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Thread started 30 Mar 2012 (Friday) 02:44
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550D autofocus

 
alphatrix
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Mar 30, 2012 02:44 |  #1

Hello everyone. I have a question regarding autofocus. My usual setup is a 550D with a tamron 17-50 (non VC version). I really like this combo but the autofocus seems slow, especially compared to the focus speed of the 70-200 f4 L I borrowed. Tracking I either do it wrong or the camera/lens doesn't keep up, not sure which one. I'm not sure what to upgrade first. I've been wanting to upgrade the body for a while because of the focus system and other smaller issues I have with the camera (viewfinder, size of the body ...).
But now I'm not sure anymore what to upgrade first. The idea was to get a 5D3 to satisfy my (likely unjustified) craving for FF and great AF system. That was untill I saw the price and realised that for that price I could buy a 5D2 and a 7D. Also I would need a lens to go with it.
Now back to the autofocus how does the autofocus of the 5D2 compare to the 550D? Some posts I read make it sound like a prehistoric system. I know it has only 9 AF points like the 550D but I'm used to only using the center point only so that is not so bad. Say I were to keep the body but upgrade my lens to a canon 17-55 or a 24-105, I'm sure it will be better aswell. Or should I get myself a 7D and keep the tamron? I know if I go the 5D way I'll need a lens aswell.
First question I'll get is, "what do you shoot?" so I'll answer that right away. I mostly shoot people, candids at events so its usually hit or miss. I also go out quite a bit to static objects (cars, trains, trees, landscapes sometimes) where the AF is less important. Lately I've been wanting to try studio photography aswell, not sure how that all works yet.

TLDR; I want my autofocus to be snappier/faster, should I upgrade my lens or body?




  
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Foggiest
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Mar 30, 2012 03:36 |  #2

alphatrix wrote in post #14179387 (external link)
the autofocus seems slow, especially compared to the focus speed of the 70-200 f4 L I borrowed.

Did you answer your own question there ?

Borrow the lens again if you can and do some tests .

I have a 550 and a 70-200 F4 L , and that seems quick enough .
A faster camera system will acquire AF lock faster and more accurately , but the lens still has to move focus elements .

IMHO I think the way forward is to get a lens with a ring type USM , essentially an L series .
A lens of that quality will be with you for a long time and will be suitable for any body upgrades , including full frame .




  
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modchild
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Mar 30, 2012 04:37 |  #3

I'm using a 550D at the moment and compared with the 7D and 5D2 I sold last week it focusses with the same speed as the 5D2 and very slightly slower than the 7D with the same lens on. With my 70-200 2.8 IS L the focus is like lightning with the 550D, but TBH I would expect a lens that costs 4 times as much to be faster focussing.
My 18-55 IS is fairly slow to AF compared to the 70-200 but it's still quick enough to get most shots I want. I've just been using my Canon 100 2.8 L macro on my 550D and the focus is very fast on that too. I guess the old saying of "you get what you pay for" rings true with regards to lenses.
I'm waiting for a delivery of a 5D MkIII and I would sure like to know how fast that's going to be when coupled with my 70-200.


EOS 5D MkIII, EOS 70D, EOS 650D, EOS M, Canon 24-70 f2.8L MkII, Canon 70-200 f2.8L IS MkII, Canon 100 f2.8L Macro, Canon 17-40 f4L IS, Canon 24-105 f4L IS, Canon 300 f4L IS, Canon 85 f1.8, Canon 50 f1.4, Canon 40 f2.8 STM, Canon 35 f2, Sigma 150-500 OS, Tamron 18-270 PZD, Tamron 28-300 VC, 580EX II Flash, Nissin Di866 MkII Flash, Sigma EM 140 Macro Flash and other bits.

  
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alphatrix
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Mar 30, 2012 06:11 |  #4

Foggiest wrote in post #14179484 (external link)
Did you answer your own question there ?

