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Thread started 27 Mar 2011 (Sunday) 14:02
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Old Tamron lenses

 
Wilt
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Mar 31, 2011 14:04 |  #16

boguz wrote in post #12132235 (external link)
i just got a Tamron 28-75 f/2.8 :D , but i was asking about this lenses because they are just laying there anyway, so i might as well give them a try if it is not to expensive to get this adapter!
;)

That lens comes in native (permanent) mounts, not requiring the Adaptall 2 mount adapters, as electronic lenses are custom to the electrical contact purpose and position, unlike the mechanical linkages of old (Adaptall).


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Apr 01, 2011 00:32 |  #17

hmmm, sorry :oops: but what does that mean?




  
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titi_67207
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Apr 01, 2011 07:06 as a reply to  @ boguz's post |  #18

I've several old manual lenses (M42, Olympus Zuiko, tamron adaptall), adapted on my EOS 5D and these tamron lenses give good results in their range (I've a 35-80mm f/2.8-3.8, a 70-210 f/3.5, a 300mm f/5.6, all in SP "professional" categories). Their advantage is the minimum focus distance smaller than many (0.85m for my 70-210mm, 1.40m for the 300mm)) allowing nice proxy shots and creamy bokehs.

What's annoying ? Of course the lack of autofocus, and the chromatic aberrations (on my 70-210) / lens flare (on my 35-80) not well controlled like modern lenses. So if you want to give a second chance to these old lenses, do it and you won't regret it if manual and time of the operations are not constraints for you. Buy just one adapter ring for some bucks and... have fun. ;)

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CV 15 4.5 III | TS-E 24L II | FE 28 2 | (50+85) 1.4 | 135 2 | 70-200 4.0L | a collection of old Zuikos + FD + Adaptall + AI-s + M42

  
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spotz04
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Apr 01, 2011 09:51 as a reply to  @ titi_67207's post |  #19

I have the Adaptall-2 versions whereas when years ago when you ordered the lens you stated which mount specifically for your camera body. If you wanted to use the same lens on a different brand camera all you needed was only the different mount for the other brand's mount configuration.

I picked up an "AD-2 to EOS mount" adapter on eBay (cheap!), they come from China. No AF but AV, TV, & M work fine. You manually focus wide open (viewfinder is at its brightest) and then stop down to desired f-stop when shooting the pic.

You can try the chipped version for AF confirm. I can't say I know much how well they work as I have the non-chipped versions.

http://shop.ebay.com …_sacat=See-All-Categories (external link)

(edit) Or just search "adaptall-2 to eos mount".




  
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Apr 01, 2011 10:09 as a reply to  @ titi_67207's post |  #20

Forgot to mention - my only suggestion is if buying only one mount be sure to attach the mount to the lens FIRST and then mount the lens to the camera. It's much easier to attach the lens this way. These mounts are so inexpensive I bought two on ebay for both my Tamrons so I didn't have to keep switching one mount across two lenses.




  
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Apr 01, 2011 10:15 as a reply to  @ spotz04's post |  #21

I have a Tamron Aspherical AF 28-200 3.8-5.6 71DM mounted on a Minolta Maxxum 700si. I believe I bought the lens in 1994-1995 timeframe. Is there an adapter that would allow me to mount it on my Canon 7D (just for the fun of old time sake)?

Thanks.




  
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Apr 01, 2011 10:31 |  #22

ldn323 wrote in post #12137713 (external link)
I have a Tamron Aspherical AF 28-200 3.8-5.6 71DM mounted on a Minolta Maxxum 700si. I believe I bought the lens in 1994-1995 timeframe. Is there an adapter that would allow me to mount it on my Canon 7D (just for the fun of old time sake)?

Thanks.

http://www.bobatkins.c​om …faq/manual_focu​s_EOS.html (external link)




  
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Wilt
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Apr 01, 2011 10:58 |  #23

boguz wrote in post #12136016 (external link)
hmmm, sorry :oops: but what does that mean?

Here is a photo of three Tamron lenses.

