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Thread started 07 Apr 2012 (Saturday) 18:54
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Canon EF 70-200mm f/4L USM @ dancers on-stage ~100 feet?

 
clickfinish
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Apr 07, 2012 18:54 |  #1

Hello - I'm going to be shooting and recording video for a dance recital coming up. I'll be alone on this one and will be in the back of the auditorium ensuring the video is being recorded and such. I think I'm going to be about 100ft from the stage more or less. I'm going to be renting a lens and I've been recommended the Canon EF 70-200mm f/4L USM. The goal is what we all would like :) Sharp pictures, taking advantage of the good ambient light on stage and minimizing the motion blur.

Is this a good lens to start looking at?

Thanks!




  
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mike_d
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Apr 07, 2012 21:16 |  #2

Rent the 2.8 version. What body will you be using?




  
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Wilt
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Apr 08, 2012 01:18 |  #3

'motion blur'...

  • IS (Image Stabilization) takes care of PHOTOGRAPHER shake when the shutter speeds get slow, relative the the FL of the lens in use, and relative to trying to capture lower light. Canon 70-200mm f/4 IS
  • But only shutter speed takes care of SUBJECT motion blur, faster aperture is better. Canon 70-200mm f/2.8


200mm FL will capture an area that is about 7.5' x 11' at 100' away, on an APS-C camera. Don't know what it would do on your video camera.

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Tony_Stark
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Apr 08, 2012 01:24 |  #4

Rent either the 70-200 II or 200 f/2L and dont look back ;) For a more modest approach the 135L can do a spectacular job. It all comes down to how far/close you are from the stage and what kind of body you will be shooting with that can take high ISO shots and get you clean results :D


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clickfinish
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Apr 08, 2012 07:07 |  #5

mike_d wrote in post #14227705 (external link)
Rent the 2.8 version. What body will you be using?

I will be using a T3i

Wilt wrote in post #14228611 (external link)
'motion blur'...
  • IS (Image Stabilization) takes care of PHOTOGRAPHER shake when the shutter speeds get slow, relative the the FL of the lens in use, and relative to trying to capture lower light. Canon 70-200mm f/4 IS
  • But only shutter speed takes care of SUBJECT motion blur, faster aperture is better. Canon 70-200mm f/2.8


200mm FL will capture an area that is about 7.5' x 11' at 100' away, on an APS-C camera. Don't know what it would do on your video camera.

Sorry if I confused anyone. I'm not recording video with this. I just want to remain in the back and make sure all the video recording is going smooth, while I snap away right next to it.

So your recommendation is the Canon 70-200mm f/2.8

Tony_Stark wrote in post #14228620 (external link)
Rent either the 70-200 II or 200 f/2L and dont look back ;) For a more modest approach the 135L can do a spectacular job. It all comes down to how far/close you are from the stage and what kind of body you will be shooting with that can take high ISO shots and get you clean results :D

Thanks for the recommendation - now I've got more options than I thought of.. LOL

There will be good lighting on stage so I think I'm ok RE the shutter speeds(they need to be fast), So the f/2.8 definitely sounds appealing. So the 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II seems like a good suggestion.

Sorry for the newb question (but I am one), but what's the difference between the L and on-L version?

Thanks again everyone - This forum is priceless! I've learned so much here!




  
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mike_d
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Apr 08, 2012 11:07 |  #6

clickfinish wrote in post #14229309 (external link)
There will be good lighting on stage so I think I'm ok RE the shutter speeds(they need to be fast), So the f/2.8 definitely sounds appealing. So the 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II seems like a good suggestion.

Sorry for the newb question (but I am one), but what's the difference between the L and on-L version?

Remember that "good lighting" to the human eye can still be pretty bad to a camera.

All four of Canon's 70-200 lenses are L's. As are their 200mm f/2.8 and 200mm f/2. L lenses are Canon's premium line.




  
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clickfinish
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Apr 08, 2012 12:31 |  #7

mike_d wrote in post #14230199 (external link)
Remember that "good lighting" to the human eye can still be pretty bad to a camera.

All four of Canon's 70-200 lenses are L's. As are their 200mm f/2.8 and 200mm f/2. L lenses are Canon's premium line.

Thanks for the info Mike, I'll definitely keep this in mind. Luckily for me I've shot in this place more than once. I just had a terrible camera, lens and as a result caught all the blur possible - haha!

Hoping to rent that L lens for when I'm in the back and I'll swap into my 18-55, and run up to the front row for the pro performers to catch more close-up impact shots.

Again - thanks a lot guys!




  
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Tony_Stark
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Apr 08, 2012 12:33 |  #8

What body will you be shooting with?


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clickfinish
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Apr 08, 2012 12:39 |  #9

T3i this year! :)




  
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nathancarter
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Apr 09, 2012 11:18 |  #10

Watching your shutter speed will be key here. It's going to be a fine balance: you'll need it fast enough to reduce or eliminate motion blur on the dancers, yet you need it slow enough that you don't have to turn the ISO all the way up to get a proper exposure.

So that you maintain control of the shutter speed, I would suggest using the Tv mode and setting the ISO yourself. If you're very comfortable with the camera, you can even use full manual mode. Auto ISO might work, but since there's no way to dial in exposure compensation with auto ISO, if the stage background is very dark, auto ISO might overexpose.

For a slow dancer, if you're good at anticipating movements and knowing when the dancer will pause between moves, you can get away with around 1/125 or 1/160. You may still get a small amount of motion blur in the extremities, but I personally don't find this small amount of motion blur to be objectionable. Use the largest aperture you have (f/4 or f/2.8), and choose the ISO that allows you to get a CORRECT* exposure.

