How to charge for video?

Hey guys! I'd like to ask a few questions to the guys who charge for video.

You see, all along I've been photographing in the studio for a classical music shop / repair-shop and they've got pretty good business to be honest.

Now they're coming up with a 2-day music festival for flute players in a concert hall and other rooms around the hall, 12 hours each day, and they're asking for my help again because they know I'm okay with the photography aspect.

Now comes the video part. I proposed two parts for video:

1) They want video for archival sake, so it's the long-play kind. No matter what, I know two cameras would be needed, one for wide and one for tight shots. We're talking about camcorders here (I'm gonna rent them if I get the job).

2) They want another video for a promotional trailer. I suggested the use of HD DSLRs with the large sensors and what naught. These are just shoot and scoot kinds. Hopefully I don't have to edit up the trailer by the end of 2 days.

So in terms of my overheads, I'm thinking of the following:

Rental cost of 2 same camcorders (I'm thinking Panasonic AC130 + AC160)
Rental cost of 2 tripod setups
Hiring cost of 2 cameramen
Hiring cost of 1 HD DSLR cameraman
Hiring cost of 1 stills photographer
Transport of everything, food for everyone.

With consideration of hours put into injesting/converting/e​diting.

Should this be the rough guideline of how I'd think up a package quote for my client?

Your list + Markup on rentals and labor (much more markup on labor)

Add In Pre-Production time as well. You don't just "flip the switch" as the band counts 1,2,3,4...
IOW, your time asking here is more or less, billable.

*BARE Minumum*
I would say $150/day + $100 to edit + the cost of rentals

Depending on your experience and caliber of your work, I would charge up to $400/day + $250 to edit + rentals

ultimately, we can't tell you what to charge. It comes down to what you think your time is worth, and what the client is willing to pay

FlyingPhotog wrote in post #13692123
Your list + Markup on rentals and labor (much more markup on labor)

Add In Pre-Production time as well. You don't just "flip the switch" as the band counts 1,2,3,4...
IOW, your time asking here is more or less, billable.

Thanks for your response! What do you mean by "markup"? And I understand the pre-production aspect - the sourcing for a team, planning shots etc etc.

gibsonla wrote in post #13692234
*BARE Minumum*
I would say $150/day + $100 to edit + the cost of rentals

Depending on your experience and caliber of your work, I would charge up to $400/day + $250 to edit + rentals

ultimately, we can't tell you what to charge. It comes down to what you think your time is worth, and what the client is willing to pay

True, true. I was just thinking that my list was in-itself the "guideline" for the quotation. Seems like it is! Sort of.

Headshotzx wrote in post #13692380
Thanks for your response! What do you mean by "markup"?

Markup = Your Profit

If you only charge back what you pay out, you don't make any money.

eg: You might pay a camera op $400 for the day but you bill your client $600.

gisonla, you give some pretty solid advice! Well said.

Headshotzx, only you can put a price tag on your own worth. You also have to consider the budget of your client because if they can only afford to pay you the amount to only cover your expenses, then where's your room to profit?

Start by drafting and expense sheet and breaking down your responsibilities with a price. Factor in all your sub-contracted work first, work in your rental costs, then your own personal costs (filming, editing, etc). I don't suggest you bill for rendering time.

Digitizing and Rendering times just fall under Post Production.

Also, why would you film a separate trailer with a DSLR? Just film the event coverage and draft up a trailer from that footage. It'll substantially cut your costs down by cutting out the DSLR rental costs and hiring the extra cam op.

FlyingPhotog wrote in post #13692694
Digitizing and Rendering times just fall under Post Production.

That's what I meant.

Thanks for the advice guys!

I proposed to have a dslr trailer because I myself probably will be the one doing it myself as well as the photography (I have a second shooter who'll sub-contracted cheaply because he's a flute player as well, as am I). This can increase my profits revenue substantially due to the "filmic look" without having to rent extra cameras and lenses. Of course, like you said, I can also go along with the camcorder stuff for a trailer in the event that the client doesn't want to pay for HDDSLR trailers.

gibsonla wrote in post #13692234
*BARE Minumum*
I would say $150/day + $100 to edit + the cost of rentals

Depending on your experience and caliber of your work, I would charge up to $400/day + $250 to edit + rentals

ultimately, we can't tell you what to charge. It comes down to what you think your time is worth, and what the client is willing to pay

I think that is far too little. Your time is worth more (unless you suck! lol), but no, for a pro you should charge way more than this.

Let me put it to you like this:

1) If your client is a company and you approach them with $400/day they will think you are an amatuer and incapable of delivering. Case and point, a large fortune 100 company (which I have to keep confidential) paid $5000 per 1 minute clip, unedited for test footage of their new camcorder. They needed 5 clips. If i said $150 they would have laughed at me and hung up the phone.
2) A startup company hired me to shoot some editorial work for them. Took three days but I only made $500/day (my rate not gear/crew) as thats all they could afford. I took the gig anyway.

I guess what I am saying is hourly rates and day rates are stupid. Charge on a case by case basis because each client is different, and comes with different challenges.

Some companies (most large ones) will pay out net30-60 so thats another factor.

Anyway, just my thoughts based on my experience. Although I dont know what type of videos you shoot, because that ultimately changes everything.

Unless I as mistaken, he was inquiring what to charge a mom and pop repair shop, not a fortune 100 company =)

He also mentioned that he is primarily a photographer. If he went and proposed a $5000 rate I'm pretty sure this shop would tell him to just piss off

AlanMura wrote in post #13693120
I think that is far too little. Your time is worth more (unless you suck! lol), but no, for a pro you should charge way more than this.

Let me put it to you like this:

1) If your client is a company and you approach them with $400/day they will think you are an amatuer and incapable of delivering. Case and point, a large fortune 100 company (which I have to keep confidential) paid $5000 per 1 minute clip, unedited for test footage of their new camcorder. They needed 5 clips. If i said $150 they would have laughed at me and hung up the phone.
2) A startup company hired me to shoot some editorial work for them. Took three days but I only made $500/day (my rate not gear/crew) as thats all they could afford. I took the gig anyway.

I guess what I am saying is hourly rates and day rates are stupid. Charge on a case by case basis because each client is different, and comes with different challenges.

Some companies (most large ones) will pay out net30-60 so thats another factor.

Anyway, just my thoughts based on my experience. Although I dont know what type of videos you shoot, because that ultimately changes everything.

I don't think you're as experienced as you make yourself out to be. How are you going to judge someone's expertise based on the price they charge? Anyone can bill someone $5000 for a shoot, but does that mean that it'll be better quality? Not necessarily.

First of all, he has to break down his work hourly because he's being hired for a 12 hour per day shoot. It's not to say that he should be asking for $20/hr, but using the time as a cost factor will help him figure out how much he should be charging.

Charging a day rate is not stupid. A day rate entails all cost factors for the one day of filming.

The prices that gibsonla quoted are very fair for an amateur videographer to be making on their first gig.

Don't forget that you'll need better audio equipment (i.e. microphone) since you'll be recording a live performance. One of your angles should just be a wide establishing shot of the entire performance, so maybe you can do with one less cam op and leave that one running on its own. Just keep track of the tape in the cam.

A feed from the mixing console would be the ideal source for audio...