Need some ideas (Magazine shoot)

I was contacted to take some photos for a local publication. The story is on sign spinners - the guys hired to spin signs on street corners to draw your attention to the signs.

Here's the dilemma: The few ideas I came up with almost instantly are the ones the photo editor mentioned in passing, and now I've got a mental block as to how to improve upon those ideas. I'm loads better at assessing the scene once I'm there, but I always want to have a few ideas before the shoot so I don't go in totally blind.

If it helps:
Here's the scene: It will be at a fairly busy intersection in town. I'm supposed to meet up with the guys at about 10:00am, so light will be harsh (to say the least).
Here's the ideas: A wedge of a few sign spinners, the lead guy with the magazine's logo on it; the guy spinning in front of traffic, both from behind, and from across the intersection.

Thanks for any and all help!

Get close & low & shoot up with the 10mm?

I'm gonna try really hard not to sound like a jerk here, but I sort of think it's inevitable. No matter how I say this, I'm gonna end up sounding mean and jerkish, so I guess I'd might as well accept that now and get right to things.

This is coming off a bit like someone getting assigned some difficult math homework, and then saying to themselves, "I can't figure out this problem. So I'll post the problem online and wait for someone else to solve it."

Which I'm normally fine with. Hell, everyone gets help sometimes.

But just like the 10th grader who has to go online in order to find solutions to a 9th grade level math problem, it's sort of the same thing. The difference...at least with homework, you're sort of FORCED to be there (until you're an adult, or you've graduated). But I sort of think that by the time one starts to take on voluntary photography assignments, is sort of the time by which someone should be able to come up with IDEAS for themselves.

It'd be one thing if this was a question about a technique or a method. As in, you had an IDEA for the shoot, but that required using a certain TECHNIQUE which you're not all that familiar with. In that case, sure. Go get help. Although realistically, you should have something else to fall back on if your technique is lacking due to your lack of experience with that technique.

But inability to come up with an IDEA is not the kind of thing which one should ever have to ask on this kind of public internet forum. I am strongly of the opinion that if one cannot come up with ideas on their own, then one should not be taking on voluntary assignments for clients.

The ability to research is an important skill, but I absolutely don't think that applies to "I have to do a shoot and I'm out of ideas. Any suggestions?"

My suggestion: live with the fact that you agreed to do the work, and then come up with your OWN idea without having to ask someone on the internet to give it to you.

And that is really for your benefit more than anyone else's. Firstly, a hell of a lot of the ideas that you get suggested to you are likely to either be crappy, or not really feasible, or good ideas that just don't fit with what the client wants. No one here knows the context better than you (since you're the only one directly involved with that client, that location, that sign spinner). Everyone here can give a buttload of suggestions, but you're still gonna have to weed through a bunch of suggestions that are garbage (garbage because the people giving you advice are dumbasses, garbage because the advice is good but doesn't work for your specific location/client/etc). And secondly, coming up with IDEAS is just sort of basic problem-solving. One should NOT take on assignments for others until one is capable of coming up with their own ideas. This can potntially save a person from taking on an assignment and then failing to deliver due to a lack of ideas.

So yeah...I know this probably makes me sound like a total jerk. But no one forced you to take on this assignment. I think the best thing to do is for you to cone up with your OWN ideas and not ask people to hand them to you. If you're at the point of accepting work without having an idea already in mind, then you're at the point where you don't have to go online and ask people to help you come up with ideas.

Clean Gene wrote in post #14117543
I'm gonna try really hard not to sound like a jerk here, but I sort of think it's inevitable. No matter how I say this, I'm gonna end up sounding mean and jerkish, so I guess I'd might as well accept that now and get right to things.

This is coming off a bit like someone getting assigned some difficult math homework, and then saying to themselves, "I can't figure out this problem. So I'll post the problem online and wait for someone else to solve it."

Which I'm normally fine with. Hell, everyone gets help sometimes.

But just like the 10th grader who has to go online in order to find solutions to a 9th grade level math problem, it's sort of the same thing. The difference...at least with homework, you're sort of FORCED to be there (until you're an adult, or you've graduated). But I sort of think that by the time one starts to take on voluntary photography assignments, is sort of the time by which someone should be able to come up with IDEAS for themselves.

It'd be one thing if this was a question about a technique or a method. As in, you had an IDEA for the shoot, but that required using a certain TECHNIQUE which you're not all that familiar with. In that case, sure. Go get help. Although realistically, you should have something else to fall back on if your technique is lacking due to your lack of experience with that technique.

But inability to come up with an IDEA is not the kind of thing which one should ever have to ask on this kind of public internet forum. I am strongly of the opinion that if one cannot come up with ideas on their own, then one should not be taking on voluntary assignments for clients.

The ability to research is an important skill, but I absolutely don't think that applies to "I have to do a shoot and I'm out of ideas. Any suggestions?"

My suggestion: live with the fact that you agreed to do the work, and then come up with your OWN idea without having to ask someone on the internet to give it to you.

