I need your advice on photo requests from HS coach/school

This is my 1st year shooting HS football and the AD agreed to allow me to shoot the games. I don't expect to make much off of selling prints, but figured I could work on my game shooting skills and marketing skills. Well, I was told by some one here that the school, booster club etc. may request some images for their web site. Today, I've received that request.

So my question is - how did you'll handle such request?

If you did provide them with images, what was your limit on the number images you provided?

I'd appreciate any help.

Thanks...Al

What do you value your time, knowledge, and equipment at?

I always give images for the teams website, yearbook etc.. when asked. I also take out an ad in the teams booster book. They support you and you should show your support for the team. Files are a small price to pay to keep the job. The fact is, if you don't supply a small amount of photos, they will find someone who will. At a lot of schools, they expect a % of your sales. (They call it a donation, I call it a kickback)

Mike, how many photos do you typically provide the school for their website and what size files do typically provide them?

Thanks...Al

Mike R wrote in post #13206553
I always give images for the teams website, yearbook etc.. when asked. I also take out an ad in the teams booster book. They support you and you should show your support for the team. Files are a small price to pay to keep the job. The fact is, if you don't supply a small amount of photos, they will find someone who will. At a lot of schools, they expect a % of your sales. (They call it a donation, I call it a kickback)

I'm with Mike...sort of. I trade some images for an add in the year book. Not much per image (this year they needed only images from softball and baseball). Gave them five from each sport and they were sized to 500pix on the long side.

On this same I'll make a slide show for each sport's banquet of most of the images. Burn it on a CD and give it to the coach. Payment for that item is letting me setup my catalog of images for that sport along with order forms. Keeps the coaches happy (one less thing for them to do) and I'll sell at least three figures at each banquet...typically it's the grandparents that don't "do" (or trust paying by CC) the internet thing. So just say'n a happy AD/Coach will mean more to you then what you'll lose selling them a handfull of low res images.

And with that said, I'd pick out 5 to 8 of your favorite images, add a small water mark on the lower left corner and sent them out.

Hey thanks for the feedback DWarren. I do agree that its a small cost for doing business and have no issue with providing them with some images, especially since they want to put my website on their home page.

Dwarren, did you place any stipulations on the images you provided them?

dwarrenr wrote in post #13208934
I'm with Mike...sort of. I trade some images for an add in the year book. Not much per image (this year they needed only images from softball and baseball). Gave them five from each sport and they were sized to 500pix on the long side.

They want to put my website on their school site so parents, faculty, students etc can get to it.

On this same I'll make a slide show for each sport's banquet of most of the images. Burn it on a CD and give it to the coach. Payment for that item is letting me setup my catalog of images for that sport along with order forms.

Keeps the coaches happy (one less thing for them to do) and I'll sell at least three figures at each banquet...typically it's the grandparents that don't "do" (or trust paying by CC) the internet thing. So just say'n a happy AD/Coach will mean more to you then what you'll lose selling them a handfull of low res images.

So you sell printed images at the banquet. Great idea. I will keep that in mind when or if they have their banquet. What size images do you typically have for sell or do you sell a cd with images of the individual kids on it or both? It's good to hear and get different ideas - much olbliged.

And with that said, I'd pick out 5 to 8 of your favorite images, add a small water mark on the lower left corner and sent them out.

Why do you pick the images and not allow them to pick them?

Thanks...Al

Methodical wrote in post #13209059
So you sell printed images at the banquet. Great idea. I will keep that in mind when or if they have their banquet. What size images do you typically have for sell or do you sell a cd with images of the individual kids on it or both? It's good to hear and get different ideas - much olbliged.

I have a three ring binder with all of my images printed on letter size paper. There are nine images per page and my image number is printed in the lower portion of each image. I then put those images in the plastic protective sleeves. I update (add) new images to it each week and our local booster club keeps it on display at their booth. They collect the orders and the money and hand it back after the game. I'll take that same binder to the banquet. I only take orders for prints. I'll then have my print house print the images then deliver the photographs to the school and they'll get them to the kids. One of the boosters clubs fund raiser is selling buttons of the athletes to the parents. My trade for them working my binder is taking the images of the kids. I then supply them with the images and they order the buttons. They've been doing this for years and I would not dare step on their toes and try to sell the same thing to the parents. So I trade that with the man hours I'd have to supply to man my binder while I'm shooting the game.