For a fast dancer, or if you want to catch them mid-leap, you'll need something faster - start at 1/200 and maybe even go up to 1/400 or even faster. This will necessitate a higher ISO in order to maintain the correct exposure.

* Correct exposure will be where the skin of the performer is properly exposed, or maybe a third of a stop over-exposed. This may be tricky to determine when using the camera's meter. If the back of the stage is a black curtain (this is common), the camera's meter will want to expose in such a way that it makes the whole scene into neutral-gray - it will overexpose because it wants to turn the black into gray, and the dancer will be washed out. Even worse, if the dancer is dressed in black, and the background is black, then the camera's meter will not give desirable results.

If the stage lighting is not changing, you'd do well to find the right exposure early in the performance, set the camera to manual settings, then adjust both the shutter speed and the aperture together. If the slow dancer leaves the stage and the fast dancer comes on, you'll increase the shutter speed by three clicks and also increase the ISO by three clicks.

If you're not comfortable adjusting the shutter speed and ISO on-the-fly, and the light is not changing during the show, then set it at 1/400, f/2.8, and whatever ISO you need for a proper exposure, and leave it there for the whole show. This will be faster than necessary for a slow dancer, so you'll be sacrificing a little bit of ISO, but it will be safe and easy.


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clickfinish
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Apr 09, 2012 12:39 |  #11

Totally awesome advice nathancarter!! I'm comfy with all that you've recommended here and I'm definitely onboard and ready to use your advice. Since I've been shooting dancers for some time now, I know the music well enough and can nearly anticipate those "impact/dramatic/perfe​ct" moments. Thanks again everyone for the great advice. nathancarter thanks for the in-depth advice and technique!




  
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clickfinish
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Jun 20, 2012 12:20 |  #12

Just rented it: http://www.borrowlense​s.com …Canon_70-200mm_f2.8_IS_II (external link)

To be used this weekend! I'll try to point some shots!

Thanks again!




  
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nathancarter
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Jun 20, 2012 12:36 |  #13

Looking forward to them!

Don't be afraid to chimp a little bit, but don't rely on the LCD image too much to check exposure. Since it's a backlit LCD in a darkened room, properly exposed shots may look too bright, and underexposed shots may look just right. This gets me every time and and I never learn my dang lesson! argh. Fortunately, I can correct the under-exposure after shooting in raw.

But, definitely chimp a few shots (and zoom in to inspect detail) to check for focus accuracy, and for verifying that you're capturing an acceptable amount of motion blur.


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clickfinish
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Jun 20, 2012 12:44 |  #14

Thanks nathancarter! I'm not worried about being called a rookie cause I chimp. I'm always learning and I want to make sure that I get "the shot" .. I don't want to learn my lesson after the event and waste money, time and that moment :)

I was shooting with my 55-250mm f/4 and next to me was someone with the 70-200 f2.8 and the differences were so obvious. So eventually I'd like one of these bad boys due to the distance I shoot at these events..

I'm really seeking the 24-70 f2.8 cause in most other situations I'm nice and close to the stage..

Thanks again!




  
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Jun 20, 2012 18:03 |  #15

Images from roughly 100 feet from a stage using a Canon T2i and a Tamron 70-200mm f/2.8 lens. Yoou can expect similar framing.

IMAGE NOT FOUND
Byte size: ZERO | Content warning: NOT AN IMAGE

Focal Length: 200.0mm
Aperture: f/2.8
Exposure Time: 0.0040 s (1/250)
ISO equiv: 1250
Exposure Bias: none
Metering Mode: Partial
Exposure: program (Auto)
White Balance: Manual
Flash Fired: No (enforced)
Orientation: Normal
Color Space: sRGB

IMAGE NOT FOUND
Byte size: ZERO | Content warning: NOT AN IMAGE


Focal Length: 200.0mm
Aperture: f/2.8
Exposure Time: 0.0025 s (1/400)
ISO equiv: 3200
Exposure Bias: none
Metering Mode: Partial
Exposure: Manual
Exposure Mode: Manual
White Balance: Manual
Flash Fired: No (enforced)
Orientation: Normal
Color Space: sRGB

IMAGE NOT FOUND
Byte size: ZERO | Content warning: NOT AN IMAGE

Focal Length: 188.0mm
Aperture: f/2.8
Exposure Time: 0.0050 s (1/200)
ISO equiv: 1600
Exposure Bias: +0.67 EV
Metering Mode: Spot
Exposure: shutter priority (semi-auto)
White Balance: Manual
Flash Fired: No (enforced)
Orientation: Normal
Color Space: sRGB

From experience at similar events, there's an definite advantage to a f/2.8 lens over a f/4 lens in capturing images from stage events. Fortunately there are reasonably priced 70-200mm f/2.8 lenses from Tamron (external link) and Sigma. (external link)

clickfinish wrote in post #14227207 (external link)
H
ello - I'm going to be shooting and recording video for a dance recital coming up. I'll be alone on this one and will be in the back of the auditorium ensuring the video is being recorded and such. I think I'm going to be about 100ft from the stage more or less. I'm going to be renting a lens and I've been recommended the Canon EF 70-200mm f/4L USM. The goal is what we all would like :) Sharp pictures, taking advantage of the good ambient light on stage and minimizing the motion blur.

Is this a good lens to start looking at?

Thanks!




  
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Canon EF 70-200mm f/4L USM @ dancers on-stage ~100 feet?
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