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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre General Photography Talk 
Thread started 07 Feb 2012 (Tuesday) 14:29
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POLL: "Nikon D800 or wait"
Switching now
104
12.5%
Waiting for Canon announcement
296
35.7%
Loyal Canon fan for life. :)
430
51.8%

830 voters, 830 votes given (1 choice only choices can be voted per member)). VOTING IS FOR MEMBERS ONLY.
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Who's making the switch to Nikon / D800

 
Bob_A
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Mar 03, 2012 00:01 |  #676

KenjiS wrote in post #14012097 (external link)
Even then.. the only lenses Nikon has nothing really equivalent to are the 50 f/1.2 and the 85mm f/1.2..

Even the 85mm f/1.2 you could say is comparable to the Nikon 85mm f/1.4... I've seen side by sides..and they're both really cracking lenses...

The 135L is stated a lot..but for portraits..the 135mm f/2 DC is no slouch, its supposed to be a Bokeh master...its only big issue is that the AF isnt lightning quick like the 135L and people misunderstand it

Nikon really needs an equal (IQ and price) to the 100-400L though. It's about the only real weakness in their zoom line-up. A 70-200 f/4L IS equivalent would also be nice, but after being pleasantly surprised by the IQ from the 70-300VR it's not a big "want" anymore.


Bob
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snaphappyphotography
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Mar 03, 2012 00:23 |  #677

I have to admit, one of the things that's really holding me back is the 85 1.2LII. I'm going to take some time to research Nikon's 85 1.4 and see how it compares. At least it costs less


D800, D700, MB D10, 85 1.4G, 70-200 2.8G VR II, 16-35 f4G VR II, 60 2.8G Micro, SB 910 (x4), SB 900, Radio Popper PX Trans (x2), Radio Popper PX Rec (x3)

  
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Tonyz
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Mar 03, 2012 00:25 |  #678
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snaphappyphotography wrote in post #14007390 (external link)
I've been trying to confirm if the 5DIII has facial tracking like the 1DX. When I demoed the 1DX the live facial tracking was astonishing. The Canon rep showed me how it would track a bride's face as she walked down the aisle for example. But from what I read the 5DIII didn't inherit this feature. The D800 however, does have it, so does the D4.

I'd also like to know this.

From the spec list at Northlight Images, I can see that the 5D3 has face detection, but I guess it is not the same thing as facial tracking..?

One thing the D800 also has is "facial recogniton exposure". I am not sure if that is the correct name, but it will automatically set perfect exposure for face.

Of course 5D3 fanboys will instantly call this feature "a gimmick for noobs", but I think it can be very useful.




  
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snaphappyphotography
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Mar 03, 2012 00:51 |  #679

Ok I got another one to add to the list, the metering system from the D800 is identical to the metering on the D4, but the 5DIII inherited the metering system from the 7D

oh and i forgot the option of shooting without an antialiasing filter

ok, also just found that the D800 has digital zoom on video, not that i care

and another, focuses at f8, unlike canon for example when you put on an extender


D800, D700, MB D10, 85 1.4G, 70-200 2.8G VR II, 16-35 f4G VR II, 60 2.8G Micro, SB 910 (x4), SB 900, Radio Popper PX Trans (x2), Radio Popper PX Rec (x3)

  
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ajp_mirc
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Mar 03, 2012 01:34 |  #680

snaphappyphotography wrote in post #14010977 (external link)
Seriously guys, if you can think of anything else please let me know. I'm going to make a separate thread about it and I know there are some other things :)

video real time auto-focus (5D Mark III is still manual focus or press button to refocus - lowering mirror and interrupting video)
built in flash with remote trigger functionality
ability to save in TIFF format
AF low light EV compensation to -3EV

plus ...
ff and crop support (1.2, 1.5 and a 5:4 format crop) using full sensor
ability to use lenses designed for full frame and crop
ability to use all Nikon lenses ever made (with some minor exceptions)

5D Mark III advantages over Nikon D800:
6fps vs 4fps
native ISO to 25,600 (only available in hi range on D800)
expanded ISO to 51200 and 102400 (2 stops higher -- but note that Canon high ISO is questionnable on previous 5D bodies)


Andy

  
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ajp_mirc
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Mar 03, 2012 01:40 as a reply to  @ ajp_mirc's post |  #681

sorry, one more 5D Mark III advantage over Nikon D800:
HDR on 5D Mark III uses 3 images and can save each individual image vs 2 images on Nikon D800 with only one image saved (plus JPG only)

and one more for the D800:
HDR images from only one single shutter actuation


Andy

  
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Shadowblade
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Mar 03, 2012 01:44 |  #682

I'd say lenses are pretty even, at least among pro lenses.

