Scopes indicted 90 years ago today

http://learning.blogs.​nytimes.com …ed-for-evolution-lessons/

For teaching evolution. Even today in the USA, we're still dealing with this nonsense.

Some people are oblivious to reason or reality. Witness the Lens Forum and the infamous Crop Factor.

Jon wrote in post #14485369
Some people are oblivious to reason or reality. Witness the Lens Forum and the infamous Crop Factor.

Ah Jon, tragic but true!

I've personally never quite understood the debate between evolution vs. intelligent design.....why not just let both theories be known? Just make the students aware of each theory along with the merits and downfalls of each and let it go at that. I couldn't imagine either side being angry with that idea......is it such a bad thing to inform students that there are opposing viewpoints on certain things out there....even if we don't agree with those viewpoints? I personally wouldn't even mind if the teacher gave his/her personal viewpoint and his/her reason for believing that viewpoint, no matter what that viewpoint was. I''m all for the freedom of information......even when that information may contradict our own personal belief.

Because for some groups "Divine" is the only operative criteria...

And there is nothing you can say or show that will convince them that any other possible path from then to now exists.

jra wrote in post #14486625
I've personally never quite understood the debate between evolution vs. intelligent design.....why not just let both theories be known? Just make the students aware of each theory along with the merits and downfalls of each and let it go at that. I couldn't imagine either side being angry with that idea......is it such a bad thing to inform students that there are opposing viewpoints on certain things out there....even if we don't agree with those viewpoints? I personally wouldn't even mind if the teacher gave his/her personal viewpoint and his/her reason for believing that viewpoint, no matter what that viewpoint was. I''m all for the freedom of information......even when that information may contradict our own personal belief.

Sorry, Jason. Can't agree with you here. Intelligent Design is fine in a church, or a religion class, but not in a science class. It doesn't come anywhere close to meeting the criteria for a valid scientific theory. Anyone is free to preach Intelligent Design at home, but in a school science class it should be science that is the subject, not religion.

jra wrote in post #14486625
I've personally never quite understood the debate between evolution vs. intelligent design.....why not just let both theories be known? Just make the students aware of each theory along with the merits and downfalls of each and let it go at that. I couldn't imagine either side being angry with that idea......is it such a bad thing to inform students that there are opposing viewpoints on certain things out there....even if we don't agree with those viewpoints? I personally wouldn't even mind if the teacher gave his/her personal viewpoint and his/her reason for believing that viewpoint, no matter what that viewpoint was. I''m all for the freedom of information......even when that information may contradict our own personal belief.

Exactly!!! Thank you for common sense.

gibbit1 wrote in post #14486954
Sorry, Jason. Can't agree with you here. Intelligent Design is fine in a church, or a religion class, but not in a science class. It doesn't come anywhere close to meeting the criteria for a valid scientific theory. Anyone is free to preach Intelligent Design at home, but in a school science class it should be science that is the subject, not religion.

Neither does the theory of evolution.

jra wrote in post #14486625
I've personally never quite understood the debate between evolution vs. intelligent design.....why not just let both theories be known? Just make the students aware of each theory along with the merits and downfalls of each and let it go at that. I couldn't imagine either side being angry with that idea......is it such a bad thing to inform students that there are opposing viewpoints on certain things out there....even if we don't agree with those viewpoints? I personally wouldn't even mind if the teacher gave his/her personal viewpoint and his/her reason for believing that viewpoint, no matter what that viewpoint was. I''m all for the freedom of information......even when that information may contradict our own personal belief.

I agree with this.

The attempt to suppress views by both the left and the right is worrisome.

We need more logical, critical thinkers, not sycophants.

jra wrote in post #14486625
why not just let both theories be known? Just make the students aware of each theory along with the merits and downfalls of each and let it go at that.

Evolution is both a fact and a theory. Intelligent design is creationism.

John E wrote in post #14486977
Neither does the theory of evolution.

I don't think you know what "theory" means in science.

windpig wrote in post #14487000
I agree with this. The attempt to suppress views by both the left and the right is worrisome. We need more logical, critical thinkers, not sycophants.

There's no place for ID in science classrooms. It's religion and has no scientific basis. Evolution, on the other hand, has been demonstrated time and time again. It has earned its place in science.

Tony-S wrote in post #14487262
Evolution, on the other hand, has been demonstrated time and time again. It has earned its place in science.

But it has only been demonstrated in a minor way, birds evolving different beak shapes to suit food sources, how animals lost tails, or evolved flippers from legs, wings from arms. Yes, we understand the "evolution of man" from a scuttling early primate, through numerous primates, apes and proto humans, but no theory of evolution has yet come up with a plausible explanation of how we got from the primordial ooze to where we are now.

Darwinian evolution certainly doesn't explain any more than slight variations building up over time, and is going out of fashion as the answer to how evolution as a whole works. Even Darwin had his doubts and knew there were some gaping holes in the theory, which is why he held off publishing it for so long, only doing so when it seemed somebody else was about to publish the same theory and get in first.

Don't get me wrong, I am an evolutionist not a creationist. In fact I am fascinated by the subject, as I have yet to find a theory that satisfactorily explains HOW evolution got us to this point, or even got us off the starting blocks.

As Scientists can only demonstrate evolution working in relatively minor ways, and have no idea of how the big changes came about, it is still hard to say, scientifically, that natural evolution is the creative force behind all life as we know it. It is simply an assumption based on what we do know of evolution. Those who back the theory of intelligent design could equally assume that evolution, as proven, is simply nature fine tuning itself after the initial creation. Of course, that doesn't deal with other issues such as the age of the earth etc.

Regardless of your view, creationism (including "intelligent" design) isn't science and therefore doesn't belong in science classes. Evolution is science and has earned its place in the science classroom.