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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 29 Aug 2011 (Monday) 02:41
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Pixel King ETTL Trigger Controller

 
CliveyBoy
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Aug 16, 2012 16:29 |  #556

Eggwhite wrote in post #14867135 (external link)
The eTTL calculations seem to be producing an underexposed flash by 2 stops.

I am in a small room with the flash pointed strait up an a white ceiling only 7 ft. I had one or two pop nice, but now everything seems to be underexposed. I have to set FEC to +2 in order to get an even exposure. Bouncing off this short distance shouldn't be so dark.

Actually, it should be so dark - the camera is trying to produce a mid-tone grey. You confirm that it is doing as designed by Canon. The solution is to use FEC, as you did.

Flash exposure is evaluated by the same camera gear as ambient exposure. And uses the same zones. The zoom function on a uniform wall can affect the intensity of lighting within the zones.

The camera does all the ETTL work; the Kings simply communicate the results.


Clive, and Great G/D Abbie
50D; 580EXII, 430EXII, 550EX, YN685EX; YN-622C II, YN622C-TX and YN560-TX controllers TOYUG II v5.10 YN622 System Guide (external link)
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CliveyBoy
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Aug 16, 2012 16:40 |  #557

innerimages wrote in post #14854053 (external link)
Is that the correct power up sequence? Mine is: flash 1, rx 1, flash 2, rx 2, (flash x, rx x) tx 1, body 1, tx 2, body 2.

I had noted that you were using two cameras to drive one set of flashes. I intend to test that configuration, but there are some problems. When camera B takes a shot, the settings on the flashes will be updated to all the settings in Camera B. They may not be the same as in camera A. This continual resetting will use a great deal more power.

It is also essential that the firing of the two cameras be synchronised. Two bodies with different lenses slung around one neck should work. With a second photographer, likely it would not.

Also, more time between half and full shutter would be needed for the TX to rebuild its map and update all the remotes and their displays.


Clive, and Great G/D Abbie
50D; 580EXII, 430EXII, 550EX, YN685EX; YN-622C II, YN622C-TX and YN560-TX controllers TOYUG II v5.10 YN622 System Guide (external link)
I tried retiring, but gave it up - it's a dead end

  
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CliveyBoy
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Aug 16, 2012 16:50 |  #558

I did find using one body and two sets of flashes solved an annual problem.

Flashes for fill needed on the opposite side of a finish line. They cannot be reached for 5 hours. 1500 shots minimum. Batteries, even with battery pack, get exhausted.

So, I set two remotes/flashes up before the race, using two different channels. All that was needed was to change channels when the first setup was low. The batteries in the second-set RX need to be good, as it does listen in for the full period, and evaluates every command sent, even those not intended for it.


Clive, and Great G/D Abbie
50D; 580EXII, 430EXII, 550EX, YN685EX; YN-622C II, YN622C-TX and YN560-TX controllers TOYUG II v5.10 YN622 System Guide (external link)
I tried retiring, but gave it up - it's a dead end

  
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CliveyBoy
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Aug 16, 2012 17:07 |  #559

eggwhite - another aspect: depending on your ambient light settings, you may be exceeding the ability of the flash to deliver.


Clive, and Great G/D Abbie
50D; 580EXII, 430EXII, 550EX, YN685EX; YN-622C II, YN622C-TX and YN560-TX controllers TOYUG II v5.10 YN622 System Guide (external link)
I tried retiring, but gave it up - it's a dead end

  
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Eggwhite
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Aug 17, 2012 12:04 |  #560

CliveyBoy wrote in post #14867541 (external link)
Actually, it should be so dark - the camera is trying to produce a mid-tone grey. You confirm that it is doing as designed by Canon. The solution is to use FEC, as you did.

Flash exposure is evaluated by the same camera gear as ambient exposure. And uses the same zones. The zoom function on a uniform wall can affect the intensity of lighting within the zones.

The camera does all the ETTL work; the Kings simply communicate the results.

CliveyBoy, I understand what you are saying about the areas evaluated for exposure. However I think this is different. This condition doesn not occur when the 580 is mounted to the camera, or when using the ST-E2. I also tested on a different body (50d) and have similar results. The results vary by lens/zoom.

The lighter image was taken with the ST-E2

IMAGE NOT FOUND
IMAGE IS A REDIRECT OR MISSING!
Content warning: data
(DUPLICATE IMAGE)
(DUPLICATE IMAGE)
The darker image was taken with the KING
(don't know why I can't embed the images via a link, so I am attaching)

Both images taken with same camera settings. ISO 200, 1/160, f4, Sigma 70-200 2.8 at 70.


