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Thread started 12 Nov 2011 (Saturday) 00:06
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7D beginner's help

 
snyderman
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Nov 12, 2011 11:40 |  #16

Quick gap analysis: It is far and wide for the original poster. Suggestions that sound good: Get the 7D guide that Robertogee recommended. How to use: Read the book FIRST and highlight the things that look important to you. Read it AGAIN with the camera in your lap and apply the areas of the book you highlighted to the camera. Take sample shots while reading and applying what you're reading to the camera to test and complete your understanding of the book as it relates to your 7D.

One thing you have to realize going from a point and shoot to a 7D is equal to moving from a tricycle to a formula 1 race car. Both transportation, but the latter requires a LOT of understanding and training.

Good luck with your 7D. It's a great Canon body!

dave


Canon 5D2 > 35L-85L-135L

  
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JazmineHeart
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Nov 12, 2011 12:50 |  #17

NU27D wrote in post #13388894 (external link)
From one newb to another, the manual is "fun" but if you don't speak the language it can be tough at first. I recommend David Busch's Canon EOS 7D http://www.amazon.com …TF8&qid=1321079​245&sr=1-1 (external link). It helped me, along with the Canon Vids on You Tube or Canon's site.
The manual, books, these forums and the vids with some trial & error is the best medicine.
If your camera /lenses are functioning properly you'll soon have it right! But you might want to get to it before your warranty goes stuck!
If there's a product problem for some reason and since you're in CA I'll provide you with a map for the Canon funride!:rolleyes:

That book was also recommended by someone at another forum. I'll look into it. I had been studying together with my manual the book: Canon EOS 7D for dummies. Have watched a few vids from youtube/Canon site too.

I have read some issues with 7D and have looked into it if my camera has a problem. It works well on automatic settings, so i doubt there's anything there besides myself not being able to use it properly *shrugs* :oops:

Are you from California too? Thanks btw.

javig999 wrote in post #13388974 (external link)
It would be good to see a sample shots where you have had issues with the EXIF intact so that perhaps we can determine if it is a camera issue. The fact that things seemed fine in the Auto modes would point to user error. Perhaps start more slowly and use the Av or Tv modes to start? I shoot mostly in Av unless I am using flash.

Do not be afraid to crank the ISO a bit to keep your shutter speeds up when indoors, the 28-135 is not a terribly fast lens, especially on the long end.

I think to understand the relation between Shutter Speed, Aperture, and ISO to get the exposure that is required is key to making the camera behave the way you want it to. Shoot Auto until you get more info here, and do not lose hope.

Best of luck....

I'll have to learn to upload pics on this forum.

Yup,I am not satisfied with the 28-135mm lens. It just came with the kit and was on sale when i got it. Any suggestions for a good landscape/macro/all around lens ??

I'll also try the Tv and Av modes next time. Thanks.

RobDickinson wrote in post #13388995 (external link)
Manual mode still suggests a metering value. Understand what metering mode your in and how it works and when it gets it wrong.

Learn the basic mechanics (aperture, shutter speed, ISO) and go from there.

I've been learning the metering/adjusting the different settings (ISO,shutter speed,aperture) but i think with me playing around during readings- i might have screwed up settings and might have overlooked them hence now affecting pic quality. IDK and Thx.


Canon 7D, 28-135 mm (DSLR Beginner :oops:)
http://www.flickr.com/​photos/lurbybachz/ (external link)
feel free to critique my pics on flickr. I'm open to learning....

  
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JazmineHeart
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Nov 12, 2011 13:01 |  #18

artyman wrote in post #13389135 (external link)
You need to do some homework on exposure if your shots are over/underexposed. The usual recommendation is "Understanding Exposure" by Brian Peterson.

I'll look into that book. I've also learned to check histogram and that's where i had been basing my adjustments from. Thanks.

