Lame question

I've been doing a lot of research and I can't really find the general answer that I am looking for ...

I have a 50D and want something to shoot video of my baby and my 6 year olds sporting events. I care more about the photos than the video but suppose that I need to have some way to capture video better than my point and shoot.

So I can't decide if I should buy a stand alone camcorder or upgrade to the 60D.

Is the learning curve pretty bad for video on the 60D?
Is the quality good if you just throw it on auto for the video portion?
Am I going to end up sinking a ton of money into extras for additional video equipment (special lenses, mics, etc.)?

Just trying to decide if it's worth the upgrade to be able to have just one camera or since I'm not really TOO excited about the video if I should just get a stand alone camcorder.

The great thing about shooting video with DSLRs is the big sensor and control they give you. You don't want to shoot video on a DSLR in auto mode because the exposure will constantly change on you. You will need to manual focus which gets less easy as your Ap opens up more (just like manually focusing at f1.4 isn't as easy as f5.6) and does take some practice, but in a way becomes kind of fun as you get used to it.
The 60d has manual audio controls so you can stick something like a Zoom h1 or Rode video mic on the hotshoe and plug the mic right into the camera so you won't have to sync it later.
There is some learning to do shooting video with a DSLR because you have to be "involved" unlike a camcorder that is just P&S. To be honest, I find people typically pick it up very quickly and learn more with every video. The DOF control allows you to make videos that are more pleasing to watch in the long run than an "everything in focus" camcorder IMO.
There is Magic Lantern for your 50d that will allow it to shoot video but then audio becomes more of an issue for you and trust me, a swivel screen makes video SOOOO much easier its not even funny.

Thanks so much for the info.

I agree that the videos sound like they would look so much better coming from a manual focus DSLR - I guess it's a lot of internal conflict about if I want to take the time to learn a new skill with this whole thing (I do have a 4 month old and a 6 year old.) Half of me just wants the everything in focus point and shoot just because I want it captured and that's all I care about but the other half knows that I would be creating something much better if I took the time and did it right.

I guess I was just curious how long it takes to catch on. Are the first 100 videos that I take going to be crap until I can figure it out or can I put it in Auto for a while and it will capture ok and then learn to do it well over time?

After looking at your list of equipment you have, simply adding a 60D to your lenses will go a long way to shooting great videos. Yeah there will be some other things that you'll eventually want to help your shooting of video easier (a good fluid head tripod, maybe a nice monopod with a fluid head on it or a follow focus system), but you are already on your way to having most of the gear you'll need. Of course you can go crazy too and get a ton of add-ons around the camera, but most of it isn't really needed. Just some basics.

As far as the 60D as a still camera, I haven't a clue. It's probably slightly better than your 50D.
I bought my 7D for its features as a still camera first, but knowing that it can also do video pretty well. And going to a 60D over your 50D you'll get a better sensor (15mp to 18mp). I'm not sure you'll see a huge increase like I did going from my 40D to the 7D, but it will be there.

The biggest difference between getting a 60D or a camcorder is the DoF control. Just like BrickR said, you'll actually have some fun with shooting video with a DSLR. Shooting a camcorder is just simply documenting stuff happening in front of the lens. With the creativity of a DSLR you can still just document kids, but you can also do it in a beautiful way that will be more appreciated in years to come.

Also, shooting in manual is actually pretty easy. Too many people want to shoot everything in the P mode or the Green Box and never really get to fully enjoy their DSLR. You'll pick it up very quickly!

Good point. I think I needed some inspiration and information to know that I'm not going to have to put a TON of money into extra mics and video lights and editing software right away.

I am sure that once I start I'll be hooked as it's not far off from photography but wanted to make sure that it wasn't going to be so time consuming and frustrating to learn either. I don't want to show up at the first flag football game and regret my decision when I get home and have only shot a bunch of crap.

I heard that the focusing can be pretty loud on the mic when recording in auto and I can imagine I'll be using auto for a little while at least for sports. The baby will at least stay in one spot for a little while to give me a little practice.

I've been testing out shooting sports with my 7D. I have a Sony PDX10 that I have normally shot my son's 6th, 7th and 8th grade football games with. It was a solid platform to do that with and its AF system worked really well for that stuff. But since getting the 7D I've only slipped my toe into the waters of sports video shooting. Lots of action to pull focus on seemed to be the hardest thing to deal with at first. So I started to break the events down into manageable bits. Swim meets were the first thing I tried. Focusing only on my daughters lane became easier right away when I used my new follow focus system. I mostly used my 70-200 f4L for swimming. I'm still working on that video.

Then a couple of weeks ago when I was shooting stills at my son's 8th grade basketball game, I turned the camera back to horizontal shooting and shot some of the last few minutes of his game. When I got home and down loaded the footage I was pleasantly surprised by what I saw. The lighting in that gym was horrid! I had to shoot stills at ISO 5000 to even begin to get decent exposures. But shooting video at a SS of 1/50th I could lower the ISO quite a bit. I was pretty happy with my 24-70 f2.8L for shooting the limited part of that game. But I did have to shoot @ f2.8 to maintain a decent exposure. I probably could have moved up into the bleachers and shot from further back using my 85 f1.8, but there was only a couple of minutes left and I had been shooting stills at the baseline for whole game.