IMAGE: http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i63/wiltonw/Equipment/Tamronmount-1.jpg


  1. The left Tamron has a permanent EF mount which is not removeable from the lens. The Canon electrical contacts permit full operation of f/stop and focus electronically controlled by the camera.
  2. The middle one is a Tamron Adaptall 2 lens, and the mechnical linkage within the lens is visible at about the 6:30 position. But the Adaptall 2 EF mount adapter is located removed from the lens. It has electrical contacts, so that AF confirmation works, and also the adapter can report one FL and the max aperture of this lens, but no AF and no aperture control is available, since there is no communication between the electrical contacts of the adapter and the mechanical controls of the lens.
  3. The right lens is a Tamron Adaptall 2 lens and the mechnical linkage within the lens is visible at about the 6:30 position. Again, the Adaptall 2 OM mount adapter is located removed from the lens, and you can see it has levers visible (mechanical linkage to similar levers in the camera body (Olympus in this case), and this couples the body's automatic lens diaphram controls to the lens' linkage mechanism.

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amfoto1
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Apr 01, 2011 11:34 |  #24

I've been a big fan of particular Tamron "SP" Adaptall-2 lenses for at least a couple decades... esp. 90/2.5 or 2.8 Macro, 300/2.8 IF, 400/4 IF, 180/2.5, 80-200/2.8, and the two mirror lenses 350/5.6 and 500/8. But I don't personally have any experience with or knowledge of the two lenses OP has, or ones others have mentioned. I'm not sure if they would be worth adapting or not. Maybe some more info would help you decide for yourself.

Tamron made (actually still makes) entry-level, mid-grade and pro-grade lenses, same as most lens manufacturers. Tamron is even a major supplier of lenses to Hollywood and the movie industry. In general, the "SP" series are their higheest quality pro grade lenses, some of which might be found relatively cheaply today and may be well worth adapting.

Here's a 90mm f2.5 SP Macro adapted for use on Canon...

IMAGE: http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5253/5431808414_f7b31fe45e.jpg


There is a Canon EOS Adaptall-2 mount (chipped version) on the lens, and alongside a Nikon AI/AI-S mount is shown. There's a lens hood reversed for storage on the lens, too. One reason I like this lens is that it's compact and tucks into a corner of my camera bag. In fact, I have a couple more copies of the 90mm set up for use in vintage film kits: one with (another) Nikon AI/AI-S mount and another with Konica K/AR mount. You can get Adaptall-2 mounts for practically any SLR/DSLR system.

The mount is easily interchanged. It's essentially another bayonet and there is a little silver lever/button on the side to release the latch. The little aqua paint dot seen in the above photo is aligned with a similar dot on the mount, then it's twisted until it latches (just like mounting most bayonet mount lenses on cameras). The Adaptall-2 mounts - in particular - might have an adjustment for the lens' max aperture, so that the lens "registers" properly on older mechanically-linked cameras. The original Adaptall mount, you had to buy a mount that matched the lens... f2.8 mount for f2.8 lens, for example.

Here's another view of the macro lens, this time mounted on one of my 7Ds...

IMAGE: http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5017/5453385847_10a2a40bec.jpg

And, here's a sample image taken with the above lens...

IMAGE: http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5125/5283068575_5d2187dd6f_z.jpg
Bee on orange poppy.
Tamron SP 90mm f2.5 lens at f11, with 25mm extension tube.
EOS 7D camera at ISO 400, 1/400 shutter speed. Ambient light, handheld.


Not bad for a $60 investment! I picked up the macro lens for all of $20 and it cost me another $40 for an adapter from China (off eBay).

However, it isn't all wine and roses!

First of all - and perhaps obviously - these are manual-focus-only vintage lenses. Not too big a deal for macro, and probably for some other types of shooting... But some modern DSLRs really aren't very manual focus friendly. Small viewfinders, dimmer viewfinders and focus screens without any sort of manual focus assist features can make it challenging. It can help to get the "chipped" adapters (pretty widely offered for these and most other types of EOS-adaptable lens) so you will be able to use Focus Confirmation. Be aware that only works in One Shot mode, so remember to set it before removing your EF/EF-S lens from the camera.

Focus Confirmation only works up to the camera's limit of focus ability. The center AF point on most Canon is good to at least f5.6, the 1-Series cameras can operate to f8. WIth the third party adapters you can work a little beyond this limitation. It sort of depends upon the situation... Will work better in bright, contrasty situations. Live View might work better (altho slower) than standard AF detection, too.