Partially yes, its a totally different focal length than the one I use most, I havent had the chance to compare 17-50 range lenses on the 550D.

modchild wrote in post #14179578 (external link)
I'm using a 550D at the moment and compared with the 7D and 5D2 I sold last week it focusses with the same speed as the 5D2 and very slightly slower than the 7D with the same lens on. With my 70-200 2.8 IS L the focus is like lightning with the 550D, but TBH I would expect a lens that costs 4 times as much to be faster focussing.
My 18-55 IS is fairly slow to AF compared to the 70-200 but it's still quick enough to get most shots I want. I've just been using my Canon 100 2.8 L macro on my 550D and the focus is very fast on that too. I guess the old saying of "you get what you pay for" rings true with regards to lenses.
I'm waiting for a delivery of a 5D MkIII and I would sure like to know how fast that's going to be when coupled with my 70-200.

Very nice, that is just about all the info I needed. Guess I'll be updating my glass before I descide on what body I want to upgrade to.

Thanks for the replies!




  
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Foggiest
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Mar 30, 2012 06:26 |  #5

alphatrix wrote in post #14179721 (external link)
Partially yes, its a totally different focal length than the one I use most, I havent had the chance to compare 17-50 range lenses on the 550D.

Ermmm , so you missed this part ?

Foggiest wrote in post #14179484 (external link)
IMHO I think the way forward is to get a lens with a ring type USM , essentially an L series .




  
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alphatrix
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Mar 30, 2012 06:42 |  #6

Foggiest wrote in post #14179754 (external link)
Ermmm , so you missed this part ?

I concluded with saying I'd update my glass, so no, I didn't miss that :)




  
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alphatrix
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Apr 13, 2012 03:57 |  #7

I have a follow up question on this. I was shooting at a party last weekend. Since there was no constant and generally low lighting I had issues focusing. Will a different body do a beter job focusing? I mean, focus more accuratly, not faster. Or is this solely lens related? I was using my tamron 17-50 f2.8.




  
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swen0332
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Apr 13, 2012 08:34 |  #8

alphatrix wrote in post #14258017 (external link)
I have a follow up question on this. I was shooting at a party last weekend. Since there was no constant and generally low lighting I had issues focusing. Will a different body do a beter job focusing? I mean, focus more accuratly, not faster. Or is this solely lens related? I was using my tamron 17-50 f2.8.

I'd be interested in the answer to this as well. I'm wondering about upgrading to a 7D from a 550D. I want to know if it would provide the faster focus or if upgrading lenses is more important....


_______________
Canon 7D, EF-S 10-22mm, 28-135mm IS, 55-250mm, EF 50mm 1.8.

  
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amfoto1
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Apr 13, 2012 08:45 |  #9

All lenses and cameras are going to struggle more or less to focus in low light.

Some cameras are better: 5DII and especially 5DIII (it appears), for example.

Lens can help, too... an f2 or f1.4 prime allows in one or two stops more light during focusing than an f2.8 zoom, so the camera's AF system would have more to work with in low light situations.

A USM lens generally will be faster and more accurate focusing than a non-USM lens, too (Sigma's HSM and Tamron's USD that each offer on some lenses are roughly equivalent to Canon's USM), though there's a limit to how much the drive type might help in low light situations. Your particular Tamron lens is not USD, so don't expect it to be as fast, accurate or quiet as, say, a Canon 17-55 USM lens.

Comparatively, the 5DII and 550D AF systems aren't all that different. Both have 9 points and in both only the center AF point is cross-type. More about this below.

I don't have a 550D so can't really compare directly, but Canon rates the 550D/T2i's AF system to -0.5 EV, same as my 7D cameras. However, they rate the 5DII the same, though I know from experience that it's actually still able to focus (pretty slowly) about -1 or -1.5 EV, a little lower light than the 7D. The 5D Mark III is rated to -2 EV and most people find the new 61 point AF very usable in low light, so even that might be a conservative rating. At any rate, it seems the best Canon yet, focusing in low light. (1D series cameras are also quite good in low light. But I'm guessing that since you've ruled out 5DIII based on price, you are unlikely to want to spend even more on one of the 1D models. So I'm not trying to compare them here.)

