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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 15 Apr 2012 (Sunday) 02:52
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Canon EOS 5D Mark III Service Advisory - Light Leak Phenomenon

 
brose
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Apr 17, 2012 06:30 |  #46

Would be a civilised courtesy Mr Jensen to pm me about trashing my post to this thread. Needless to say I am unlikely to contribute to any future thread in which you are involved. Pitiful manners, and I register my objection!

Neil




  
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GWLS
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Apr 17, 2012 06:34 |  #47

I've just reported another bug to Canon where the camera's Custom Controls function seem faulty.
When I select to change the M-Fn button to * for example for exposure lock, it only keeps the setting for a few seconds, then loses the function altogether.




  
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Dj ­ R
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Apr 17, 2012 06:38 |  #48

GWLS wrote in post #14279799 (external link)
I've just reported another bug to Canon where the camera's Custom Controls function seem faulty.
When I select to change the M-Fn button to * for example for exposure lock, it only keeps the setting for a few seconds, then loses the function altogether.

You may need to change something else for that to work. Something related to AF spot/zone.....?


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GWLS
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Apr 17, 2012 07:08 |  #49

It makes the change, go to use it and it's ok... but then just like the normal * button , after about 4 seconds, it loses the functionality altogether.




  
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tommykjensen
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Apr 17, 2012 07:51 |  #50

brose wrote in post #14279794 (external link)
Would be a civilised courtesy Mr Jensen to pm me about trashing my post to this thread. Needless to say I am unlikely to contribute to any future thread in which you are involved. Pitiful manners, and I register my objection!

Neil

First post in this thread states

Arguing and personal attacks will not be tolerated and off topic posts will be deleted

Your post was off topic. Period. And from our rules

we reserve the right to delete any message for any or no reason whatsoever. Further, we reserve the right to make any modification we deem necessary or desirable to any message posted to the Forums.

When you registered here you agreed to those rules.


All further posts is off topic and will be deleted. If you have further comments then send them in pm.


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harroz
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Apr 17, 2012 14:15 |  #51

Can someone please explain, I read the canon advisory as being that if the rear lcd panel illuminates then you can get light leak into the viewfinder. Is this correct?

I'm reading a few posts in here which are saying light is being leaked through the top lcd panel, is this what's happening?

2 very different problems, light from the rear lcd through the viewfinder has always been and can of course be fixed by the user, light through the top lcd panel is a different matter entirely, that's a design fault. But, which is it, or is it both?



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sandpiper
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Apr 17, 2012 14:45 |  #52

harroz wrote in post #14281878 (external link)
2 very different problems, light from the rear lcd through the viewfinder has always been and can of course be fixed by the user, light through the top lcd panel is a different matter entirely, that's a design fault. But, which is it, or is it both?

It's the latter, light through the top panel. I suppose it could be thought of as a "design fault", but it's more a case (IMO) that nobody has ever worried about making them light tight as the triny little bit which gets through there is insignificant compared to a) the light that gets in through the viewfinder, even with your eye there, and b) the amount of light flooding in through the lens.

This isn't something specific to the 5D3, lots of other camera models do it too, including the 5D2. The reason it has never been a problem before is that nobody ever tried testing the lightmeter out, with the lens cap on, whilst waving a torch at the camera.

If it is a design fault, it's one that doesn't affect the camera in normal use. Those who habitually shoot with the lens cap on though, might find that those few extra photons making their way into an otherwise totally dark camera, may throw the meter off a little. However, I have seen test shots that somebody posted in these forums, where they compared two shots with the lens cap on. One was with the LCD dark, the other with it lit, and there was no noticeable difference in the exposure of the two images. They were both totally black all over. So it seems that even those who engage in "lens cap on" photography aren't unduly affected.




  
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harroz
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Apr 17, 2012 15:18 |  #53

ah right, thanks for that. I thought it was the earlier until reading this thread, so if you're shooting a shady side of a house, and standing with the sun hitting the lcd on top, it could have an effect on the image. interesting indeed!



