7d losing skin texture...quite disappointed.

I did some more photos and I find that this issue is when I use ambient/available light. Using flash this is less of an issue. When I shoot with available light I barely tolerate my 1dmk3 (in bright light)and the 7D is worse. Tonality in shadows is lost with smudged detail (raw files) regardless of what lens I use. Pulling under exposed photos seems to remedy this issue of smudge phenomenon but the 7d appears to get quite noisy like any digital body when underexposed.

My youngest does have perfect skin but my 5d or 5dmk2 seldom gives me this plastic look. Only way I get such lost detail only when I blow out the exposure severely. My 1dmk3 is bad in losing texture when over exposed too. However the raw files seems more in between a 5dc adn 5dmk2 when manipulating Raw in LR3. The 7D seems more of a plastic skin generator because as you reduce the granular noise it smooths out the skin even more. The fact that the noise is so fine I think people can use less NR and ramp up the sharpness and "detail" when printing.

I'll do some more testing with bounced flash. I think the 7D will provide good files for print due to its fine granular noise. The noise is quite pronounced smudging eyelash detail even at ISO 1250. The crappy noise I see with the 1dmk3 is certainly different but can be sharper even after hitting it with NR.

I am now finding more and more pros/cons in every body as I play with alot of gear. I think my love/hate relationship with my 1dmk3 is more palatable. This AA filter in the 7D is IMO extreme.

I assume that you are adjusting the color temp in post to remove any color casts. If not, this can make a drastic change in the amount of detail that is revealed.

I have not noticed any softness or issues with the supposed strong AA filter on the 7D on human faces and in any other situations where it would clearly show. I have not had the plastic face effect that some of you mention. My 7D must be malfunctioning since it does not suffer from these problems.

Here is a 100% crop from my selfportrait i shot recently. It's untouched, no sharpening or noisereduction have been applied to this.

Byte size: ZERO | Content warning: NOT AN IMAGE

Not to challenge you but, an image with nothing to compare to, cannot illustrate what is possible. I would like to see the same shot, same settings, with another camera.

This takes nothing away from the image/camera you posted but you can't miss what you never had. Not saying that another camera is better.

bohdank wrote in post #12284943
This takes nothing away from the image/camera you posted but you can't miss what you never had.

As they say... "ignorance is bliss." And I believe I am blissfully ignorant.

jwcdds wrote in post #12284959
As they say... "ignorance is bliss." And I believe I am blissfully ignorant.

same here

I think the theory here is that the red channel loses detail in certain exposure rates but not in others. If so that would explain the observations. And of course you can't just fix it up with a red channel curve picture-wide.

A single picture with even exposure also wouldn't show this.

Hmm, I have now made some more testing with my 7D..taking bird photos. It really seems to be very sensitive for certain exposure to get most detailed image.

Magnus, looking at the catchlight theres a very good light source. I am finding more of this softening effect in available light. Also using available light I am at wide apertures with ISO's high enough to provide me fast shutter speeds. Also what percentage of the frame was concentratd on the person's face? More the pixels will provide high detail. So far my testing has ranged from 10 feet and less. The photo I see (exif removed)it appears to be a very narrow aperture or at least if your zoomed in your at least shooting f/4.5.

After using LR2 and LR3 I find the 7D files to be very different compared to all of my other bodies I've owned. I've read often that sharpness is more difficult to achieve with the 7D and I will say these internet "words of wisdom" is certainly true. With spot on focus with my 85L I still find the photos to be less sharp.

My testing seems to conclude that the 7D is extremely sensitive to exposure. For human subjects even being 1/3 stop over exposed can wipe out details that cannot be recovered in Raw. My 1dmk3 is similar in the sensitivity department.

bohdank wrote in post #12284729
I assume that you are adjusting the color temp in post to remove any color casts. If not, this can make a drastic change in the amount of detail that is revealed.

thanks for the tip. I'm playing with the raws more to see the difference in how to approach these 7d files. Very interesting....

AlanU wrote in post #12282938
I use LR3.

I do not get this automatic skin smoothing with my 5dc or 5dmk2.

Different cameras will require different LR parameters. What values do you have for the different Sharpening and Noise Reduction options?

hollis_f wrote in post #12287552
Different cameras will require different LR parameters. What values do you have for the different Sharpening and Noise Reduction options?

I usually use "luminance" NR just enough to suite my eyes. With the 5d i can hit sharpness to aprox 40 before odd pixelation. With 5dmk2 sky is the limit. I will also manipulate radius. My 1dmk3 it seems I have more flexibility than my 5dc and sharpness is a none issue but resolution is the drawback for cropping capabilities.

I will say the 7D's raws feel more like manipulating jpg files in LR3. Where as the 5D classic has some flexibility and the 5dmk2 is like playing with a clean canvas and the world is in my hands for manipulation.

7D as you try to achieve your sharpness you hit a wall in the fine granular noise. As you reduce the soft grains the softness gets worst. This is a none issue for printing but in the pixel peeping analysis this is something I have never dealt with before. I will say I am not fond of this. I can see how there are 1dmk3 fanboys reverting back to a lower resolution file which is alot easier to manipulate and is easy to produce files for print.

What values do you have for the different Sharpening and Noise Reduction options as the LR default?

When you adjust the NR do you also adjust the Detail sliders? They can have a huge effect.

My 7D normally has sharpening higher than 40. What are your values for Radius and Detail? Do you adjust the Masking value (try holding the Alt key whilst doing so)?

hollis_f wrote in post #12287621
What values do you have for the different Sharpening and Noise Reduction options as the LR default?

When you adjust the NR do you also adjust the Detail sliders? They can have a huge effect.

My 7D normally has sharpening higher than 40. What are your values for Radius and Detail? Do you adjust the Masking value (try holding the Alt key whilst doing so)?

Thanks for the guidance. I've played with detail sliders but to be honest with my 3 mostly used bodies I did not care to do so because of so much detail. There's a fine line of too much detail in people especially mature faces. I think the 7d needs alot of tweeking with the detail slide.

AlanU Insee what you mean about the plasticy skin but what also looks weird is the ribbon on the right side looks over sharpened, is this from a jpeg that had picture styles set on something other than natural?

I use the MKIII with a 85L or 24-70L for portraits which I do a lot, shoot RAW and can't say I've ever noticed the yellow thing you mention. If anything I have more than enough skin texture and have to smooth it over, especially with older subjects but try to retain the character and pores a little.

But whenever I've shot JPEGs I could not really appreciate the images when shooting people and have no reason to ever shoot JPEG ever, I just can't find any sense in doing that. I understand some so for sports and high frame rates because of the buffer but that is not something I need to do.