Bryn H wrote in post #13389251 (external link)
Hi Jazmineheart,

I am also new to the 7D although slightly longer than you. I can't afford the best or the fastest glass and I can empathise on finding some of the images taken as less than sharp. One thing I have noticed is that the camera produces quite noisy images at higher iso settings. Even post processing my raw files they lack the sharpness of shots taken at iso 100 or 200. To get shutter speeds up on slower lenses I have to crank up the iso, so it is a trade off in picture quality against ruining the shot completely with a slow shutter speed when hand-held. I use mine on aperture priority mostly but it does bracket the exposure in both Av & Tv modes for three successive shots so some exposure adjustment is necessary in post processing but if you stick to shooting in raw this is easily achieved with the supplied software or Adobe Camera Raw for those who can afford it. Don't forget the golden rule that shutter speed should be at least the reciprocal of your chosen focal length when hand-held, in other words at 28mm your shutter speed needs to be at least 1/30 sec. but at 135mm needs to be at least 1/160 sec. increase your iso to achieve this in low light. Enable highlight alert in the menu and enable histogram. Both these tools should help you achieve correct exposure. Hope this helps you a little - Happy shooting

Hey thanks for this great info. I'll keep those in mind. I"ll also try the aperture priority mode and go from there as you suggested. It's good to know about that golden rule.

grunticus wrote in post #13389330 (external link)
I have had a 7D for almost two years now. Maybe I can share some of my experiences with you.

1. Skip the cheaper lense-buy-urges (55-250 for example). They are not bad lenses, but the L lenses or lenses with lower F-capability are simply THAT much better. The 50mm will serve you well, but also consider the EF 17-55 2.8. It seems like it was invented for the 7D, very good IQ, very good versatility. 85 1.8 is also a stellar performer, especially for the money. And the EF 70-200 2.8L II...wow. I mean, just wow (yes, it's very expensive, but: WOW).

2. Activate all the by default disabled AF settings in the menu, and learn to use them so you can swith focus selection blindly.

3. Set in-camera contrast to -4 (minus four) and do your adjusting in PP (I use DPP which is supplied with the camera). For me personally, I find Photoshop and / or Adobe Lightroom to be overkill.

4. Set in-camera sharpening to zero (see 3). Mind that you have to do that for all modes seperately! DPP sharpening * to me* seems to to give better results than the equivalent in-camera setting (I shoot RAW exclusively btw).

5. Get a good flash, the 430 EX ii is excellent, the 580 better. Try out the remote flash capability of the 7D with the 430, it's great.

6. I had a Tamron 90 Macro, but found that any of my lenses coupled to one ore more extenders yields perfect results, with better versatility. I sold the Tamron.

7. Shoot, shoot, shoot :D

I wish you a lot of fun with the 7D.

Cheers.

Leon

Thanks mucho for these great info/settings. I'll start with it.

I dont mind saving( & waiting) for a more expensive lens than getting a cheap one and be dissatisfied overall. Imho, it adds up more anyway, if one upgrades it after buying a cheap one. On a side note, are non-Canon lenses like Tamron- worth the buy ??


Canon 7D, 28-135 mm (DSLR Beginner :oops:)
http://www.flickr.com/​photos/lurbybachz/ (external link)
feel free to critique my pics on flickr. I'm open to learning....

  
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amfoto1
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Nov 12, 2011 14:01 |  #19

Would you take someone learning to ski to the top of a black diamond slope, slap them on the back and wish them good luck? Sounds like a recipe for a faceplant in a snow drift, if lucky... Or something much worse, if not so lucky.

7D is a great camera. I've been using a pair of them for a couple years now. But it certainly is not a camera I'd recommend to a beginner. It's fairly advanced and complex, requires some level of experience to get the best out of it... all the way from the time of image capture through post processing the images back home on one's computer.

Too often we see postings here from people frustrated trying to learn to use 7D. Even with 25-30 years experience with DSLRs, I found the 7D fairly frustrating to learn to use and almost gave up on it during the first two or three months. That was mostly due to all the additional complexity of the AF system and the lack of good info on it two years ago when it was brand new and I go my cameras.... There's a lot more guidance out there now, thgankfully. But it still takes some effort to find it and learn it.

7D has little automation to support newcomers while they learn to use an SLR. It's designers assumed a fairly advanced user... semi-pro or full professional. It is easily the most pro-oriented APS-C camera Canon has produced to date (and was long overdue, too).