Nikon wins pro-level zooms:

14-24 >> 16-35L
Nikon 16-35> > 17-40L
Nikon 24-70 > 24-70L (Mk I)
Nikon 70-200 f/2.8 = 70-200L Mk II
Nikon 200-400 - no Canon equivalent as yet

Pro-level regular-length primes are pretty even - which one 'wins' depends on which focal lengths you're interested in:

14L - no Nikon equivalent (but the 14-24 beats it anyway)
24L II < Nikon 24/1.4 (equivalent centre sharpness, but Nikon wins on CA, bokeh and corner sharpness)
35L < Nikon 35/1.4 (pretty close, though, but the Nikon seems to have less CA)
50L > Nikon 50/1.4 (IQ more or less identical, but Canon wins on the extra half-stop of aperture)
85L > Nikon 85/1.4 (IQ basically identical, but, again, Canon wins on the extra half-stop of aperture)
135L - no Nikon equivalent
200L = Nikon 200 f/2 (both excellent)
TS-E 17L - no Nikon equivalent
TS-E 24L II > PC-E 24 (similar IQ, but the Canon allows for adjustment of the angle between shift and tilt, and has a larger image circle with more shift)
TS-E 45 = PC-E 45 (very little to separate the two)
TS-E 90 < PC-E 85 (the Nikon seems slightly better, but there's not much to separate them)
Macros - pretty much even.

Canon wins supertele primes by a mile, since the Nikon ones are never in stock.




  
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ajp_mirc
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Mar 03, 2012 01:45 as a reply to  @ ajp_mirc's post |  #683

I have pre-ordered the D800 myself, but I do not necessarily encourage anyone else to do that. My decision is not based on higher megapixels (even most Nikonians would prefer somewhere around 24 MP).

The Canon 5D Mark III is a logical upgrade to the 5D Mark II (although quite pricey).


Andy

  
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Shadowblade
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Mar 03, 2012 01:47 |  #684

ajp_mirc wrote in post #14012641 (external link)
sorry, one more 5D Mark III advantage over Nikon D800:
HDR on 5D Mark III uses 3 images and can save each individual image vs 2 images on Nikon D800 with only one image saved (plus JPG only)

and one more for the D800:
HDR images from only one single shutter actuation

That's nothing that can't be replicated in post-processing, though, and with generally far better results. I see the 'HDR' mode as more a gimmick for non-professional use, rather than a serious tool.

As for the Canon having a native ISO up to 25600, from what we've seen so far, I don't think that translates to a 2-stop improvement in noise performance. The Nikon high-ISO shots look pretty good when downsized to 22MP, although it's a bit hard to judge, given the huge amounts of noise reduction applied to the Canon shots.




  
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Shadowblade
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Mar 03, 2012 01:51 |  #685

ajp_mirc wrote in post #14012661 (external link)
I have pre-ordered the D800 myself, but I do not necessarily encourage anyone else to do that. My decision is not based on higher megapixels (even most Nikonians would prefer somewhere around 24 MP).

The Canon 5D Mark III is a logical upgrade to the 5D Mark II (although quite pricey).

Actually, I'd say the 5D3 is a logical upgrade to the D700 - after all, they're both full-featured full-frame bodies with moderate (for their release date) resolution, good AF (the 5D3's will probably be better than the D700's AF, although not as good as the 1Dx or D800) and a decent frame rate. You gain 80% more megapixels, video, 1 extra fps (without the grip) and an expanded ISO range, but lose full weather sealing and 2fps (since the D700 with grip can shoot at 8fps).

The 5D2, in comparison, was an ultra-high-IQ sensor (for its day) mounted in not much of a camera. The D800/D800e is a more logical upgrade from that than the 5D3.




