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Thread started 07 Oct 2011 (Friday) 11:45
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Most Distortion in Fisheye for Crops? (non-circular)

 
Fahad79
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Oct 07, 2011 11:45 |  #1

As far as I can tell, there are:

1) Samyang, Rokinon, Vivitar, Opteka (all the same)

2) Sigma 8mm (circular fisheye for FF, but works like the others on crop, with vignetting)

3) Sigma 10mm (designed for crops)

4) Peleng 8mm (not sure if it's the same as (1))

So, which of those lenses offer the most distorted images? How bad is the vignetting?

I can't tell from online pictures/videos because so much of them seem to be cropped or resized.

I would appreciate any input. Thank you.




  
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Madweasel
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Oct 07, 2011 13:32 |  #2

The Samyang 8mm and Sigma 10mm lenses both give a rectangular fisheye view that fills the crop sensor. The difference in focal length is explained by the fact that they use different projection geometries. The Peleng and Sigma 8mm lenses are both circular fisheyes designed for 35mm/FF, but when cropped slightly can be used to give a rectangular fisheye image on a crop camera. All variations will give approximately the same amount of distortion.

There is also the Tokina 10-17mm fisheye zoom, designed for crop cameras, but capable of providing all three of Canon's sensor sizes with a rectangular fisheye, and the ultimate; the new Canon 8-15L, which can do that AND provide FF sensors with a circular fisheye image. Interestingly it is also the only one designed to give a full 180-degree field of view on a Canon APS-C sensor (since the others are designed to accommodate the slightly larger Nikon sensor), though you can also achieve that by cropping the image from the Sigma and Peleng 8mm lenses.


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Fahad79
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Oct 09, 2011 05:04 |  #3

Thank for the info, Madweasel!

Yeah I researched the 8-15mm f/4L, but it's kind of useless (IMO) for crops considering the price and other options available.

So, basically all the rectangular fisheye's give the same distortion?




  
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Madweasel
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Oct 09, 2011 05:56 |  #4

Fahad79 wrote in post #13224204 (external link)
...So, basically all the rectangular fisheye's give the same distortion?

Yes. The only lenses to avoid are the 15 or 16mm fisheyes designed to give a rectangular image on a 35mm/FF sensor, as the crop cameras cut out too much of the distorted edges.

In my opinion the best option for APS-C format is the Sigma 10mm, or if you want to save money and can do without AF, go for the Samyang (etc.).


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Fahad79
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Oct 09, 2011 06:19 |  #5

Madweasel wrote in post #13224248 (external link)
In my opinion the best option for APS-C format is the Sigma 10mm, or if you want to save money and can do without AF, go for the Samyang (etc.).

Cool. Thanks again.




  
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gremlin75
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Oct 09, 2011 11:51 as a reply to  @ Fahad79's post |  #6

Madweasel wrote in post #13224248 (external link)
In my opinion the best option for APS-C format is the Sigma 10mm, or if you want to save money and can do without AF, go for the Samyang (etc.).

I have the Rokinon branded 8mm fisheye. At first I didn't think it had as crazy distortion as other fisheye lenses but as I look at more photo samples of other fisheye lenses I realize that it has about the same as any other. It may just be me so I'd suggest looking through photo sample threads to see which lens gives the effect you're looking for the most. Personly I used to not be a fan of large amount of distortion. I picked the Rokinon because I felt it didn't over do the distortion and the price is great.

I will say that even though the Rokinon is full manual it is a joy to use. No AF is no problem. I just shoot it at f8 with focus to infinity and eveything from 4 feet (about 1.3m) to infinity is in focus. Obviously this does not work if you get closer to a subject and focusing with a lens this wide is damn near impossible. You can seriously rotate the focus ring from one extreme to the other and see no change until after you shoot the photo and examine it.

Also the Rokinon (and other it's other branded counterparts) give no vignetting on a crop.




  
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nureality
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Oct 09, 2011 12:11 |  #7

I own the Peleng 8 and the Vivitar 7.5 (Samyang 8mm guts) and they are very different in projection. The Peleng 8 is a circular fisheye and I'd rented the Sigma 8 to compare it to my lens, what I found is that the Peleng is sharper across the frame except for the outer rim of the image circle (what others might refer to as its vignette). Its an incredibly sharp lens and I love it. But I'll say from experience that its important to get it in M42 mount and screw it into an EOS-M42 adaptor instead of getting the EOS mount ring version, the EOS mount that Peleng makes is wobbly and does not mount as solidly as an M42 version will. I had to learn this the hard way.