I also would not necessarily recommend 7D to someone planning to mostly shoot landscapes and portraits. It's forte is shooting sports/action... And, while you certainly can shoot landscapes and portraits with it, you are essentially paying a 40-50% premium for features you're unlikely to need or use. 60D can shoot landscapes and portraits every bit as well, and is merely an "advanced amateur" model by design, offering somewhat more automation that a newcomer can use while they learn. The T3i and T2i are even less expensive and even more beginner-oriented. All four models have virtually identical imaging potential.... they share almost the same 18MP sensor and Digic 4 processor.

Besides... The chunk of money saved buying a "lesser" model can be put toward buying better lenses, which will ultimately make much more difference in your images than the choice of camera models will.

One small exception... 7D does have a unique macro mode when shot with AI Servo AF, but only when using one of several Canon macro lenses (AFAIK: EF-S 60mm, EF 100mm L or USM, and 180mm). A lot of macro shooters use manual focus techniques anyway, for them this might not be a very big "selling point" for the 7D.

At the moment, the most "ideal" Canon for landscapes, portraits, possibly even macro is the 5DII. Of course, that's an even more expensive camera than the 7D and requires more expensive, larger/heavier lenses to get the best out of it. But, 5DII gives max possible detail with it's FF sensor and offers the most control over depth of field, for portraits and macro. And, actually, 5DII is a pretty simple camera to use. Besides it's video capabilities, it only has a few different or additional features, compared to 50D or 40D. 60D is actually probably more complex in some respects. But they all, incl. 5DII, are more straight-forward cameras than the 7D.

Any crop sensor model such as 60D, T3i/600D or T2i/550D is a little bit of a compromise... But have tons of potential for great images, just in an easier to use package while learning the ropes.

IMO, the OP has a choice.... Either sell the 7D and replace it with one of the models designed to be more friendly to newcomers, or learn to use the 7D.

Forget about using M much, until you know what you are doing. There is nothing wrong with using the auto modes (pros use Av, Tv and even P extensively, I can assure you). And there are are plenty of tricks to learn even with some automation helping you. Sure, experiment and learn what M can do for you (there are times it's the best choice... but there are other times when Av or Tv or P is the best choice, too).

Yes, get and read and reread "Understanding Exposure" as a starting point. That book can serve as a good guide for getting started with almost any camera.... And even the most experienced users reading it will usually find some helpful info and suggestions.

And, as already suggested, get and read one or more of the 7D specific guide books, too, if you stick with that camera. If you change cameras, get the guide book specific to it. These pick up where the manual leaves off, and often have more "real world" and hands on examples about using the gear.

There are also online tutorials and videos... B&H Photo has a bunch of 7D specific videos.

As to lenses...

Well I really don't like to over complicate things too much initially. So add lenses a step at a time.... not all at once.

Your 28-135 is a really nice "walk around" lens... affordable, fast and close focusing, with reasonably good IS and decent build quality... capable of very good IQ (rivalling some L-series lenses). It covers a nice, convenient range of focal lengths...

It's just not very wide, though, on any crop sensor camera.

For landscapes in particular, you might want to consider something wider such as Canon 10-22, Tokina 12-24, Sigma 10-20 or Tamron 10-24. Personally I think the Canon the best of the bunch, but it's also the most expensive by a big margin. I use the Tokina 12-24, which sells new for about 35% less than the Canon, and am quite comfortable recommending it. I haven't tried the current version of the Sigma or the Tamron.

You say your are interesed in portraits... IMO the 50/1.4 and 85/1.8 are about the best value vs performance and most portrait-appropriate focal lengths for use on 7D or any other crop camera. For someone who wants just occasional use, the 50/1.8 is a bargain... but it's not very durably built, has slower and less dependable AF. The f1.4 lens improves on all of those and offers some modest image quality enhancements as well. These prime lenses (as opposed to zooms) all have large enough apertures to stongly blur down backgrounds, often important shooting portraits. A bit more expensive alternatives are the Sigma 50/1.4 and 85/1.4. Premium lenses for the purpose, and probably the most specialized for portraiture, are the Canon 50/1.2L and 85/1.2L II.