More importantly, these lenses on EOS cameras are manual-aperture-only, too. Sorry, but a previous response is incorrect.... You cannot use Av, Tv, P. You'll have to be using M (or B/Bulb for really long exposures) and manual metering ("stop down" metering method, when using the camera's internal meter... or take readings with a separate light meter).

And you'll need to stop the aperture down manually before taking the shot. This makes it a little slower working with these lenses. Now, when using larger apertures it isn't too big a deal... just set the aperture first, then focus manually. But at smaller apertures, with the lens stopped down your viewfinder will dim and, depending upon how small the aperture, Focus Confirmation can get iffy or stop working entirely, so manual focusing can be more difficult. You might want to select your aperture, but keep the lens wide open during focusing, then stop down afterward, just before taking the shot. Depending upon what you are shooting, that might be fine... or it might be difficult. It's pretty tricky, for example, to capture a moving subject such as a bee flitting from flower to flower, especially at macro magnifications.

Also, in the EXIF you won't see correct info about the lens. The focal length will be incorrect and the actual f-stop you used won't be noted.

So, there is no free lunch... A few things you have to consider if you want to adapt and use those lenses on your modern cameras.

By the way, modern Tamron lenses, some of which are excellent, do not have interchangeable mounts. Now that pretty much all camera manufacturers have gone to electronic camera to lens communication and control, each lens has to be dedicated to the specific mount and it's impractical or impossible to offer interchangeable mounts.

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Wilt
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Apr 01, 2011 12:31 |  #25

amfoto1 wrote in post #12138199 (external link)
More importantly, these lenses on EOS cameras are manual-aperture-only, too. Sorry, but a previous response is incorrect.... You cannot use Av, Tv, P. You'll have to be using M (or B/Bulb for really long exposures) and manual metering ("stop down" metering method, when using the camera's internal meter... or take readings with a separate light meter).

Oh, but Av does work! but the problem is that stop down metering can be very inaccurate, when the lens is other than at f/4 when metering is performed! And it is not consistently in error, even from lens to lens...

This series photographed with Olympus 50mm f/1.4 lens, from large to small aperture, and all shots should have same density (same as f/4 shot) because shutter speed adjusts automatically to the decreasing light as the lens is stopped down, but they don't...instead it progresses to increasing overexposure as the lens stops down...due entirely to metering errors (not the fault of Av...M mode would be similarly in error if you followed the meter's suggestion!)

IMAGE: http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i63/wiltonw/Principles/40D_50f14.jpg

but the Tamron 28-200mm lens shots progress to increasing underexposure as the lens is stopped down.
IMAGE: http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i63/wiltonw/Principles/28200_f35_40D.jpg


amfoto1 wrote in post #12138199 (external link)
Also, in the EXIF you won't see correct info about the lens. The focal length will be incorrect and the actual f-stop you used won't be noted.

There are adapters with programmable chips, which let you set max f/stop, FL, and even microfocus adjustment value, although I question what value max aperture has, since that does not embed in EXIF data.


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amfoto1
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Apr 01, 2011 19:24 |  #26

Wilt wrote in post #12138531 (external link)
Oh, but Av does work!

Huh? How? The aperture on the lens is set manually. There's no communication between the camera and lens as to what aperture has been selected on the lens, and since the camera has no idea what aperture has been selected it can't set the shutter accordingly.

And, at least with the chipped Adaptall-2 I've got, I can't change the aperture setting showing on the camera to match what I've set on the lens. It just shows "1.4" all the time. It doesn't show anything in P mode. In Tv I can set the shutter speed and take a shot, but the camera flashes "1.4" and might be trying to set the aperture to match the shutter speed I've selected, but can't do so.

Maybe the difference is that you are using a lens adapter on an Olympus lens. We're talking about Tamron lenses and Adaptall-2 here, which is not really a lens adapter, per se, but a fully interchangeable lens mounting system. (I have a couple Oly OM series lenses in a vintage film kit, but haven't adapted for use on EOS.)

