First all-Asian wedding - a complete disaster!

souporman wrote in post #12882342
The OP's not gonna get paid

Well that's pretty concise and probably correct.

I think CDI is the guy to learn from here. Payment in full 14 days before hand.

Then if they start with any nonsense at least you can be straight with them and they know that you're not going to turn up on the day.

I think that they actually do want the photos but they (i.e. both of them) thought that you would roll over when you got the post dated cheques and you would hurry them through to them.

By the way as was mentioned earlier about post dated cheques - the same rules apply in the UK. There is NO such thing as a post dated cheque. Once it has been written and signed it can be presented and paid. Cheques in the UK though can not be "cashed" as such. They take 3 to 4 working days (what a con that is) and it only goes in to a bank account.

Good luck and as has been mentioned many times before, the amount of time you have spent chasing payment is ridiculous. You have to wait for both cheques to clear and then wait until you have time to process them. Do not delay anyone elses work or work stupid hours to get them done.

I cannot continue reading this thread without speaking bluntly as professionally possibly.

Stop wasting your time. It's time to start taking action. It's as simple as that. Kindly inform the clients (NOT the father; unless his John Hancock is signed on the Client line, he has absolutely zero involvement) that if they do not pay up what you are owed as outlined in the signed contract they are in violation of the contract and as such you will be forced to litigate. You can even reassure them with a "that means you will be sued". I would allow them NO MORE than 2 weeks to follow through (2 weeks is very generous). If they continue to give you the runaround and you're still not paid by the end of those two weeks, notify them that you will no longer wish to have contact with them and that you will be filing a lawsuit. I wouldn't even give them the option of a mediator; they obviously want to make this as difficult as can be.

Best of luck to you.

Fortunately there are NOT many people out there like this couple. If the check bounces which it probably will, I think you should take them to small claims court to try to recover your money.

Court is the last thing I would ever want to do BUT... whether you win or lose.. .You need to get closure on this one way or the other.

5 years from now they may come up with the cash and say ..HEY where are my pictures PHOTOMAN, here is the money..

I truly hope their check does not bounce but time will tell.

Good luck !!!

Nomofica wrote in post #12883697
I cannot continue reading this thread without speaking bluntly as professionally possibly.

Stop wasting your time. It's time to start taking action. It's as simple as that. Kindly inform the clients (NOT the father; unless his John Hancock is signed on the Client line, he has absolutely zero involvement) that if they do not pay up what you are owed as outlined in the signed contract they are in violation of the contract and as such you will be forced to litigate. You can even reassure them with a "that means you will be sued". I would allow them NO MORE than 2 weeks to follow through (2 weeks is very generous). If they continue to give you the runaround and you're still not paid by the end of those two weeks, notify them that you will no longer wish to have contact with them and that you will be filing a lawsuit. I wouldn't even give them the option of a mediator; they obviously want to make this as difficult as can be.

Best of luck to you.

Agreed and time to take a hard line now..

Nomofica wrote in post #12883697
I cannot continue reading this thread without speaking bluntly as professionally possibly.

Stop wasting your time. It's time to start taking action. It's as simple as that. Kindly inform the clients (NOT the father; unless his John Hancock is signed on the Client line, he has absolutely zero involvement) that if they do not pay up what you are owed as outlined in the signed contract they are in violation of the contract and as such you will be forced to litigate. You can even reassure them with a "that means you will be sued". I would allow them NO MORE than 2 weeks to follow through (2 weeks is very generous). If they continue to give you the runaround and you're still not paid by the end of those two weeks, notify them that you will no longer wish to have contact with them and that you will be filing a lawsuit. I wouldn't even give them the option of a mediator; they obviously want to make this as difficult as can be.

Best of luck to you.

I agree with this too, Great post.

Nomofica wrote in post #12883697
I cannot continue reading this thread without speaking bluntly as professionally possibly.

Stop wasting your time. It's time to start taking action. It's as simple as that. Kindly inform the clients (NOT the father; unless his John Hancock is signed on the Client line, he has absolutely zero involvement) that if they do not pay up what you are owed as outlined in the signed contract they are in violation of the contract and as such you will be forced to litigate. You can even reassure them with a "that means you will be sued". I would allow them NO MORE than 2 weeks to follow through (2 weeks is very generous). If they continue to give you the runaround and you're still not paid by the end of those two weeks, notify them that you will no longer wish to have contact with them and that you will be filing a lawsuit. I wouldn't even give them the option of a mediator; they obviously want to make this as difficult as can be.

Best of luck to you.

Agreed I'm getting tired of these people FOR you, op. Give them a cutoff, sue them after that and get done with it. For your readers (us/our) sake, I'd hate for this story to have such an abrupt end but for yours and for your sanity, get these people out of your hair!

update:
Bride called me to ask to wait until Monday to cash the check.
I told her it was deposited this AM, shortly after the bank opened. Also told her to do anything she can to make sure this doesn't bounce, otherwise I will postponed her wedding until late October, when my schedule has more time for this stuff... she pleaded, but I told her to get off the phone and do whatever she can to secure that payment...

this should now go to bed... but I suspect it's going to be an issue for a while yet...