I don't want to give the impression that only 50mm and 85mm focal lengths are the only ones usable for portraits. They just happen to give the most traditional angles of view for that type of photography, on crop cameras. For some kinds of portraits, in addition to the 50mm and 85mm sometimes I also use 20/2.8, 28/1.8, 135/2... and even some others. Some folks might choose a single lens that's in between, such as a 60mm (Canon or Tamron) or 70mm (Sigma), all of which are actually macro lenses and might serve double duty, or a slightly longer lens such as Canon 100/2 or 100/2.8 Macro.

Speaking of macro... just about any lens can be used as a macro or near macro, simply by adding some macro extension tubes behind it. I consider the Kenko DG tube set (of three) to be good value.

A true macro lens is more convenient, though, and can potentially give the best possible image quality. There are a number of excellent macro lenses.... I usually recommend one in the 60mm to 105mm focal length range to start with, simply because they are a good compromise of working distance and ease of use for handheld shots.

Still, it never hurts to have a set of macro extension rings... they can be used with true macro lenses, too, as well as serve some other purposes (such as improving the close focusing distance of a telephoto lens).

Macro is another huge topic... Too much to try to cover well here. Get and read books such as John Shaw's "Close-ups in Nature" and/or others from Tim Fitzharris, Joe MacDonald, Heather Angel, Nial Benvie and some other folks.

Your interests don't really call for one, but for general purpose telephoto a lot of folks enjoy one or the other of the Canon 70-200. These are true workhorse lenses, durable and with high image quality. A zoom is more versatile than a prime. The f4 versions of 70-200 are more portable and handholdable. The f2.8 are a lot bigger/heavier, but still handholdable. If you have a few fast prime lenses like those mentioned above for portraiture, you might be fine with the f4. I do recommend getting the IS version of any 70-200, if at all possible. Stabilization is very helpful on telephotos, in particular.

If you were interested in sports and/or wildlife and birds, you might want an even longer telephoto instead... A zoom such as Canon 100-400 IS or Sigma 120-400 OS or 150-500 OS are good, versatile starting points. None of these has particularly large apertures, which makes them more affordable and practical for handheld shots... But also means you'll need reasonably good light and will have somewhat limited ability to blur down backgrounds.

Beyond these lenses... consider eventually adding a flash and decent tripod. Flash can be very helpful for portraits, of course... But also can be important for macro (doesn't have to be a macro flash, specifically... a single, standard flash works pretty well for macro too, with some simple tricks). Don't cheap out on the tripod... It can be a once in a lifetime purchase and you are more inclined to use a nice one... A tripod is as much a learning tool that forces photographers to slow down a bit and thing about their shooting, as it is a means to get nice, sharp shots.

Learn to walk before you try to run! I shudder a little when I see the words "7D" and "beginner" in a post heading! You can learn shooting DLSRs with 7D, it just will take some additional effort and study... staying away from the more advanced stuff and keeping it as simple as possible while you are learning.


Alan Myers (external link) "Walk softly and carry a big lens."
5DII, 7DII, 7D, M5 & others. 10-22mm, Meike 12/2.8,Tokina 12-24/4, 20/2.8, EF-M 22/2, TS 24/3.5L, 24-70/2.8L, 28/1.8, 28-135 IS (x2), TS 45/2.8, 50/1.4, Sigma 56/1.4, Tamron 60/2.0, 70-200/4L IS, 70-200/2.8 IS, 85/1.8, Tamron 90/2.5, 100/2.8 USM, 100-400L II, 135/2L, 180/3.5L, 300/4L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, EF 1.4X II, EF 2X II. Flashes, strobes & various access. - FLICKR (external link)

  
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JazmineHeart
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Nov 12, 2011 14:33 |  #20

Kevan wrote in post #13389350 (external link)
The 7D is not an easy camera to use. It takes a good deal of practice, customizing, and reading to get there. The target is to become fluent in Manual. Av while not really meant to be a crutch, can make your shooting a bit easier to do.

One feature I think you must have is when viewing shots you've just taken the camera will identify where sections of the photo have been blown out by blinking black flashes in those sections. This will assist you in understanding where you need to tweak your metering. Also, I had a pal here in POTN suggest that I move my 7's focusing off the shutter and instead relocate it to the back of the camera onto the * button. You'll need to refer to a manual or get an experienced Eos pal to help you. It takes some finger training, but the best thing is it locks the focus once while you shoot continually. Move and you'll have to refocus again.

