FIrst flash 430 EX II or 580 EX II

So it seems there's no "definitive" answer here is there.

For someone in the same position as the OP, I was kinda hoping something a..."little" more definitive. Now mind you, I don't necessarily plan on doing "studio lighting", but "someday" I might need to use a secondary flash synched to a primary to give me some fill light ( but not much beyond that ). So do I chase after some of the 430exII's out there, or pump up the volume($$) to a 580exII ?

580ex ii if you're budget allows it. Otherwise the 430ex ii is a good start.

Blurr Cube wrote in post #12512910
580ex ii if you're budget allows it. Otherwise the 430ex ii is a good start.

See ? Who says you can't get a straight answer. Now, what if I told you the difference was $50 less for one, the 430exII ( and someone ships it ), or you have to drive a couple of hours, pay the extra $50, and get the 580exII. What would you say to that ?!

I'm not indecisive...I'm just looking for advice from folks who've been at this for longer than I have, and have gone through some of the hard knocks.

I current use 2 550ex's, 590ex and a 580ex2 all with the PW iTTl system with no ill results.

marcelol wrote in post #12512943
See ? Who says you can't get a straight answer. Now, what if I told you the difference was $50 less for one, the 430exII ( and someone ships it ), or you have to drive a couple of hours, pay the extra $50, and get the 580exII. What would you say to that ?!

I'm not indecisive...I'm just looking for advice from folks who've been at this for longer than I have, and have gone through some of the hard knocks.

New... theres about a $150 to $200 difference between the two.

If you have a camera with wireless flash, you can control the 430ex II. I'd go with that, then.

I take it the $50 difference is for both used? A couple hours of your time, gas, and $50 additional for more features of the 580ex ii worth it for you? If I was confident in the seller, then I'd probably go for it.

Another path you can go... get the 430exii, use the $50 towards radio triggers, and add cheaper manual flashes as your needs grows.

I would never buy a 430ex ever again

It's funny how on one hand people talk about getting a 50 1.8 as it is "practically disposable'' yet hesitate in this context

smorter wrote in post #12513697
I would never buy a 430ex ever again

It's funny how on one hand people talk about getting a 50 1.8 as it is "practically disposable'' yet hesitate in this context

I don't get what you're saying

I started with a 580 EX II, mainly because the 430 EX didn't support setup through the camera's menu system. The 430 EX II wasn't available at that time.

I thought the 580 EX II was unnecessarily expensive, but then it turned out there was a discount in the US, so it didn't cost more than the 430 EX did here. Then it was easy to choose. Since then, I've acquired another two 580 EX II units. They have never failed, in spite of heavy use with CP-E4 battery pack occasionally.

I'd like to chime in and hopefully get some opinions. I'm also in the market for my first Speedlite. Currently using a 7D, which has remote/wireless control built in (I believe.. right?). I've spent so much this year between my new body and L glass that I really do not want to buy the 580EXII unless I really have to.

I do not like having to upgrade later, but I'm not a professional. I plan on using my flash for just about everything though. Bounce, fill, defused, and down the line I'll probably buy either a softbox or umbrella setup to trigger remotely. But I mainly shoot free of a tripod, carrying my equipment with me and am looking for a flash to compliment and improve what I'm doing already. I'd like to be future proof "enough" to play around with wireless triggering etc.. I do not need professional grade flashing but would love if my equipment coupled with my creativity could come close, or give the impression of being professional grade.

I like that that 580 is weather resistant, because my 7D and L glass are as well but its not critical to be honest. I did some research and realize that I probably would never need anything more than a 430EXII but before I lock in.. I would really appreciate some input from seasoned flashers (lol).

The main reason I would not buy the 580 is simply price. With the 7D and wireless am I actually good.. as in future proof as far as remote triggering goes? Do I need a 580? Can I get a 430 and use it w/o the need to upgrade later?

Anyone want to give me a 430EXII for free?

superNoid wrote in post #12515827
I'd like to chime in and hopefully get some opinions. I'm also in the market for my first Speedlite. Currently using a 7D, which has remote/wireless control built in (I believe.. right?). I've spent so much this year between my new body and L glass that I really do not want to buy the 580EXII unless I really have to.