So it is possible to shoot sports. Starting with 6 year old flag football will give you a great start. Football is easy because there are these natural start and stop points in the game between action. Soccer and basketball, not so much. The record time of these DSLRs is about 12 minutes of footage before a new file has to be created. So it is possible to shoot until a timeout or and out of bounds play to stop the recording and start a new file.

And as he/she gets bigger and faster so will you with your shooting of the DSLR. I've only been shooting videos with my 7D for about 2 months now and already I am a lot better at it. A knowledge of the game you'll be shooting is very, very important to shooting sports, both for stills and video.

You'll just need to make an investment in at least two 32gb cards, maybe 3. When I shoot my 7D with my new Transcend 32gig 400X CF card at 30fps, 1080p, I only get about 25 minutes of record time on that card. But if you were to get a camcorder that uses tapes, then just think of all the tapes that you'll have to buy over the life of that camera. I can tell you this, I have piles of old mini-DVC tapes. I could have bought quite a few high capacity CF cards with all that money spent on tape stock.

The biggest challenge capturing video with a DSLR is focusing, manual is the only real option and it takes practice. Get yourself a Loupe viewer for the back screen, AF is useful for establishing the focus at the start but no good for following, a conventional camcorder is much better at follow focus for fast moving things. Shooting at f8 to increase DOF gives you a bit more latitude, save the wide aperture narrow DOF for the staged stationary shots.

Hi Tracy,

You certainly sound like you like doing a job properly. While a DSLR isn't necessarily as easy to capture video as a camcorder you can take some satisfaction in knowing they are used by professionals for full on broadcast/cinema footage - you can't say that of many video cameras of under £1000. So you can be confident that you can produce some stunning video.

DSLRs main operating difference is you don't have motorised zoom (which is actually a good thing as it discourages you from zooming) and the camera won't follow focus automatically while shooting. You very soon find this in nowhere near as restrictive as it first sounds.

As a keen photographer you might well justify the purchase of a 60D for stills alone, in which case the video facility is free.

It was noted that you can load Magic Lantern on your 50D. This is free software which you instal by loading it onto a card. It is very easy and would perhaps be worth a try. The additional functionality Magic Lantern brings to both video and still photography is such I would recommend installing it on a 60D if you get one as well.

John Sims wrote in post #13612022
It was noted that you can load Magic Lantern on your 50D. This is free software which you instal by loading it onto a card. It is very easy and would perhaps be worth a try. The additional functionality Magic Lantern brings to both video and still photography is such I would recommend installing it on a 60D if you get one as well.

Yep. For instance, focus peaking. Will really assist you when you're in that f1.8 and faster stuff.

That is one feature that I wish I could have for the 7D. Stupid 7D firmware!

If you get reasonably interested in video you will want to trade the XSI for the T3i. Here is why.

For a $650 body you gain.
18 mega pixel crop body for stills - same sensor as 7D
HD video w/ "Sensor zoom" that takes the image down to the 2 megapixel size of HD video
with a press of a button (ok 3 total presses) you move from 1x zoom to 3x-10x variable - stil shooting full HD resolution.
Light weight
Swivel screen for "flying"

FYI Quick hack for the live view LCD Lupe - get a $15 extended eye piece, remove the guts, put it on, with the camera facing down, lay the lupe on the LCD and get 1/16 drill bit and drill a small hole through both (two on opposite sides of the eye piece and one down through the view finder hole) get a thin piece for a foam spacer and screw the two together) I use the "Perfect 3x" Lupe as it is hinged. No sticky frames, magnets next to magnetic media, quick on and off, etc.

Thanks guys. Lots of good information here. I'll have to check out Magic Lantern.

Thanks again, I appreciate it. Now we'll see if the XSi sells and I'll probably be hanging out in this forum more.

Instead of learning all the things required in using a 60D or other SLR camera to shoot video, why not just get a camcorder? You want to shoot in auto, which is darn near impossible to do on an SLR, but totally doable on a camcorder. Canon's line of Vixia camcorders have units for under $500 USD that do a superb job, and they can easily be run in full auto. Save yourself the headache of learning both how to shoot video and how to operate an SLR in video mode. Either one is daunting enough, both at the same time is more than most people want to handle. And there is no need to buy a loupe or drill holes in your new camera or put glue or sticky tape on it.

Trust me, in the long run, you will be much happier with your results if you have a device that was meant to make videos.

That's why high end professional productions use $500 camcorders then? You could, of course, use an iPhone. There again you could use an iPhone for stills as well and sell the 50D........or perhaps not.

MarKap77 wrote in post #13616683
Instead of learning all the things required in using a 60D or other SLR camera to shoot video, why not just get a camcorder? You want to shoot in auto, which is darn near impossible to do on an SLR, but totally doable on a camcorder. Canon's line of Vixia camcorders have units for under $500 USD that do a superb job, and they can easily be run in full auto. Save yourself the headache of learning both how to shoot video and how to operate an SLR in video mode. Either one is daunting enough, both at the same time is more than most people want to handle. And there is no need to buy a loupe or drill holes in your new camera or put glue or sticky tape on it.

Trust me, in the long run, you will be much happier with your results if you have a device that was meant to make videos.

Wow MarKap77, what kind of enabler are you? He needs the 60D. You know that. Stop talking silliness. All that crazy talk about an inexpensive camcorders... Shut the Front Door!