Lastly, I've found that getting a couple books helps as authors vary in approach and depth on a topic.

Enjoy, it's a terrific camera once you learn to drive it.

I am not familiar with those black flashes you mention here. Although, i have checked histogram per each pic and it's graphed showing the peaks in over/underexposures. I'll look into my manual and check your tip. Thanks.

Kevan wrote in post #13389361 (external link)
One last thing, and I can't emphasize this enough, participate in the photo challenges. The topic is given, your imagination is pushed, and you have to be able to control your camera. Also, it will get you taking pictures of things you never thought you would. I speak from experience, participating weekly makes you a better photographer.

I will surely do so and hoping not get intimidated by the many good photographers in this forum. I join a photo league contest too at another forum, altho not much going on lately.

Robertogee wrote in post #13389408 (external link)
+1 for NU27D's suggestion about David Busch's book on the Canon 7D.

I mostly shoot Manual. But I really appreciate Av (and occasionally Tv and even P) for some situations.

In addition to the other suggestions, here's another. If you can find a photography 101 course at a local college, explore taking it.

They will almost invariably require you to shoot RAW in Manual mode, and will teach you how to use Manual quickly, confidently and effectively. When you turn in your work on the various assigned projects, the instructor can see from your EXIF data if you "cheated" and used "auto-" anything.

It's a great way to become familiar with Manual, as well as learn some other tips and also establish at least an essential basic post-processing workflow in DPP or Photoshop. (Generally, you will be required to set in-camera settings, such as saturation / contrast / sharpness, etc., to zero, and perform those tasks in post- as needed.)

Especially when new to a camera like the 7D, or to digital photography, such a course is invaluable and cost-effective, IMO.

I recently got my 7D after three years with my 40D. I love them both. And yes, there really IS a difference I could see immediately. It's terrific having the 40D as a second and / or backup camera.

Be patient with yourself and definitely make a genuine effort to learn Manual. It's really not that difficult, and once you're familiar with it, it's fast and becomes second nature . . . and the easiest / quickest way to get EXACTLY what you have in mind!

Still, for some situations, those auto-Modes come in handy and they're there for a reason!

Enjoy your 7D!

Thanks. Had been thinking about basic photography class altho' i easily get bored being in class hence thinking more of a hands on workshop or meet up groups and go from there. I might consider a class if my frustration peaks :p

Robertogee wrote in post #13389417 (external link)
+1 to Kevan's suggestion of back-button focusing. I use it on both my 40D and 7D. A GREAT technique and tool to get familiar with.

On "My Menu," I have the Custom option IV readily available at the press of the "Menu" button, so I can quickly toggle back and forth between back-button focus or half-press shutter-button focus, depending on what I'm shooting.

Are these the settings you set automatically on the camera for easy access? I have read that on the manual- just had not gotten around doing so as i thought, one needed a good shot pic saved with it's settings ? *confused*


Canon 7D, 28-135 mm (DSLR Beginner :oops:)
http://www.flickr.com/​photos/lurbybachz/ (external link)
feel free to critique my pics on flickr. I'm open to learning....

  
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JazmineHeart
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Nov 12, 2011 15:19 |  #21

pknight wrote in post #13389480 (external link)
Bush's book is OK, but be aware that there are errors in it that you might find frustrating. I am talking about statements that clearly refer to a different model, and in some cases outright errors. You can still learn a lot from it, but if you do get it, do so after doing your best to digest the OEM manual. You will be less likely to wonder why Bush isn't making sense in some place.

I'll probably check the book if available in the library. I like video tutorials too and saw a phone app for basics and advanced 7D. Anyone familiar with that IPhone app?? (Blue Crane)

MCAsan wrote in post #13389524 (external link)
join local photo clubs. Take advantage of their accumulated wit and wisdom. You will find at least one person who knows 7D inside and out. They may also do field trips and have discounts at local businesses.