IMAGE NOT FOUND
IMAGE IS A REDIRECT OR MISSING!
Content warning: data



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HOSTED PHOTO
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- eggwhite -
The Box --- Canon 5DII, 50D The Glass --- EF 24-70 2.8, EF 28-135 IS USM, EF 70-300 IS USM, EF 50 1.8, EFs 18-55, Tamron SP 17-50 F/2.8 VC.
The Gear --- Manfroto 055xprob Tripod with 322RC2 Head, Canon 580EXII, Sunpak PZ42X Speedlight.

  
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Eggwhite
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Aug 17, 2012 12:13 |  #561

An additional example as it relates to ZOOM.
The lighter image is exposed correctly and taken at a 38mm zoom
The darker image is the result of zooming to 42mm. (The only thing that changed)

580EXII using the KING

Both taken with the same camera settings, using the Canon 24-70 2.8 EF-L. ISO 200, 1/160, f4.


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- eggwhite -
The Box --- Canon 5DII, 50D The Glass --- EF 24-70 2.8, EF 28-135 IS USM, EF 70-300 IS USM, EF 50 1.8, EFs 18-55, Tamron SP 17-50 F/2.8 VC.
The Gear --- Manfroto 055xprob Tripod with 322RC2 Head, Canon 580EXII, Sunpak PZ42X Speedlight.

  
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Eggwhite
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Aug 17, 2012 18:21 |  #562

The ZOOM related / UNDER Exposure ISSUE now has definition and (at least in my head) better understanding / resolution.

First, I am a fan of the RTFM mantra, however the manual is a bit vague in this regard. But it had the clue to resolve a really odd set of circumstances.

The issue:
Using Pixel KING remote flash triggers:
When using zoom lens, wide angle exposures are correct, however when zoomed to a certain point (near 40mm on a Canon 24-70) or when using lenses with higher zoom starting point ( ie: 70-200 at any range) the exposure is not calculated correctly and appears to be under exposed by approx. 2 f-stops.

The issue was replicated using Pixel Knights too. (explanation to follow)

Resolution:
With Pixel KING mounted to Canon camera, use camera menu controls
Navigate to "External Speedlite Control" then "Flash function settings"
Insure "E-TTL II" setting is set to "Average" (DO NOT USE "Evaluative")

I am not sure of the default state of this setting, however it must be changed to "Average".

Addition info regarding the Pixel Knight failure in my testing:
With a Pixel Knight installed the "External Speedlite Control" and "Flash function settings" are not available via the camera menus.
If the "E-TTL II" setting is set to "Evaluative" prior to using the Pixel Knight, the ZOOM/Exposure issue will occur.
Since it is not possible to change the setting with a Knight attached, move the speedlite to the camera, access the camera menu to change the "E-TTL II" setting to "Average" then use the Knights normally.
The setting change seems to stay and exposures are calculated correctly throughout the zoom range and on longer zoom lenses.

I hope this can be confirmed by the gurus here, and is useful to others!

Ed


- eggwhite -
The Box --- Canon 5DII, 50D The Glass --- EF 24-70 2.8, EF 28-135 IS USM, EF 70-300 IS USM, EF 50 1.8, EFs 18-55, Tamron SP 17-50 F/2.8 VC.
The Gear --- Manfroto 055xprob Tripod with 322RC2 Head, Canon 580EXII, Sunpak PZ42X Speedlight.

  
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CliveyBoy
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Aug 17, 2012 18:31 |  #563

(Posted before Post#562 appeared on my computer.)

It is likely that you are not providing time and input for the Kings to re-initialise itself and the remote flashes (especially after swapping gear), before you force a full shutter and the flash is told to fire, even 'tho the flash is at a random pont of re-initialisation.

Not also that the Kings revert to factory default settings on power-up, including resetting some camera parameters.


Clive, and Great G/D Abbie
50D; 580EXII, 430EXII, 550EX, YN685EX; YN-622C II, YN622C-TX and YN560-TX controllers TOYUG II v5.10 YN622 System Guide (external link)
I tried retiring, but gave it up - it's a dead end

  
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Eggwhite
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Aug 17, 2012 18:49 |  #564

CliveyBoy wrote in post #14872259 (external link)
(Posted before Post#562 appeared on my computer.)

It is likely that you are not providing time and input for the Kings to re-initialise itself and the remote flashes (especially after swapping gear), before you force a full shutter and the flash is told to fire, even 'tho the flash is at a random pont of re-initialisation.

Not also that the Kings revert to factory default settings on power-up, including resetting some camera parameters.

Clive,
I'm glad you've seen post #562!
I spent all day today being very systematic with several lenses , bodies, speedlites and all three types of remotes I have. I was very intentional with startup and timing, including making sure the speedlites had enough time to be recycled from shot to shot.

As you can see from post #562, I think I've identified the issue. Do you have the ability to confirm with your gear, by setting the E-TTLII type?
Do you think this should be reported to Pixel?

Again, thanks much for the advice and expertise!