However, you also can help the AF system. Your camera has "AF-assist" feature, which is done with the built-in flash firing short bursts to illuminate the subject and give the AF system something to lock onto. You can set this to work with Custom Function 7 (Page 194 in your manual. Note: default is "enabled", so unless you've changed the setting it should work if you just pop up the built-in flash... other settings turn it off or only allow it to work with an external flash or only as an IR beam from an external flash, if it's equipped with one). If you don't want the flash to fire, too, go into the camera's menu and under the first tab scroll down to "Flash Control". Select that and the first item you'll see is "Flash Firing". That's normally set to "Enable", change it to "Disable" and that will prevent either the built in flash or any attached external flash from firing, but still allow them to serve other purposes such as AF-Assist. (See page 147 of your manual.)

Less intrusive than that is the IR "AF-assist" grid that many Canon accessory flashes can provide. Perhaps some third party flashes offer it, too. You don't need to use the flash itself, if you don't want to do so. Simply set it up only as an AF-assist. Or, if you don't want to mount a flash, you can use an ST-E2 or ST-E3 wireless flash module mounted in the camera's hotshoe. These are a lot smaller than a flash and also can provide the IR "focus assist" grid.

You also will have more luck if you limit to the center AF point on your camera. It's a more sensitive "cross type".... while all the others are plain, single axis. The 5DII has similar layout: 9 AF points with only the center one as cross-type (though it actually has 6 hidden expansion points, but they only work in AI Servo and are also plain, single axis type). 7D has 19 AF points, all of them the more sensitive cross-type, though the center one is still more sensitive. 5DIII has 61 AF points, up to 41 of which act as cross-type.


Alan Myers (external link) "Walk softly and carry a big lens."
5DII, 7DII, 7D, M5 & others. 10-22mm, Meike 12/2.8,Tokina 12-24/4, 20/2.8, EF-M 22/2, TS 24/3.5L, 24-70/2.8L, 28/1.8, 28-135 IS (x2), TS 45/2.8, 50/1.4, Sigma 56/1.4, Tamron 60/2.0, 70-200/4L IS, 70-200/2.8 IS, 85/1.8, Tamron 90/2.5, 100/2.8 USM, 100-400L II, 135/2L, 180/3.5L, 300/4L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, EF 1.4X II, EF 2X II. Flashes, strobes & various access. - FLICKR (external link)

  
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lilkngster
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Apr 13, 2012 09:00 |  #10

AF speed. I think for you it comes down to your Tamrom lens, which I have never tried. My 17-55 focuses very quickly, similar to 70-200 f/4, but not as fast at the 70-200 f/2.8 II. Since you said you are updating glass, that will take care of that.

Low lighting focus hunting. Yes a better body will help, have you seen some of those low light AF shots from the 5dIII and Im sure the 1dx will be a monster, but these appear to be out of your budget. From your original post, I think you need to make sure you understand the abilities/limitations of the AF system. I find that AI servo and center point tracking works very well, not 1d level, but more than enough to track people or kids in my case.

Another alternative would be to pick up a flash. Again I do not know much about the third party ones, but with my 430exII I can bouce the flash in low light, but it also has a focus assist beam, basically a red color grid that it emits and your AF system can use to help focus. I use center focus only with the beam and it works quite well.

Since you say you are thinking of studio work, I think you should first pick up a flash and see how that works with your Tamron. Learn about lighting with your current set up and then figure out what you are lacking, i.e. better/another body, prime lenses, good lighting, etc.


6dII/1dIII|Bronica Sq-Ai/EOS 3/A1

  
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alphatrix
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Apr 13, 2012 09:48 |  #11

Thank you for the responses, it clears up some questions. I didn't know about the EV values of the AF system, or never payed attention to them anyway.
As for using a fast prime, I'd love to, but most of my foto's are taken at 17-22mm and afaik there are no fast primes in this range. Maybe I should go for a 5Dc with a 24mm or 28mm prime (not very familiar with those primes).

I guess I should have mentioned I was using a 430ex II with the focus assist beam (not sure if it used the flash as assit, I didn't notice it anyway) and I only ever use the center focus point becouse I find it easyer to reframe than to juggle focus points all the time, and ofcourse becouse of it being a cross type.
If you like you can see some of my foto's here (external link). As you can see a lot of them are them are soft. Not all of them due to bad focusing, movement and so on often times comes in play aswell. Most of these pictures are taken at either f4 or f5.6.




  
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