That's a good idea.I have joined meet up groups. No meet ups so far. I have co workers who are into photography however they're Nikon users :(

artyH wrote in post #13389526 (external link)
The zoom lens may need flash when indoors. Outside, you should be able to do fine with it.
The shutter speed should be 1/effective focal length. This means, for a crop, it would be 1/50 at 28mm and 1/200 for the long end of the zoom. You may be able to get away with lower shutter speeds for stationary objects.
I use a T2i and it should have similar ISO performance to the 7D. If not, please let me
know. I have no problem shooting at ISO 1600 and even will go to ISO 3200 if pressed. Sure, the photos are sharper at ISO 400 or 800, but not if there is subject motion blurr.
Have you tried higher ISOs?
Do I have a special T2i, or is the 7D poor at high ISOs? The reviews say that it should
even be slightly better than the T2i at high ISOs.

I've not tried higher ISOs. I've always wondered too how to be able to do the computations with type of lens, focal length and shutter speeds. Am not good with numbers- any simple lesson on this?

Trique Daddi wrote in post #13390159 (external link)
Have you watched the tutorial videos on B&H's site? Very helpful.

I've watched tutorials @ YouTube and at Canon site. Had seen the B&H site but not watched any yet. Thanks for the reminder.


Canon 7D, 28-135 mm (DSLR Beginner :oops:)
http://www.flickr.com/​photos/lurbybachz/ (external link)
feel free to critique my pics on flickr. I'm open to learning....

  
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Crafty
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Nov 12, 2011 15:36 |  #22

I wouldn't buy any more lenses, no point. Learn to use what you have first.

Buy the books as others have suggested, but as a quick guide:
Use Av mode, fix ISO to say 200.
Now just work with that, picking what aperture you want and let the camera figure out the shutter speed.

Keep shutter speed at x2 focal length (or more). So if shooting at 50mm don't let the shutter drop below 1/100th, if shutter speed falls below that either drop aperture (e.g. a lower number) or increase ISO. That should sort out the blurry pictures.


flickr (external link)

  
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JazmineHeart
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Nov 12, 2011 15:39 |  #23

snyderman wrote in post #13390196 (external link)
Quick gap analysis: It is far and wide for the original poster. Suggestions that sound good: Get the 7D guide that Robertogee recommended. How to use: Read the book FIRST and highlight the things that look important to you. Read it AGAIN with the camera in your lap and apply the areas of the book you highlighted to the camera. Take sample shots while reading and applying what you're reading to the camera to test and complete your understanding of the book as it relates to your 7D.

One thing you have to realize going from a point and shoot to a 7D is equal to moving from a tricycle to a formula 1 race car. Both transportation, but the latter requires a LOT of understanding and training.

Good luck with your 7D. It's a great Canon body!

dave

That sounds funny the way you mentioned the tricycle and race car. I've realized that after shifting from auto modes to manual mode and getting to know the camera features etc. I've however done the highlighting of the manual during reading. The being hands on with manual and vid tutorials and deciphering stuffs on the camera might have changed/activated some advanced settings I may not be aware of.

I'll delete current settings and start from default settings. Thanks.


Canon 7D, 28-135 mm (DSLR Beginner :oops:)
http://www.flickr.com/​photos/lurbybachz/ (external link)
feel free to critique my pics on flickr. I'm open to learning....

  
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Kevan
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Nov 12, 2011 16:59 |  #24

Jazmine,

Naturally, anyone participating in a challenge would like to have their photography recognized, but you might have to pay a toll first. A toll of trial and error, but suck it up and keep participating and over the months and years you'll learn. Hey, I started out with a small G9 doing challenges here and it took months until I started figuring things out.

As per books (I'm now in my office so I can refer to my modest library.), check out Canon 7D - From Snapshots to Great Shots, by Nicole S. Young. As she puts it on page 1, many books provide the "how's", she provides too the "why's." I think it's an excellent book, at least accompanying others.


kevan's lens (external link)

  
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Robertogee
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Nov 12, 2011 18:38 |  #25

Jazmine -

RE: your question about Tamron lenses. Yes, there are some excellent (and often more affordable than Canon) third-party lenses for your 7D.