Ed


- eggwhite -
The Box --- Canon 5DII, 50D The Glass --- EF 24-70 2.8, EF 28-135 IS USM, EF 70-300 IS USM, EF 50 1.8, EFs 18-55, Tamron SP 17-50 F/2.8 VC.
The Gear --- Manfroto 055xprob Tripod with 322RC2 Head, Canon 580EXII, Sunpak PZ42X Speedlight.

  
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2Live4
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Oct 07, 2012 12:35 |  #565
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Ready to buy the Pixel King. Has anyone here bought these from the seller "DSLRKIT"? Seems like they have the best price right now. Or suggesting buying from any of the other vendors?

http://www.amazon.com …mbc?ie=UTF8&con​dition=all (external link)


~Khánh - an amateur bOkeh-OLic
5D III & Some L's
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HiRes
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Oct 11, 2012 06:36 |  #566

2Live4 wrote in post #15090833 (external link)
Ready to buy the Pixel King. Has anyone here bought these from the seller "DSLRKIT"?

Personally I'd wait as the Pixel King II TTL trigger has just been introduced (external link).No price or other details revealed though.


6D | 50D | 24-70 f/2.8L II | 70-200 f/2.8L IS II| 70-200 f/4L | 35 f/2 | Sigma 50 f/1.4 |Sigma 17-70 f/2.8-4.5 | 430EX | 580EX II

  
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Scooby888
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Oct 16, 2012 16:40 |  #567

mrrikki wrote in post #13653525 (external link)
Ok; just gone through the list again...checked all connections and made sure camera on before flash as per the sequence below that.

It seems to be working now; switching from ettl to manual, high speed to 1st curtain, and also zoom from auto to manual and back.

Fingers crossed; will need to put it on the umbrella and do some test shots on exposure to see if it is really fixed, too late to do that bow nearly midnight and wife is getting annoyed with the flash lol.

Hi, I'm having exactly the problems you are/were. Can you tell me if you resolved them and did the problems return?

Thanks


5DII Gripped, 7D Gripped, Canon 60D, Tokina 11-16 f2.8, Canon 17-55 f2.8, Tokina 50-135 f2.8, Canon 24-70 f2.8 L, Canon 24-105 L f4, Canon 70-200 f4 L IS, Canon 70-200 f2.8 L IS, Canon 100-400 f4.5-5.6 L, Canon EF 100 L Macro f2.8, Canon 50mm f1.4, Canon 1.4tc mkii, Speedlite 580ii, 2x Speedlite 430ii, Monfrotto tripods

  
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JOSX2
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Nov 06, 2012 13:01 |  #568

HiRes wrote in post #15107351 (external link)
Personally I'd wait as the Pixel King II TTL trigger has just been introduced (external link).No price or other details revealed though.

Hey Cliveboy - are you able to get any inside scoop on when these would be coming out? and/or prices too? I'm itching to pick up a 3rd speedlight...I"ve got the Pixel KIng systems, but want the II's...and I'd prefer not to pick up another Pixel King transceiver if the II's are coming out anytime soon.


website: Jim O'Sullivan Photography (external link) | Facebook (external link)
The Camera:  |- Gripped 60D  -|- EF-S 50mm f/1.8 II -|- Canon 24-70mm f/4 -|- Canon 70-200 f/4 -|
Speedlights:   |- 3 Yongnou YN600EX-RT Speedlights -|- YN-E3-RT Transmitter -|
Studio Strobes:  |- Alien Bee B800 & B1600 -|- CyberSync Wireless system -|

  
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RTatis
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Nov 11, 2012 15:26 |  #569

Hi All,
I searched this thread and have not seen this brought up but it may have already and I simply did not see it, my apologies if it has.

Just got a set of Pixel King's and can't seem to use my 580EXII in Manual mode. As soon as I press the shutter on my 5D classic to focus the 580EXII changes to ETTL mode. I think I've tried everything to make it stay in manual mode but nothing I've tried has worked. I understand the 5D doesn't have flash menu control but shouldn't I still be able to use my 580EXII in manual mode?

Thanks in advance.


Body: Canon EOS 5D Mark II
Lens: 24-70L | 70-200L f/2.8L IS MKII | 50L | 85mm f/1.8
--=my flickr (external link)=--

  
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booja
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Nov 12, 2012 12:24 |  #570

ive had these for quite some time now and ive encountered my first problem about 2 weeks ago on a paid shoot. the triggers would not fire in manual at all. only in ettl. very odd... i was controlling everything through my camera and the settings would change on every flash but no pop. only in ettl. changed channels, groups, batteries, moved the flashes around... nothing. lucky for me my friend was with me with his rf603's. saved the day for me.

went home and reinstalled the firmware (which is still a big pain in the ass, windows keeps reporting a problem and closes it out. takes me like 20 tries with each one). after reinstalling they work fine now i think. i just did test pops around the house and they work. hope it doesnt do this to me again




  
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Pixel King ETTL Trigger Controller
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