Rotten Ambient, Close Baseline, and Couldn't Use Strobes

dwarrenr wrote in post #13752866
I guess each their own, but I agree with you sempaidavid. Although it takes more work/skill to shot with flash/strobe, I like the results so much better, and less editing is a plus as well. And it seems a few publishers prefer the look as well. The added cost to strobe H.S. gyms have more then been paid for several times over. And I've read where there are people who prefer the look of high ISO images. That's fine...I just don't get it I guess.

Strobed gyms are different than an on-camera or close-to-axis flash. I've never met an editor who prefers the direct flash look.

dwarrenr wrote in post #13752943
Sometimes it's that easy. Other times it's not.

Below is one of the examples when it's not possible to adjust one and sync the rest:

Shot with a MkIV, 70-200 II, ISO 8000.

IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com …wrphotography/6​713950777/
Light Cycling example #2 by warren.robison, on Flickr

In this case, shooting RAW would save you. You shouldn't be editing a ton of images from an event -- you should only be applying camera raw edits to your winners. If you find that your editing burden is extensive, you need to learn to self-edit.

dakana wrote in post #13756678
Strobed gyms are different than an on-camera or close-to-axis flash. I've never met an editor who prefers the direct flash look.

I have.

dakana wrote in post #13756678
In this case, shooting RAW would save you. You shouldn't be editing a ton of images from an event -- you should only be applying camera raw edits to your winners. If you find that your editing burden is extensive, you need to learn to self-edit.

Save me yes and it does. Point is it takes twice as long to edit when you are dealing with cycling lights vs. strobes.

Again I understand there are people who prefer high ISO images. That cool...but I don't.

Well, I advocate strobbing as much as possible. I even shared my technique in another sport thread.

https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1138200

The concern I have is that although we want to capture the action as much as possible, we should take the role as journalist and minimize the interference of their game and competition. Maybe it's just my style, but I'd always like to keep the flash within 1 stop of ambient just to make the subject more prominent. To an athlete on the field, 1/2 to 1 stop of flash is not obtrusive. It's almost as if they're looking up at the score board or staring at opponent's white jersey or a reflection off someone's glasses. It's merely a blink of an eye without shocking the pupil causing a temporary blind spot. That's why most of the time the players in the game barely notice a minimal fill flash. The game continues... we get the shots... all is well.

Now, popping 3 stop over ambient is a threshold I rather avoid as much as possible. As an athlete myself (at one time), even someone in close range with a p&s can be quite disruptive to a player.

OP shots are quite good no doubt... but to do that continuously throughout the game can really annoy not only the athletes but the spectators as well.

Phil-these are great images showing why we need to shoot -3 ambient so the flash freezes motion. I am curious why you didn't bounce the speedlite to eliminate the red-eye problems. If I can shoot 1/500 at ISO 3200 or less, I'll shoot ambient. If not I use a speed light bounced. I don't mind the dark backgrounds so much but some do not like the "look".

Tim S wrote in post #13759029
Phil-these are great images showing why we need to shoot -3 ambient so the flash freezes motion. I am curious why you didn't bounce the speedlite to eliminate the red-eye problems. If I can shoot 1/500 at ISO 3200 or less, I'll shoot ambient. If not I use a speed light bounced. I don't mind the dark backgrounds so much but some do not like the "look".

I tried two shots with bounced flash and I wasn't able to get enough light on the players for my 3 stops over ambient. Recall that the baseline was off limits because that wall was only about 5-6 feet away (padded wall under the hoop etc) so I shot from 10 feet off the corner of the court. If I ever go back to that venue, I'll have to try some more bounced shots. Ambient shots looked really bad on the lcd but now I wish I'd have more time and opportunity for experimentation. The light was from old bulb type lights and the skin tones looked jaundiced to the naked eye. As I mentioned before, the light from the skylights became nonexistent as darkness fell. Never having been there, knowing I had to come back with something, I went with what looked best on the lcd.

It would be fun to shoot a quarter ambient, one direct flash, and one bounced flash then compare results for this gym. It was not an easy place to shoot. I'll have to see if I have any wide angle shots to show the layout.

Phil

Have you ever tried bouncing off the end wall when shooting from the corner like that? This was shot just outside the lane but my 580 was turned back toward the wall on an angle and angled slightly up. I thought the framework might make some weird shadows but I didn't see any in my test shots. ISO 1250, f/3.5, 1/250 (50D and Sigma 17-50 f/2.8 OS HSM) This is the darkest gym in our league, I don't use flash in our home gym.

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