And that is really for your benefit more than anyone else's. Firstly, a hell of a lot of the ideas that you get suggested to you are likely to either be crappy, or not really feasible, or good ideas that just don't fit with what the client wants. No one here knows the context better than you (since you're the only one directly involved with that client, that location, that sign spinner). Everyone here can give a buttload of suggestions, but you're still gonna have to weed through a bunch of suggestions that are garbage (garbage because the people giving you advice are dumbasses, garbage because the advice is good but doesn't work for your specific location/client/etc). And secondly, coming up with IDEAS is just sort of basic problem-solving. One should NOT take on assignments for others until one is capable of coming up with their own ideas. This can potntially save a person from taking on an assignment and then failing to deliver due to a lack of ideas.

So yeah...I know this probably makes me sound like a total jerk. But no one forced you to take on this assignment. I think the best thing to do is for you to cone up with your OWN ideas and not ask people to hand them to you. If you're at the point of accepting work without having an idea already in mind, then you're at the point where you don't have to go online and ask people to help you come up with ideas.

Yep, you sound like a jerk, though I don't take offense, as I also accepted that it can sound pretty weak asking for help when I posted.

However, even with any crappy suggestions, it is helpful to sometimes have a seed of an idea planted, and see how I can grow it; even when you're an adult out on his own, you're sometimes still looking for help. As bad as it may look to you for me asking this question, I think it would be a bigger knock on me if I came back from this assignment not totally satisfied, and I hadn't looked down every avenue for an idea to spark me and get me going.

All that said, thanks for the idea Frank; I was planning something like that (UWA is great for setting the scene). I think I'm going to take along some strobes and stands and see what trouble I can find that way (after I've got useable shots are in the bag, of course!) - no guts, no glory

Maybe try the opposite of the WA also - do a long focal length shot and see what the telephoto "compression" does for the scene.

hello hello.

here are my 'crappy suggestions'.. place the guy in a very crowded place where people will be walking by him a lot, and tell him to stand completely still in a pose. then take a long exposure shot with a tripod and a strong nd filter (since the light is going to be strong as you mentioned). this could give the effect that the guy stays in one spot all day and everyone else walks by.. i hope that makes sense : )

Another idea could be to get a picture of the guy in a crowd and desaturate everything but him in post processing, to make him stand out..

just some of the top of my head, hope it helps !

Clean Gene wrote in post #14117543
... But inability to come up with an IDEA is not the kind of thing which one should ever have to ask on this kind of public internet forum. ....

Mean Gene, I agree with you, but for a different reason. Design work is almost always better when it comes from a single person's inspiration. Design done by a committee is almost always worse.

Vgrab, how about doing a storyboard (you could draw or photoshop in the sign twirlers) just to see if your idea has any potential? I'm sure you'd get plenty of good critical advice here.

vgrab wrote in post #14119613
hello hello.

here are my 'crappy suggestions'.. place the guy in a very crowded place where people will be walking by him a lot, and tell him to stand completely still in a pose. then take a long exposure shot with a tripod and a strong nd filter (since the light is going to be strong as you mentioned). this could give the effect that the guy stays in one spot all day and everyone else walks by.. i hope that makes sense : )

Another idea could be to get a picture of the guy in a crowd and desaturate everything but him in post processing, to make him stand out..

just some of the top of my head, hope it helps !

I like the first one a lot - I'd definitely try this if I were doing it.

cacawcacaw wrote in post #14119688
Mean Gene, I agree with you, but for a different reason. Design work is almost always better when it comes from a single person's inspiration. Design done by a committee is almost always worse.

Vgrab, how about doing a storyboard (you could draw or photoshop in the sign twirlers) just to see if your idea has any potential? I'm sure you'd get plenty of good critical advice here.

i was just pitching some ideas to the op : )

vgrab wrote in post #14120221
I was just pitching some ideas to the op : )

Oops, a case of mistaken identity. I meant to say that bjyoder, the OP, should start of with some storyboards showing his ideas.

But that doesn't relieve you of your responsibility towards this ad campaign!

Scene 1-
Sunrise in the city. A lone figure slowly walks toward the camera . . . .

Something that came to my mind was the idea of getting some "candids" in the better light of the earlier morning or the late afternoon after the "posing"/staged scenes were done. A longer lens and maybe taken from across the street or up/down the sidewalk and catching them "in action" could give a nice mix to your set.

The one downside to that is that people who are recognizable in a photo would need to sign a "model release" before the photos could be used commercially, for example, before the magazine could use them in a publication for ads or other commercial uses.

For that type of thing, you'd have to have assistants getting releases signed and redirecting people who don't want to be photographed.

And, make sure that you have the awareness of the city and needed permissions granted, and that the law enforcement officers in the neighborhood have a heads-up!

Just brainstorming here ...

1. spinner wearing nothing but a sign

2. mix of slow exposure + flash to get feel of motion

3. UWA, but from above

4. World from POV of spinning sign

J Michael wrote in post #14142510
... 4. World from POV of spinning sign

I like that idea.

Think composite shots... that's all I'm going to suggest