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sandpiper
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Apr 17, 2012 15:52 |  #54

harroz wrote in post #14282199 (external link)
ah right, thanks for that. I thought it was the earlier until reading this thread, so if you're shooting a shady side of a house, and standing with the sun hitting the lcd on top, it could have an effect on the image. interesting indeed!

Even then it wouldn't have an affect. The amount of light flooding in through a wide open lens, in any sort of daylight, is several orders of magnitude greater than the tiny bit that is making it's way past the LCD, even if it is in direct sunlight and the subject is in the shade. Even the viewfinder, with your eye to it, will let more light pass into the camera than the LCD will. 5D3 users have confirmed that the phenomena occurs with the lens cap on, but have been unable to get it to make any difference at all in light conditions. They have managed it at night, well away from any lights, where there is little light entering the camera from the front, or in rooms with the lights off and lit with an ipad screen or whatever. However, such conditions are outside the meters ideal range anyway, and they are inherently inaccurate in such conditions to start with. Another half a stop shift could as easily make the exposure better as worse. Besides, so long as you don't shine a light on it, it won't affect the meter anyway.

In normal use, it is not going to budge the meter one iota. In extremely dark conditions, it may make half a stop difference if you shine a light on the LCD whilst metering. However, as such conditions are likely to give a poor reading anyway, the best thing is to check the histogram and set exposure from that, regardless of any possible LCD light leak.

This is no different than several other DSLR camera models by Canon, Nikon and others, produced over the last decade or so.




  
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mishra_sanju
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Apr 17, 2012 16:11 |  #55

tommykjensen wrote in post #14267972 (external link)
http://www.usa.canon.c​om …il&docId=0901e0​2480538fc7 (external link)

From Canon's announcement I would pay pay particular attention to this part. The countermeasures could be simply not to use the lcd ligth under the conditions this phenomenon occurs.


With Canon 5D Mark III Canon seems to have created a camera that cause so much friction between Canon entheusiasts that they argue over the smallest things from not living up to the wildest dream specifications to the ligth meter beeing affected when measuring ligth with the body/lens cap on....


Please all can we please calm down. And once each party realize difference in opinion agree to disagree and stop repeating the same arguments over and over again.


This is mainly to those members that have pre-ordered the camera: PLEASE respect when many many actual 5D3 owners say this phenomenon is NOT affecting the resulting photos. Fine if you want to wait until Canon comes with an official statement as to what to do about this but respect that many owners do not see this as an issue. I have not tested my camera simply beacuse I know for a fact that I will never ever shoot with lens/body cap on (except for when I forget to remove the lens cap :lol: ). I will test my camera the day someone can show me a real world photo that has been affected by this phenomenon . Until then I am fully enjoying a fantastic camera.

And to all of us that own the 5D3 and think this is not issue lets not aggrevate the situation by posting off topic rediculing comments.


Arguing and personal attacks will not be tolerated and off topic posts will be deleted and if same members continue down the path the other closed thread on this subject went they can expect to hear from a moderator or an admin.....

Thanks Tommy for ending this torture. I had exactly the same reaction as to why would I shoot or rather what will I shoot with the lens cap on. amyway I am having a wonderful time with a super duper camera.


Sanjeev
Canon 5D Mark III, Canon 7D, 70-200 L MKII / 35 1.4L / 24-105L / 100-400 L/10-22/ Feisol / 580EXII

  
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harroz
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Apr 17, 2012 16:35 |  #56

oh, well thats good then! whew :D

sandpiper wrote in post #14282377 (external link)
Even then it wouldn't have an affect. The amount of light flooding in through a wide open lens, in any sort of daylight, is several orders of magnitude greater than the tiny bit that is making it's way past the LCD, even if it is in direct sunlight and the subject is in the shade. Even the viewfinder, with your eye to it, will let more light pass into the camera than the LCD will. 5D3 users have confirmed that the phenomena occurs with the lens cap on, but have been unable to get it to make any difference at all in light conditions. They have managed it at night, well away from any lights, where there is little light entering the camera from the front, or in rooms with the lights off and lit with an ipad screen or whatever. However, such conditions are outside the meters ideal range anyway, and they are inherently inaccurate in such conditions to start with. Another half a stop shift could as easily make the exposure better as worse. Besides, so long as you don't shine a light on it, it won't affect the meter anyway.