  
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woos
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Mar 03, 2012 02:05 |  #686

Bob_A wrote in post #14012261 (external link)
Nikon really needs an equal (IQ and price) to the 100-400L though. It's about the only real weakness in their zoom line-up. A 70-200 f/4L IS equivalent would also be nice, but after being pleasantly surprised by the IQ from the 70-300VR it's not a big "want" anymore.

It's true however, the 50-500mm OS sigma and the 120-300mm OS sigma make great alternatives.


amanathia.zenfolio.com

  
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ajp_mirc
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Mar 03, 2012 02:17 |  #687

Shadowblade wrote in post #14012674 (external link)
Actually, I'd say the 5D3 is a logical upgrade to the D700 - after all, they're both full-featured full-frame bodies with moderate (for their release date) resolution, good AF (the 5D3's will probably be better than the D700's AF, although not as good as the 1Dx or D800) and a decent frame rate. You gain 80% more megapixels, video, 1 extra fps (without the grip) and an expanded ISO range, but lose full weather sealing and 2fps (since the D700 with grip can shoot at 8fps).

The 5D2, in comparison, was an ultra-high-IQ sensor (for its day) mounted in not much of a camera. The D800/D800e is a more logical upgrade from that than the 5D3.

Upgrade paths are normally within the same manufacturer's line up. I had a D700 and wouldn't consider the 5D Mark III as an upgrade. I also do not consider the D800 as an upgrade to the D700 ... neither does Nikon. The D800 is really a "hybrid". I wouldn't even compare it to any medium format camera ...

It is fairly common knowledge that the AF on the 5D Mark II was not that good, and there were many problems with banding issues. The original 5D had much better "black" saturation that the 5D Mark II ... sorry, but I have reason to suspect the claims by Canon on the 5D Mark III and am not willing to put any of my money into trusting those claims.

The 5D Mark II had one distinct advantage over a D700 and that was video. But that was the only advantage. Pesonally, I don't shoot that much video, but for what I do, I prefer the Nikon D800's ability to do real time AF while shooting videos.


Andy

  
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ajp_mirc
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Mar 03, 2012 02:19 as a reply to  @ ajp_mirc's post |  #688

Sorry, I should have added that I have own/owned just about every body ever made by Canon and I am a CPS member. That included every 1D since the 1D Mark 2n, several of the 5D I, three of the 5D Mark II, plus most of their lenses in the 24 to 300mm range, in primes and zooms.


Andy

  
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ajp_mirc
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Mar 03, 2012 02:24 |  #689

Shadowblade wrote in post #14012664 (external link)
That's nothing that can't be replicated in post-processing, though, and with generally far better results. I see the 'HDR' mode as more a gimmick for non-professional use, rather than a serious tool.

As for the Canon having a native ISO up to 25600, from what we've seen so far, I don't think that translates to a 2-stop improvement in noise performance. The Nikon high-ISO shots look pretty good when downsized to 22MP, although it's a bit hard to judge, given the huge amounts of noise reduction applied to the Canon shots.

I also agree that HDR in post processing is the better choice. There are situations, though, where HDR in camera can be an advantage.

I'm certainly going to try it to determine where in-camera HDR fits appropriately.

I never think of only one way of doing things as a "must" ...


Andy

  
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Shadowblade
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Mar 03, 2012 02:26 |  #690

ajp_mirc wrote in post #14012731 (external link)
Sorry, I should have added that I have own/owned just about every body ever made by Canon and I am a CPS member. That included every 1D since the 1D Mark 2n, several of the 5D I, three of the 5D Mark II, plus most of their lenses in the 24 to 300mm range, in primes and zooms.

That's not even relevant.

I used to shoot landscapes on MF film. When the 5D2 came along, I upgraded to it, since, for the first time, it gave me similar IQ with the convenience of an entirely digital workflow.

If I were to make the same move from film to digital today, I'd be choosing the D800e. The requirements for the application remain the same, but the camera which best fulfils these requirements has changed.

Similarly many wedding and event photographers, as well as photojournalists, chose the D700 for its pro AF, decent FPS and (for the photojournalists) full weather sealing. If they were making the same choice today, the 5D3 would also be a viable choice, since it has incorporated so much of what separated the D700 from the 5D3 (not to say the the D800 wouldn't also fulfil their requirements just as well - particularly if they added an mRAW option in firmware).




  
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Who's making the switch to Nikon / D800
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