One of my favorite lenses (STILL) is the Tamron 17-35. I don't believe they make it currently, but it's not that old a model and I'm sure you can find one used if you look around. They've "upgraded" it to something else. I researched thoroughly before choosing that lens three years ago, but had no idea what a superlative lens (for the money) I was getting until I began using it and kept reading about it in still more online reviews.

It is ALWAYS in my bag and I STILL love it, despite getting the Canon 10-22 (which I ALSO love and use a lot; no other Canon lens does what it can do, but it's pricey and certainly somewhat more of a "specialty" lens).

Your Canon 28-135 kit lens is a terrific lens, for what it is. Mine came with my 40D three years ago. Don't disparage it. I also have the Tamron 28-200 LD from my Canon film camera days. I compared the two and the Canon 28-135 is slightly sharper overall. I would probably sell the Tamron 28-200, except I can't get much for it and it's a great backup lens with a bit more reach than the Canon 28-135.

PKnight is a senior member and must know, but I've not found any errors in Busch's 7D book, and I've used it top to bottom, so I'm not sure what he's talking about. Maybe he's got an earlier edition, or could point out the errors he found in it to save confusion on readers' parts.

I also ordered Busch's book before my 7D arrived, as I had with my 40D, and highlighted things I knew I'd need to pay more attention to that were new or different to me.

One other point about taking a class: the student discount on Photoshop. I've used Photoshop for twelve years or more, in graphics work, going back to version 5.0. If you sign up for an accredited course, and obtain your valid student I.D., Adobe discounts 80% off CS5, or whatever their latest version is. That's $199, your cost, versus nearly $1,000. (Also, a GREAT book is "Photoshop CS5" by Galer and Andrews, which comes with a CD. Terrific, detailed, exhaustive tutorials. Wonderful.)

Plus, I didn't find the class I took last year "academic" at all. I've been shooting since I'm 12. Over 40 years. In order to take a particular more advanced class which I wanted, I was required to take what amounted to that digital photography 101 course before being able to move on to anything else.

I knew I'd learn SOMETHING (you always do), but was surprised how much I DID learn. Plus, I got CS5 at that great discount (even including the minimal cost of the semester course), and learned some valuable tips in the post-processing workflow.

But MAINLY, unlike just joining a local amateurs' group, which is fine, the actual university course required two nights a week attendance and LOTS of shooting on four well-designed (and taught) specific projects on basic broad photographic concepts like "Near & Far," "Light & Dark," "Frame," "Time" and so on. The class was limited to 15 students because of available workstations. The interactions with the other students, and seeing the variety of work they were doing, the constructive critiques of everybody's work, was fun and also helpful. And, of course, getting the instructor's personal attention and immediate answers to any questions.

The class was definitely WORK, as opposed to the more informal drop-in structure of an amateur group setting (not to put them down at all). And I made a 98 for the semester -- which felt great, since it's been years since I've been graded on anything -- but not because I already knew everything, because I didn't.

I definitely learned some valuable information about DSLR shooting and post-processing. I told friends, truthfully, I could see an improvement in my work after the first week!

And ALL of that class was in Manual, which was required from the get-go. Believe me: once you know what you're doing in Manual (and I don't know how better to learn it than in a class / field situation like I'm talking about, where you're paying for it and being tested and earning actual grades, rather than from a book on your own and mere trial and error), and are comfortable and fluent in Manual, the other modes make a lot more sense in terms of what you're doing with them and when to use them.

Same, really, with flash and Speedlites. Syl Arena's "Speedliter's Handbook" is, IMO, essential. I bought a 580 EX II with my 40D, then added a 430 EX II a few months later. Syl Arena's book makes the same point: learn to use your Speedlites in their Manual mode and you'll really know what you're doing with flash in general and their other modes in particular.

I got both short and long off-camera-flash (OCF) ETTL cords, and some wireless triggers too, and will always use them in given situations. But I've gotta tell ya, I REALLY appreciate the 7D's built-in wireless flash trigger. It works like a charm for me (yes, I understand its limitations).

Anyhow, that's my two cents' worth! Have fun!