As for the Vivitar/Samyang/Rokino​n/etc's they aren't as sharp as the Peleng but are very capable lenses with a wildly different projection (rectangular and made for crops), its focal length is closer to 10mm than it is to 8mm. Both lenses have their place in my bag and I have to decide before I head out which shot I want that day. But they are both compact enough to carry both most days.

As for the Canon 8-15 f/4L, I wouldn't say its useless to crops, because it was designed to offer both circular and rectangular fisheye shots on all 3 formats Canon currently offers. Making it a unique lens.

The Tokina 10-17 offers rectangular fisheyes in a zoom package, it is based on the old SMC-F Pentax 17-28 Fisheye Zoom (which with a EOS-PK adaptor can be used on an EOS body as well, but will give next to no Fisheye effect on a crop body, but will serve as the same lens as the Toki 10-17 on a FF).

There are 2 lenses you failed to list, which are the only 2 crop lenses designed and able to deliver a true circular fisheye shot (complete with the FULL circle vignette on a crop body) - they are the Sigma 4.5mm f/2.8 DC EX HSM and the Sunex Superfisheye 5.6mm f/5.6. The Sunex isn't well known, and it has the distinction as having a fixed aperture, there is no IRIS. Complaining about the L's $1500 price tag needs to be taken with a grain of salt after you notice that the Sigma and Sunex both cost $1000.


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minitrucker
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Oct 09, 2011 15:14 |  #8

Fahad79 wrote in post #13217764 (external link)
)2) Sigma 8mm (circular fisheye for FF, but works like the others on crop, with vignetting)


Wait a second....maybe fisheyes act differently but this blows my mind. How is a lens going to project an image large enough for a FF sensor, and pics taken with said FF camera are not going to have any problems but you put this lens on a camera with a smaller sensor and you get vignetting? Maybe I'm missing a detail or something but my head just exploded.


Photography on my budget? WHAT WAS I THINKIN?!:confused:

  
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Brian_R
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Oct 09, 2011 15:15 |  #9

i dont know of any lenses that vignette on crop cameras. i dont know much about this stuff but i am yet to hear about this happening. its usually the other way around and vignetting occurs on FF cameras last i checked




  
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Madweasel
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Oct 09, 2011 17:48 |  #10

nureality wrote in post #13225148 (external link)
I own the Peleng 8 and the Vivitar 7.5 (Samyang 8mm guts) and they are very different in projection. The Peleng 8 is a circular fisheye... As for the Vivitar/Samyang/Rokino​n/etc's they aren't as sharp as the Peleng but are very capable lenses with a wildly different projection (rectangular and made for crops), its focal length is closer to 10mm than it is to 8mm.

They do indeed have a very different projection geometry, but that's not because one is designed as a circular fisheye and the other rectangular. Most fisheyes (circular and rectangular format) have an "equiangle" projection, but the Samyang is unusual in using a "stereographic" projection, which as I say is why it has a focal length of 8mm, but covers the same field as a 10mm lens of the normal type.

nureality wrote in post #13225148 (external link)
There are 2 lenses you failed to list, which are the only 2 crop lenses designed and able to deliver a true circular fisheye shot (complete with the FULL circle vignette on a crop body) - they are the Sigma 4.5mm f/2.8 DC EX HSM and the Sunex Superfisheye 5.6mm f/5.6....

They were not overlooked, but ignored, as the OP specified "non-circular".

minitrucker wrote in post #13225743 (external link)
Wait a second....maybe fisheyes act differently but this blows my mind. How is a lens going to project an image large enough for a FF sensor, and pics taken with said FF camera are not going to have any problems but you put this lens on a camera with a smaller sensor and you get vignetting? Maybe I'm missing a detail or something but my head just exploded.

Circular fisheyes do not cover the whole sensor, but project a circular image wholly (or in the case of the Peleng very nearly) within the sensor area. The discussion has been about using circular fisheyes designed for FF as rectangular fisheyes (where the image covers the whole of the sensor area) for crop cameras. In this case you do not want the dark corners.

Brian_R wrote in post #13225748 (external link)
i dont know of any lenses that vignette on crop cameras. i dont know much about this stuff but i am yet to hear about this happening. its usually the other way around and vignetting occurs on FF cameras last i checked

Well you did admit you don't know much about it! :) Hopefully the above explains.


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snapperz
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Oct 11, 2011 00:47 |  #11

nureality wrote in post #13225148 (external link)
As for the Canon 8-15 f/4L, I wouldn't say its useless to crops, because it was designed to offer both circular and rectangular fisheye shots on all 3 formats Canon currently offers. Making it a unique lens.

The 8-15 f4L will only give a full circular image on FF cameras but rectangular fisheye images on all three formats.


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Most Distortion in Fisheye for Crops? (non-circular)
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