Family, the anti-business!

GeeMack wrote in post #12475345
My vocation is IT support. My avocation is photography. I have no problems helping family pick out, install or fix their PC. Nor do I object to taking pictures for them (I need the practice). It's family. At the end of the day, that's what life's all about for me.

as mentioned, no decent person ha a problem helping others (especially family). That's not the issue.

So if a family member took advantage of you (said they would pay and then didn't) you'd be ok with that?

Let me throw out this question, What if it wasn't a family member but rather a person who said they were going to pay you and didn't?

I guess my relationship with my family is unusual or different from normal. If they made a request that I thought was out of line or inappropriate, we could talk about it. Somehow we could work it out.

well sure you could talk about it and work things out. the point is that the request or expectation of "free", in the first place, isn't right.

I don't shoot friends or family for money at all... I've seen several of my friends start doing photo "shoots", etc.. for mutual friends and watched several instances of them really hounding them for payment, or the whole process putting a strain on the prior relationship. I've done a wedding for one of my employees - which I undertook more as practice than anything else - as her alternative was "Aunt Suzie taking snapshots with the old 35mm p&s". She loved the photos so she got about 40 prints which she bought from me. Her payment to me for the gig was that I got a couple of prints to put into my portfolio with her permission. I couldn't charge any of my close friends or family.

I guess it comes down to if you're running a full time studio or if you're just doing this for a hobby or as a weekend warrior.

Same in probably most trades I would guess. If you do it for fun, you're probably going to let it slide with family and friends. But if you're paying the bills by that trade, you're probably not going to do as much of it as you would if you weren't full time.

This is especially true when it's a job that's going to eat into one's limited supply of "billable hours."

Like the example I gave earlier of a plumber's brother-in-law who needs all the galvanized plumbing in his house replaced. How many billable hours can the plumber afford to spend doing such a job for free? Or will the brother-in-law be willing to let the job drag for months while the plumber spends a few hours every other weekend on it?

Logicus wrote in post #12475616
I don't shoot friends or family for money at all... I've seen several of my friends start doing photo "shoots", etc.. for mutual friends and watched several instances of them really hounding them for payment, or the whole process putting a strain on the prior relationship. I've done a wedding for one of my employees - which I undertook more as practice than anything else - as her alternative was "Aunt Suzie taking snapshots with the old 35mm p&s". She loved the photos so she got about 40 prints which she bought from me. Her payment to me for the gig was that I got a couple of prints to put into my portfolio with her permission. I couldn't charge any of my close friends or family.

You don't have my sister-in-law, who would use you like a dishrag.

I guess the bottom line is 'what's the relationship with this person worth?' Is it worth money? Is it worth time? Is it worth both? How important are they in your life?

RDKirk wrote in post #12475816
You don't have my sister-in-law, who would use you like a dishrag.

can I use this??

GeeMack wrote in post #12475345
My vocation is IT support. My avocation is photography. I have no problems helping family pick out, install or fix their PC. Nor do I object to taking pictures for them (I need the practice). It's family. At the end of the day, that's what life's all about for me.

I'm with GeeMack (in both instances - work in IT and love photography).

I will drop anything for my family.

However I understand that not all families are the same & some "members" could be real takers and never givers.

These threads always make me appreciate my family.

I share your pain..

cdifoto wrote in post #12462813
I would never turn down paid work to do unpaid work, family or not.

Say its your grandmother, who you love dearly and lives overseas, is only in town for a couple of days and wants some good photos of the family to hang on her wall or put in her personal album would you refuse?

We all play multiple roles and for me this is one of those times where I would take off my "professional photographer" hat and put on my "talented grandson with a camera" hat.

I am not advocating letting your family take advantage of you and your business, however. If my cousin who lives down the street and I see all the time asks me do a portrait with him and his kids then either they pay the normal rate or if they ask me to shoot it for free then only when it fits around my schedule for my paying gigs.

Everything else falls in between these two extremes and is kind of a case by case basis.

Personally it has actually been the other way around for me. My family has insisted on paying me even if I offer to do it as a favor. So far that's been the case atleast...

My grandmother would tell me to go get paid. She was practical that way. I actually suspect any grandmother who "lives overseas" is equally practical.

Not too many people in my family are in my price range actually to pay me my actual rates. Heck, the only reason I can afford any of my own work is because I can get it wholesale.

I wish this applied to attorneys. I get calls from "family" all the time, seeking "free" legal advice. I try to help, and usually tell them they have no case, or tell them they should hire an attorney. When they ask if I could be their attorney, they usually balk at my rates.

Luckily for me, photography is a hobby, so taking pictures for family & friends is kinda fun for me (so far). I tell them I'm not a professional, so they should have any expectations, and if they want guaranteed results, hire a pro. Helps take the pressure off.

I have gotten quite a bit of legal business from referrals from my family.