Methodical wrote in post #13209059
Why do you pick the images and not allow them to pick them?

That's just how I roll. LOL It's easier, trust me. Getting the year book sponcor to take the time and cruse my webpage and let me know which ones she prefers...is next to impossible to me. So rather then wait on her then dig through the images, I just select what I considered the best (both in composition and appearance.) I think of it as "my add" so I want to control what people are associating with my name.

Sounds like a good plan you have there. Sounds like you use LR3 custom print module to create your proof like sheets.

Thanks again.

dwarrenr wrote in post #13209141
I have a three ring binder with all of my images printed on letter size paper. There are nine images per page and my image number is printed in the lower portion of each image. I then put those images in the plastic protective sleeves. I update (add) new images to it each week and our local booster club keeps it on display at their booth. They collect the orders and the money and hand it back after the game. I'll take that same binder to the banquet. I only take orders for prints. I'll then have my print house print the images then deliver the photographs to the school and they'll get them to the kids. One of the boosters clubs fund raiser is selling buttons of the athletes to the parents. My trade for them working my binder is taking the images of the kids. I then supply them with the images and they order the buttons. They've been doing this for years and I would not dare step on their toes and try to sell the same thing to the parents. So I trade that with the man hours I'd have to supply to man my binder while I'm shooting the game.


That's just how I roll. LOL It's easier, trust me. Getting the year book sponcor to take the time and cruse my webpage and let me know which ones she prefers...is next to impossible to me. So rather then wait on her then dig through the images, I just select what I considered the best (both in composition and appearance.) I think of it as "my add" so I want to control what people are associating with my name.

Methodical wrote in post #13209219
Sounds like a good plan you have there. Sounds like you use LR3 custom print module to create your proof like sheets.

Thanks again.

hahaha...actually I use the Microsoft picture and fax viewer. I have a color laser at work that I use to print them as well.

I use Faststone image view to re-size them to 580 on the long side, rename them and add the image number with a green background so it stands out. Here is what one looks like:

MIME changed to 'text/html' | Content warning: script

Cool

I take a more proactive approach since I really like getting money if am going to show up. Before seasons start, I approach the boosters with a proposal which includes shooting x number of games and providing images for use. I charge flat rates depending on what the needs are. Bottom line is this, it pays to go through the boosters with a prearranged fee. Parents will tell you 1,000 different stories about how they are going to check out your galleries and buy images but rarely do and schools will want free images for their own use. If you are really lucky (and ambitious in pursuing them) a newspaper might even pay you $5/image for a shot at a big game that they missed or had no coverage at. Point is, its very hard to make money, especially if shooting spec. Make sure you get paid for being there whether you sell a single image. If the boosters don't want to pay, then the last resort is seeing if they will assist you in getting the team's T&I work, senior nights, or even coordinating a group of parents who will purchase a game CD at a flat rate. If none of the above happens, I leave my gear at home, grab a foam finger and cheer my team on from the stands.

I apologize if I am not seeming to encourage marketing and sales to parents but in my area at least, spec parent sales on individual images is a complete waste of time and this has proven itself out of years of trying. Pay me up front, or don't ask for my files, its that simple.

namasste wrote in post #13213118
I take a more proactive approach since I really like getting money if am going to show up. Before seasons start, I approach the boosters with a proposal which includes shooting x number of games and providing images for use. I charge flat rates depending on what the needs are. Bottom line is this, it pays to go through the boosters with a prearranged fee. Parents will tell you 1,000 different stories about how they are going to check out your galleries and buy images but rarely do and schools will want free images for their own use. If you are really lucky (and ambitious in pursuing them) a newspaper might even pay you $5/image for a shot at a big game that they missed or had no coverage at. Point is, its very hard to make money, especially if shooting spec. Make sure you get paid for being there whether you sell a single image. If the boosters don't want to pay, then the last resort is seeing if they will assist you in getting the team's T&I work, senior nights, or even coordinating a group of parents who will purchase a game CD at a flat rate. If none of the above happens, I leave my gear at home, grab a foam finger and cheer my team on from the stands.