I agree that stop down metering is not necessarily all that accurate. It's got all the same inherent biases or error that any reflective metering gives. I usually use a separate handheld incidence meter, or just set things manually using the "sunny sixteen" rule. With macro lenses at higher magnifications (i.e. lots of extension either in the lens itself or in extension tube(s) behind the lens, or both), there is also light falloff. The shot I posted previously needed an additional stop of light, for that reason. You'd have to factor in any stong filters, too.

On the other hand, TTL metering (stop down) would take into account any light falloff or filters on the lens. Setting exposure with a separate meter or just by eye doesn't take into account for these additional factors.

But once you are in the ballpark, using any of several possible methods, it's easy to fine tune exposure by taking a shot and then checking the histogram.

EXIF info from the chip on the Adaptall-2 I'm using always shows 50mm and f1.4 aperture, even though it's being used on a 90mm lens with a max aperture of f2.5. I haven't seen a programmable chip. That might be useful if the camera needs to adjust it's exposure readout by the max aperture on the len. Any TTL metering is subject to the differences in max aperture the lens provides, but stop down metering just looks at the actual exposure regardless.... center the meter readout and you should be close (just adjust a little for unusually light or dark subjects, or use a gray card target).


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Wilt
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Apr 01, 2011 22:21 |  #27

Amphoto,
A manual lens tells no f/stop information to the body...the body merely sets the shutter speed according to whatever the lens lets thru, and sets the shutter speed accordingly! At least that is what it does when no f/stop information comes in via a chip, where '00' is the stated f/stop on the top LCD.

The flashing simply indicates that for the aperture reported to the body (f/1.4 in your case), there is too much light for the shutter speed to provide the proper balance of light. (That tells me that it may actually be better to have '00' rather than the real max f/stop of the lens programmed into the chip!)

I do not think that using an OM lens with EF adapter is any different than using Tamron lens on Adaptall EF adapter...the non-chipped Adaptall was on the Tamron lens which I showed in the exposure error test series (second set of exposures in Post 25), and that lens' behavior was just like using my OM 135mm f/2.8 lens on the OM-to-EF adapter.

I have both a non-chipped Adaptal 2 adapter (used in the tests over a year ago) and a recently purchased chipped Adaptall 2 adapter. It looks like I need to try tests with the same Tamron lens, to profile behavior differences between the two Adaptall 2 adapters.


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Apr 02, 2011 00:05 |  #28

Amphoto, just completed some tests, and they confirmed my hypothesis that chipped vs. non-chipped metering results are quite different, and the chipped metering stopped down metering is even more horribly in error!

The lens: Tamron 90mm f/2.5 Adaptall 2

The control: Under CFL light source, at ISO 1600 and incident meter reads 1/160 f/2.8

Test 1: with unchipped Adaptall 2 adapter, changing lens aperture and matching the f/number with the camera's aperture control (camera in Av mode):
Test 2: with chipped Adaptall 2 adapter, changing lens aperture and NOT matching the f/number with the camera's aperture control (camera in M mode):
Test 3: with chipped Adaptall 2 adapter, changing lens aperture and NOT matching the f/number with the camera's aperture control (camera in Av mode):
Test 4: with chipped Adaptall 2 adapter, changing lens aperture and matching the f/number with the camera's aperture control (camera in Av mode):
Test 5: with chipped Adaptall 2 adapter, changing lens aperture and matching the f/number with the camera's aperture control (camera in Av mode)

The results...

IMAGE: http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i63/wiltonw/ManualTamronmeter2.jpg

As I claimed, Av results same as M mode results. The error is different with a non-chipped vs. with a chipped adapter, and the results also differ (for the chipped adapter) if you select the actual f/stop on the lens, vs. not changing the selected f/stop

My recommendation, based upon these results:
With an unchipped adapter, meter at f/4 and then manually adjust shutter speed to match actual f/stop
With a chipped adapter, meter with an incident light meter!!!

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Apr 25, 2011 00:44 |  #29

The only Adaptall lens I have is my Adaptall II SP70-210. On my A1 it was my favourite lens, and produced some very good images. I'd be interested in trying it on EOS, though from what's said above it seems the unchipped adapter is better. I'd also love to be able to use my other FD lenses, but they're all dedicated FD without separate mounts. I'm told it's easier and you get better results adapting these to Nikon digital rather than to EOS. I don't know if that's true.


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