to people who tried to make a living as a photographer

2DP wrote in post #12962280
You need to add an option of:

No, but I'll charge like a pro and deliver like a pro, but I'll make 6 figures in another occupation.

Thats where I would fit in.

I'm with 2DP, There's no way I'd want to ruin a perfectly good hobby trying to gross $400,000 just to net as much as I make in my day job. Family health insurance, retirement plan, weekends and evenings free, holidays off... Yep, no way.

ChunkyDA wrote in post #12965599
I'm with 2DP, There's no way I'd want to ruin a perfectly good hobby trying to gross $400,000 just to net as much as I make in my day job. Family health insurance, retirement plan, weekends and evenings free, holidays off... Yep, no way.

thinly veiled brag in this post

looks like the 38.24% succeeded. so much for the 1% stat

The problem is people who start a facebook page and small portfolio or just print buisness cards CAN steal buisness away from the people who do it right. And they don't understand anything of cost and lowball the hell out of the rest and people go with them for that reason. Not everyone who hires a photographer understands whats involved with being a good one. They see a price thats half as much as the competition and go with them based on that alone. Sure, there work will show through and they probably won't get repeat buisness, but how many times does the average joe need a photographer??

ChunkyDA wrote in post #12965599
I'm with 2DP, There's no way I'd want to ruin a perfectly good hobby trying to gross $400,000 just to net as much as I make in my day job. Family health insurance, retirement plan, weekends and evenings free, holidays off... Yep, no way.

Wow that sounds cool, what do you do?

mikekelley wrote in post #12965445
this is the most perfect post I've seen in months. agreed on all counts. making a facebook page and taking wedding pics for a friend shouldn't count as an earnest attempt at 'starting a business'

Yes couldn't agree more either...

Awesome posts in this thread, you can't just take good pictures, you have to be a good business man. If you make a lasting impression in potential and current clients, they call you and their friends and you get more clients, lenses, lights, pretty soon you have a full time studio and medium format cameras..

I have plenty of high school friends who buy an SLR and say they are trying to get into photography, and all they do is make a facebook fan page and take free portraits of their friends and hope someone will message them or something. That would fall into the 99%

mikekelley wrote in post #12965652
thinly veiled brag in this post

Karl Johnston wrote in post #12965678
Wow that sounds cool, what do you do?

It is what it is. After retiring from the Air Force I now fly a desk and shuffle papers. I have no window but I see it as payback for the best 22 years a guy like me can have after college. BTW, Mike, your real estate work is outstanding, I remember when you first started posting here a few years ago.

Now back to the OP and the reason for this thread. Most people who claim that they tried to make photography a career really didn't try hard enough. Education, continuing education, investment, improvement, hard work, networking, salesmanship, marketing, originality, creative artistry, luck... You cant live and save for a comfortable retirement with just one or two of these ten or more words in your life.

One thing photographers seem to be guilty of and one big reason that I've seen most fail is they try to be everything. Not many people can be great at everything. Not many at all. My advice is do what you love. Hire and get help in the areas you are weak in. Most creatives (right brain) are not good with accounting and general business (left brain). Start wit ha great accountant that knows how to handle taxes for professional photographers and someone that can give you good business advise and follow that advise. If you have a studio hire someone that can manage the studio. And id you are a commercial photographer get a rep to take care of the marketing. That will free you up to do what you love and will ultimately do best.

A chef usually hires or partners with a restaurant manager to run the restaurant. That frees him to do what he does. Physicians have practice managers to run the practice. And one thing they all have is good accountants.

mileslong24 wrote in post #12965677
The problem is people who start a facebook page and small portfolio or just print buisness cards CAN steal buisness away from the people who do it right. And they don't understand anything of cost and lowball the hell out of the rest and people go with them for that reason. Not everyone who hires a photographer understands whats involved with being a good one. They see a price thats half as much as the competition and go with them based on that alone. Sure, there work will show through and they probably won't get repeat buisness, but how many times does the average joe need a photographer??

And this is where a successful photographer can make the difference. Avoid those clients, and go after clients that do know photography, understand what good photography is, and know it costly in the end.

If you shoot portraits or weddings for example, you will be competing with those just trying to make money for new equipment. You'll also face those clients that have no idea what it really takes to run a photography business, and want to pay department store portrait prices.

But if you step it up, take the time to really learn the harder skills, and focus on a market that pays well, you can be successful and do very well. Ie, for example something like high speed photography. You need a $100K camera, it shoots 180K frames a second, very specialized, and your competition won't be amateurs, but working professionals also trying to make a decent livining and recover real overheads costs. Pricing will be more realistic in the end.

You can rent the camera, learn how to shoot it, create a portfolio, target potential clients, invest in marketing, advertising, portfolio development, etc, and end up making $5K per day for your skills. Thats an honest attempt at making it a business IMO.

airfrogusmc wrote in post #12966311
One thing photographers seem to be guilty of and one big reason that I've seen most fail is they try to be everything. Not many people can be great at everything. Not many at all.

Ditto, I see this too. Showing great wedding and portrait images, but also listing commercial, editorial, advertising, landscape, fashion, etc, and showing a couple of mediocre images at best. They diluted their excellent work with below average images, and made them overall average at best. They would be better served showing only their best work, and if thats just weddings, or commercial, or landscape, that thats what they should advertise since that is what they are good at.

If you look at all the very successful photographers, they are all known for very specific work, and advertise that as their focus. Thats how they got to where they are.

I've been very lucky in my photo career, I actually started off as a hobby and kept at it. Now I do advertising photography during the week weddings and events on weekends and now getting into video.

I'm a true believer if you want something bad enough you'll get it.

Photo99

Photo99 wrote in post #12968121
I'm a true believer if you want something bad enough you'll get it.

Photo99

If that were true, the world would be filled with people with x-ray vision and no one would be starving, killed in wars or forced to see their child die of cancer.

Disney didn't create the world, nature did. and nature doesn't care what we want.

quiksquirrel wrote in post #12968171
If that were true, the world would be filled with people with x-ray vision and no one would be starving, killed in wars or forced to see their child die of cancer.

Disney didn't create the world, nature did. and nature doesn't care what we want.

I am giving you the benefit of the doubt into thinking that is one of the most ridiculous analogies with respect to working hard at making a business successful, I have ever heard.

Photo99, i understand your context as most everyone else would. Good for you for getting through the hard times to now have the good times.

My girlfriend does photography as a second job for additional income. She started two years ago and has gone from 0 weddings to 18 weddings in those two years. Her goal is to eventually make it a full time gig. She needs around 30-40 weddings a year to make that happen.