SMP_Homer wrote in post #12883931
update:
Bride called me to ask to wait until Monday to cash the check.
I told her it was deposited this AM, shortly after the bank opened. Also told her to do anything she can to make sure this doesn't bounce, otherwise I will postponed her wedding until late October, when my schedule has more time for this stuff... she pleaded, but I told her to get off the phone and do whatever she can to secure that payment...

this should now go to bed... but I suspect it's going to be an issue for a while yet...

So do what I suggested before. It's time to be a hardass about it. They're literally stealing money from you, and probably a good amount at that. Let's put it this way - put the wedding aside and say that the money you are owed is actually a camera that you own. Would you be so kind to somebody after they stole your camera? I know I wouldn't.

SMP_Homer wrote in post #12883931
update:
Bride called me to ask to wait until Monday to cash the check.
I told her it was deposited this AM, shortly after the bank opened. Also told her to do anything she can to make sure this doesn't bounce, otherwise I will postponed her wedding until late October, when my schedule has more time for this stuff... she pleaded, but I told her to get off the phone and do whatever she can to secure that payment...

this should now go to bed... but I suspect it's going to be an issue for a while yet...

NICE! I love how she pleads for you to not postpone work on their wedding as if what you do should be done for free.

[rant]
Photography is hard work just like anything. I have done a little dj'ing and people always look at me weird when I say I charged $300 for the one I did (They think that's very high). They look at it like "You stand around and play music for 5hours and walk away with $300. Nice." They don't realize I spend 5hrs under intense pressure at the wedding (don't want a song to skip, have to keep everything together, find requests, make sure sound sounds good, make sure everyone is having fun, etc) and for weeks before I'm preparing, putting together playlists, making sure I have songs, making sure I know the general schedule of the wedding. So in the end I'm really not making that much money but I get scoffed at.

People don't understand it's the same with photography. "All he does is take pictures" Yeah, spend hours fawning over these people (most of the time it's enjoyed I'm sure) and getting bossed around then spend another week's worth of time looking through the 500-1000+ pictures you took and editing and just general post processing. Then, if you offer prints you pay to print them all (in one way or the other) and package them in some nice way (albums/frames/etc).

And in both cases I still only covered the immediate half. How about the taxes and backing up data? How about equipment costs and time it takes to learn the skill to the point where people will pay you to do it?

They're lucky they aren't charged more!
[/rant]

Now, don't get me wrong, I love DJing and I love photography. I just don't like seeing people being accused of overcharging or not getting paid because people just assume we're nothing better than their cousin who is standing there with his PnS snapping pictures or their friend who brings a boombox with them and puts his mix tape on.

This also brings up a good point I never thought of before, if you run a business, is equipment a tax write off? I'm assuming you have to justify each purchase still? (Well my old portrait lens had a scratch on it

A couple of thoughts on this whole thread.

If that check bounces, there can be criminal charges. That coupled with a potential fraud charge (she admited they had no intention of abiding by the contract) could land them in hot water. I suspect they live their lives like this constantly and this is only the tip of the iceberg for them.

Too much bad effort and feelings have already been poured into this wedding. Anything you can do to get this off your plate and move on would be time/money well spent, even though you might not see any more money.

Wishing you the best of luck.

I would do what I could to avoid going to court.
Having a judgement against them does not mean you are going to get paid.
If you do, it can take a long time.

zagiace wrote in post #12884258
I would do what I could to avoid going to court.
Having a judgement against them does not mean you are going to get paid.
If you do, it can take a long time.

My main reason for not considering court is time...
I don't want to spare any time for these people. If/when they decide they need to pay up, then they'll benefit from my services
I don't anticipate them taking me to court - I'm sure a consult with a lawyer will tell them they have no leg to stand on
So I want to confirm the payment isn't clearing, and then I'm icing this until we're well into the fall...

Simply put, if you do not take it to court you will never see that money. They will have been able to cheat you and you will have rolled over onto your back and submitted to them. Why draft and have contracts signed if you do not want to enforce them? Seems rather counterproductive and pointless. You're wasting more time by waiting for them to possibly comply. Filing a lawsuit could open their eyes and see that you are serious and they could settle out of court. If they don't, the trial goes forth and you will most definitely be award your money. If they don't pay they get charged.


To run a photography business you not only need to be a good photographer but you also need to be a good businessman. If something is not going as it should be (especially when contracts are involved), you need to be able to put on the boxing gloves.

I hate to see photographers lose money and not do what's needed.

SMP_Homer wrote in post #12884334
My main reason for not considering court is time...
I don't want to spare any time for these people. If/when they decide they need to pay up, then they'll benefit from my services
I don't anticipate them taking me to court - I'm sure a consult with a lawyer will tell them they have no leg to stand on
So I want to confirm the payment isn't clearing, and then I'm icing this until we're well into the fall...

Thats why you use your own lawyer - don't waste your working time. Some money is better than nothing, and a letter costs you very little now. I haven't had to do this often, but it does happen.

Hope your experience with them changes, but I don't see that happening..

Not sure about Canada, here in the US having a judgement against someone means you can legally chase after them for the dough but does not mean they are going to pay you. If there is property involved you may be able to put a lien on it. It may affect their credit score. You can hire someone to hassle them.
You can still be blown off and not see a dime.
Often times you spend more money then you are owed in attempt to recover it. To many, it's just the principle.

In the US, its not always the best route. If it were me, I would try avoid court.
Google "getting paid in small claims" and you can see some of the pitfalls. It can become a huge mess.
IMO, a last resort.