In normal use, it is not going to budge the meter one iota. In extremely dark conditions, it may make half a stop difference if you shine a light on the LCD whilst metering. However, as such conditions are likely to give a poor reading anyway, the best thing is to check the histogram and set exposure from that, regardless of any possible LCD light leak.

This is no different than several other DSLR camera models by Canon, Nikon and others, produced over the last decade or so.



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BHollis
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Apr 17, 2012 22:17 as a reply to  @ harroz's post |  #57

Since the operating range of the 5D3's light meter is Ev 1 to 20 according the manual, I decided to try testing for the light leak phenomenon at a light level equivalent to Ev 1--the minimum light light level at which the 5D3's light meter can be relied upon to provide an accurate reading. Although I'm not an expert on Ev levels, after consulting a chart on Wikipedia, I determined that at f/5.6 and ISO 100, Ev 1 would correspond to a shutter speed of 15 seconds. (If I'm wrong about this, I'm sure someone will tell me.) So I set my 5D3 to ISO 100, and my lens to f/5.6, took off the lens cap, covered the viewfinder eyepiece, and found a dark environment where the 5D3's meter gave me a shutter speed of 15 seconds. Then I pressed the LCD illumination button to see what, if anything, would happen.

Having previously convinced myself that the leak leak phenomenon was only likely to manifest itself at Ev levels far below Ev 1, I fully expected to see no change in the shutter speed. But to my surprise, I did see a change, although only a slight one--from 15 seconds to 13 seconds. Shining a flash light directly into the top LCD resulted in a similar change.

I then repeated the test by moving to a very slightly brighter area where the meter gave me a reading of 5 seconds--corresponding to something just over Ev 2. When I pressed the LCD illumination button this time, I saw no change, nor did I see any change with the flashlight.

So, what conclusions do I draw from this. Well, contrary to my earlier assumption, it does appear that this phenomenon could affect metering within the 5D3's published metering range--but only at the very bottom of the range--around Ev 1--and only very slightly--the difference between 15 seconds and 13 seconds. If you're trying to meter at lower light levels, say around Ev -4 where most of the testing I've seen posted has been occurring, the effect on the meter reading will likely be more significant, but of course, any metering you might try to do at Ev -4, or any other level below Ev 1, is already inherently unreliable.

Bottom line for me: Yes, the phenomenon is real and can affect meter readings in very low light levels of Ev 1 and below, but so long as I avoid using the lcd illumination button while metering in the dark, or shining flash lights into the top of my camera, I just don't see it being a problem. And I don't think that's going to be difficult for me, since after owning my 7D for around 2-1/2 years, I don't recall ever using the lcd illumination button.

It will be interesting to see what Canon says about all this, though.




  
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ChrisJ_SLH
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Apr 18, 2012 02:25 |  #58

BHollis wrote in post #14284233 (external link)
Having previously convinced myself that the leak leak phenomenon was only likely to manifest itself at Ev levels far below Ev 1, I fully expected to see no change in the shutter speed. But to my surprise, I did see a change, although only a slight one--from 15 seconds to 13 seconds. Shining a flash light directly into the top LCD resulted in a similar change.

That's interesting. I haven't personally been able to get any change to register with the lens cap of yet, not that I've been trying a lot.

One question for you, as your lens cap was off, was there any possibility of reflected illumination from either the LCD back light or flash light to find its way through the lens in a normal manner, ie could they have just been lighting the room (or whatever) sufficiently to cause the meter change?




  
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str8six
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Apr 18, 2012 08:19 |  #59

BHollis... Interesting test and results. Thanks for sharing.


Regards, Len B
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ChrisJ_SLH
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Apr 18, 2012 08:46 |  #60

MOD edit: removed quoted spam

I wasn't having a go at BHollis, I hope it didn't come across as that.

I was just ensuring that his experimental was properly controlled. At the light levels we are talking about here, ie practically none, it would be easy for the slightest thing to register on the light meter.




  
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Canon EOS 5D Mark III Service Advisory - Light Leak Phenomenon
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