is public property and he has the legal right to shoot whoever, whenever and wherever (including minors without a release). Taking pictures at a little league baseball game is not legal in any way shape or form. However, if he tries to walk into the little league world series stadium to shoot a game, then he is on private property and that opens a whole new can of worms. Get your facts straight.

asysin2leads wrote in post #11885049
Why would he need a lawyer? Public park is public property and he has the legal right to shoot whoever, whenever and wherever (including minors without a release). Taking pictures at a little league baseball game is not legal in any way shape or form. However, if he tries to walk into the little league world series stadium to shoot a game, then he is on private property and that opens a whole new can of worms. Get your facts straight.

As I said earlier, in most communities it is possible for a private entity to contract for the use of public property, which gives them the right to control access and activities on that property during that period.

There are junior sports leagues that do such.

Point being missed is TECHNICALLY a RELEASE is needed, to sell the prints.
Most parents don't care, again they just want prints of there wee ones for bragging rights.
Should push come to shove, technically it could be expensive.

asysin2leads wrote in post #11885049
Why would he need a lawyer? Public park is public property and he has the legal right to shoot whoever, whenever and wherever (including minors without a release). Taking pictures at a little league baseball game is not legal in any way shape or form. However, if he tries to walk into the little league world series stadium to shoot a game, then he is on private property and that opens a whole new can of worms. Get your facts straight.

You get your facts straight. Obviously he has the right to shoot; however, you also insisted he has the right to sell. If the league has a contract with another photographer, you'd be wrong. So instead of stating "you have the right to sell YOUR photos as well", as you flippantly did, the proper action would be to contact the league and ask them.

As far as i know (not from contracts but from the law) If you are on public propery you can shot anything you see from the public property view point. If the parents want to buy them....legally i see no problem . Now ethically thats on you

RDKirk wrote in post #11885079
As I said earlier, in most communities it is possible for a private entity to contract for the use of public property, which gives them the right to control access and activities on that property during that period.

There are junior sports leagues that do such.

I served on the park board for a several years. The only control they have control over admission/access (for a lack of a better term) is if it is gated. If the baseball field has bleachers outside the backstop or outside the fences and is in a common area of the park, they cannot control who has access to them. Anyone can walk up to the fence line and shoot pictures, regardless of any agreement the organizers have with the park and/or league. I've dealt with this personally, both as a park board member and as a photographer.

BTW, I'm not saying that approaching the league isn't the sensible thing to do. I am just stating that everyone is jumping on the OP for what he is doing was illegal. It isn't. Unethical, possibly, but not illegal.

moose10101 wrote in post #11885125
You get your facts straight. Obviously he has the right to shoot; however, you also insisted he has the right to sell. If the league has a contract with another photographer, you'd be wrong. So instead of stating "you have the right to sell YOUR photos as well", as you flippantly did, the proper action would be to contact the league and ask them.

I have the right to sell my photos, but I don't have the right to use them as advertising. There is a difference. This has been brought up several times on here.