I do not like having to upgrade later, but I'm not a professional. I plan on using my flash for just about everything though. Bounce, fill, defused, and down the line I'll probably buy either a softbox or umbrella setup to trigger remotely. But I mainly shoot free of a tripod, carrying my equipment with me and am looking for a flash to compliment and improve what I'm doing already. I'd like to be future proof "enough" to play around with wireless triggering etc.. I do not need professional grade flashing but would love if my equipment coupled with my creativity could come close, or give the impression of being professional grade.

I like that that 580 is weather resistant, because my 7D and L glass are as well but its not critical to be honest. I did some research and realize that I probably would never need anything more than a 430EXII but before I lock in.. I would really appreciate some input from seasoned flashers (lol).

The main reason I would not buy the 580 is simply price. With the 7D and wireless am I actually good.. as in future proof as far as remote triggering goes? Do I need a 580? Can I get a 430 and use it w/o the need to upgrade later?

Anyone want to give me a 430EXII for free?

The 7D built-in flash can work as the master unit with the 430exii as slave unit. It is convenient to have on camera but optical with LOS (line of sight) limitations.

Thanks, so these limitations.. are you referring to line of sight of the 430 and its available flash angles? I was a little confused by that statement. Also someone had mentioned struggling with the 430 when shooting in portrait, I think due to angle limitations of the 430 and properly lighting the subject.

Is that typical behavior?

Thanks again

superNoid wrote in post #12516108
Thanks, so these limitations.. are you referring to line of sight of the 430 and its available flash angles? I was a little confused by that statement.

The slave unit (430exii/580exii) wireless sensor needs to face the camera. You would need to rotate the flash head towards the area you wish to light (bg or subject) while keeping the flash sensor facing towards the camera. The flash won't fire if there is something blocking the way (a tree, a pole, a person, etc) of the LOS between master and slave.

superNoid wrote in post #12516108
Also someone had mentioned struggling with the 430 when shooting in portrait, I think due to angle limitations of the 430 and properly lighting the subject.

Is that typical behavior?

Thanks again

The "complaint" is due to the 430exII rotation of the head limited to 90 deg to the right, I suspect. With the camera on portrait orientation the flash is on the left side and the flash can only rotate 90 deg to the right (which is up)... some would like to rotate it more back (maybe 125 to 135 deg) to bounce slightly behind and up.

Blurr Cube wrote in post #12516189
The slave unit (430exii/580exii) wireless sensor needs to face the camera. You would need to rotate the flash head towards the area you wish to light (bg or subject) while keeping the flash sensor facing towards the camera. The flash won't fire if there is something blocking the way (a tree, a pole, a person, etc) of the LOS between master and slave.

The "complaint" is due to the 430exII rotation of the head limited to 90 deg to the right, I suspect. With the camera on portrait orientation the flash is on the left side and the flash can only rotate 90 deg to the right (which is up)... some would like to rotate it more back (maybe 125 to 135 deg) to bounce slightly behind and up.

Ok perfect explanations, makes sense on both issues. Thanks for your input.

Why spend the money buying one only to upgrade later? Buy the 580 now, get the features above/beyond what the 430 offers (360 swivel, better sealing on the foot mount, etc) and only buy once. Once you're comfortable with a single flash you'll either find that you want multiple slaves and can go with cheaper alternatives or you may find that you're going to go strobes and don't need any additional flash guns.

Flash isn't really like some of the other hardware where it makes sense to plan an upgrade path, IMO. Just buy the most full featured one you can comfortably afford. I like the Canon products, myself, you can get the same features, or very nearly, of the 580 in cheaper packages from Metz or Sigma, if budget is the reason for choosing between the 430 and 580.

So with the 580ex ll, is there a need for an off shoe cord or pocket wizard when using the flash hand held? If my thinking is correct I can hand hold the flash with the flash sensor facing the camera. Everything should work as usual??