EOS 7D | EOS 40D | EF 85mm 1.8 | Canon 10-22 | Canon 50mm 1.8 | Canon 28-135mm | Tamron 17-35mm | Tamron 28-200mm LD | Tamron 70-300mm | 580 EX II | 430 EX II

  
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oldvultureface
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Nov 12, 2011 18:43 |  #26

JazmineHeart wrote in post #13390856 (external link)
I've always wondered too how to be able to do the computations with type of lens, focal length and shutter speeds. Am not good with numbers- any simple lesson on this?

Hear ya goe:

https://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=414088




  
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kcbrown
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Nov 13, 2011 21:25 |  #27

grunticus wrote in post #13389330 (external link)
I have had a 7D for almost two years now. Maybe I can share some of my experiences with you.

1. Skip the cheaper lense-buy-urges (55-250 for example). They are not bad lenses, but the L lenses or lenses with lower F-capability are simply THAT much better.

Actually, the 55-250 IS is a notable exception to this, as is the 18-55 IS. They are surprisingly sharp.

I recently got an opportunity to shoot both my 55-250 IS and a 70-200 f/2.8 IS II side by side. At 200mm and f/5.6 (widest possible aperture for the 55-250 at that focal lengh), the resulting images were nearly indistinguishable in terms of sharpness and detail retention. All were shot on my 7D, and the shutter speed was 1/500 of a second, so there was no possibility of camera shake (I was also braced against a car). The 70-200 rendered colors somewhat more vibrantly and warmly, and the contrast is slightly better with it, but that was really the only notable difference I was able to spot in terms of image quality.

Needless to say, I was astonished. The 7D is very demanding of glass, and I thought for sure the 70-200 would blow the 55-250 out of the water, particularly given the test results I've seen. It didn't.


These days, what you're paying for in L glass is additional capability -- weather sealing, better IS, far better/faster autofocus, a wider aperture, and more robust build. But the image quality of some of the "cheap" glass is stunningly good these days, enough that it alone won't make a significant difference in your end results.

And the EF 70-200 2.8L II...wow. I mean, just wow (yes, it's very expensive, but: WOW).

Yeah. Despite the 55-250's impressive showing, the 70-200 manages to maintain that level of sharpness even wide open, at f/2.8.

3. Set in-camera contrast to -4 (minus four) and do your adjusting in PP (I use DPP which is supplied with the camera). For me personally, I find Photoshop and / or Adobe Lightroom to be overkill.

4. Set in-camera sharpening to zero (see 3). Mind that you have to do that for all modes seperately! DPP sharpening * to me* seems to to give better results than the equivalent in-camera setting (I shoot RAW exclusively btw).

If you shoot raw, the above two become irrelevant. With raw, all postprocessing happens on the computer, not in the camera. The postprocessing software might take some of its cues from the in-camera settings, but they can always be changed in the software. So my opinion is that you're best off to set your contrast and your in-camera sharpening to reflect what you're likely to set them to, on average, in the postprocessing software. Not only will this allow you to preview your shot on the camera's screen and see roughly what you'll get in postprocessing, but it will make it less likely that you'll have to change the settings once you get the raw image onto the computer.


"There are some things that money can't buy, but they aren't Ls and aren't worth having" -- Shooter-boy
Canon: 2 x 7D, Sigma 17-50 f/2.8 OS, 55-250 IS, Sigma 8-16, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4, other assorted primes, and a 430EX.
Nikon: D750, D600, 24-85 VR, 50 f/1.8G, 85 f/1.8G, Tamron 24-70 VC, Tamron 70-300 VC.

  
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ROGERWILCO357
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Nov 14, 2011 03:30 |  #28

practice practice read then practice some more i used the 28-135 for over a year and loved that lens soo much I bought the 24-105L and wow..trial and error helped me most..good luck and have fun once you mastered the body comes the flash and other lens seems you will always be learning and having fun..in this hobby so it's been for me at least..


EOS 5DMKII gripped;EOS 7D;30D:Rebel Xti Digital;24-105L,70-200 f/2.8L.II,85mm f1.2L.II,16-35Lmk2, SP AF90mmF/2.8DI,28-135mm x 2,580EX II-430ExII with Pocket Wizards II,(Adobe CS5)

  
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