That is a good point. 80% of the time I'll be shooting for our local paper, so the added sales is gravy. I do have a quick question for you Scott, if you don't mind answering. I know it's different in each locations...but what sort of price range are we talking about here on a per game basis. What would the range be per game with image sales being spec, and or the flat fee for images on a CD? If you don't want to answer in public feel free to PM me please. I'm currently talking with a school to shoot two of their JV and Varsity basketball games.

Thanks,
Warren

dwarrenr wrote in post #13213162
That is a good point. 80% of the time I'll be shooting for our local paper, so the added sales is gravy. I do have a quick question for you Scott, if you don't mind answering. I know it's different in each locations...but what sort of price range are we talking about here on a per game basis. What would the range be per game with image sales being spec, and or the flat fee for images on a CD? If you don't want to answer in public feel free to PM me please. I'm currently talking with a school to shoot two of their JV and Varsity basketball games.

Thanks,
Warren

I don't mind Warren but thanks for asking. My typical "game rate" is $125, and I'll negotiate that down if they are looking for a package (I did hockey last year at $500 for 5 games). I agreed to a minimum of 75 professionally edited images/game and would provide a CD of those images within 48 hrs. I also promise to get at least one image of every kid. If they don't see any action, I do candids of them with their team. I normally do not like giving CD's since you never really know what parents will do with them to present your images in a way that is, ummm, less than your standard. For instance, I've had parents proudly show me some of the PS work they'd done on an image I shot and gave on CD. Grrrrrr! Regardless, I know that if I didn't do it like this I'd have to approach individual parents (time consuming and frustrating), gather what little I could in orders (time consuming and frustrating), process and print orders (yep, time consuming and...), deliver orders and collect money (you guessed it, time consuming and frustrating). The nice part is that if you go through the AD, coach, or boosters, they'll do much of the marketing for you. They get the parents excited that they could have a pro shooter cover their kids game and explain that if each parent coughed up $10 (MUCH cheaper than buying individual images), they could hire me. Parents also like the CD's since they use them for year end banquet slideshows which takes the burden off of them to make one themselves (another BIG selling point). The great news is that if successful, you'll be assured of being paid for your time while avoiding the pitfalls of spec sales.

I hope this helps. FYI, I based my game rates loosely on what MaxPreps has paid me in the past for a game rate (yes, they do pay game rates at times). Mine is slightly lower since I retain 100% of any additional sales whereas with MP, I only get 80%.

Man Scott that is great approach. How long after you began shooting sports before you began requesting such arrangements. I read one of your posts where in the beginning you were having a tough time getting connections etc (in one of those stickies up top). So how long after you got the connections did you begin this sort of approach? Also, how long did you do spec sale type work before you went to your current method?

Thanks...Al

Methodical wrote in post #13213401
Man Scott that is great approach. How long after you began shooting sports before you began requesting such arrangements. I read one of your posts where in the beginning you were having a tough time getting connections etc (in one of those stickies up top). So how long after you got the connections did you begin this sort of approach? Also, how long did you do spec sale type work before you went to your current method?

Thanks...Al

Hey Al, I shot spec for about 3 years before my frustration was redlining and I had to try something new. Blood pressure has dropped significantly since. The prep level connections were easy as I already knew most of the parents and administrators and coaches since they are in my community. Outside of that it was tougher but I found that there is no time-frame, its simply a matter of asking (I was shocked at what that did for me!). I've even gone so far as to call the AD from visiting schools, tell them my setup, and see if they are interested. Its usually a no but if they say yes, its a huge bonus since I was already begin paid by my school's boosters (or parent group) to be there.