Torn between Canon G6 and Rebel XT...

Sophia, don't be disappointed at all about the G6, just a couple days ago, you wanted that one more anyway! You'll love it, it's loads better than most cameras, and when you hear a complaint about it, it's almost always either someone who doesn't understand how to use it, or someone unused to point and shoot cameras. I had an old fuji digital camera that I loved to death and when it died and i got the G6, I wondered how I ever put up with the Fuji (and I realized the fuji had options i'd never even tried out.)

The G6 will keep you busy and happy and learning for a long time. Well, a few years anyway, and by then you can buy a 3 terrapixel pocket plenoptic camera that can shoot color photos in total darkness, for $150.

Sophia,
Can you post an example?

Brian,
Mmmm, plenoptic... :drool

Andythaler wrote:
Robert,

Yes ... that's what I mean.
I assume you are talking about distance in feet (because I get the same values at www.dofmaster.com you gave in your calculation).

However ... to have the same focal length on the 350 as 7.2 on the G6, you'll have to use 21.9 mm (35 mm equivalent), so you arrive at a total depth of field of 1.21 ft (4.47 ft - 5.68 ft) which is an even bigger difference to the 4 ft of total area in focus that the G6 gives you.

However ... 35 mm equivalent focal length is not a very good example for a 'shallow depth of field' photo ... (apart from the fact that the only DSLR lens capable of giving f/2 is the Sigma 20/1.8 lens) ... I'd rather look at the 80 mm focal length (classic portrait focal length, 16 mm on the G6, 50 mm on the 350D) and a subject distance of 10 feet, with an aperture of f/2.8.

Here the values are:
G6: 4.19 ft total in focus (8.33 ft - 12.5 ft)
350: 1.29 ft total in focus (9.39 ft - 10.7 ft)
so you have the same ratio ... ~3x the depth of field, which is roughly equivalent to the difference in sensor size (makes sense, huh?)

If you continue to experiment, you will realize that the setting that will give you a comparable image on the 350D (as far as depth of field is concerned) is f/9 ... and everybody who has done a bit more intensive (I dare not say 'serious' ) portrait photography will know that f/9 is maybe not the optimal setting to achieve good background separation.

Point is, on the G6 you can not use a larger aperture than f/2.8, so you are pretty much limited to that effect. On the 350D, with the 320$ 50/1.4, you can get the area in focus down to 0.65 ft (9.69 ft - 10.3 ft), which is pretty shallow. It means that the eyes will be sharp, but the ears can already be out of focus ... if that is the effect you are going for.

Hope that helps

If you want to have a less technical demonstration... take a look at this image by Sikario (linked in another thread)

Dear Andy,

All is now clear. Using the 80 mm medium Tele definitely puts the G6 at a disadvantage. No doubt about it. End of story.

I appreciate your taking the time to lay that out for me, and I hope everyone else sees the significance of that, as well.

Thanks, Andy!

yeah!!

it seems that a lof of people who are choosing XT have it, or another high-end cam. of course it's easy for them to decide. it's like having a bmw, and never going back to owning a toyota.

you'll learn from the G6, and in my opinion it's going to be a good long-term camera anyway- since you can still use it as a daily cam when you don't feel like walking around with thousands of dollars in equipment.

when you feel the camera has taught you enoght, and when you feel confident to take the next step - get a good dSRL.

Sophia, bear in mind that the camera is only one part of the equation. You should also get an adequate photo editing software, where you can improve your pictures vastly. I think the Canon cameras ship with Photoshop Elements 2.0 as a freebie, which is an ok program. Photoshop Elements 3.0 is even better, as it comes bundled with Photoshop album which organizes your pictures neatly. If you can get Photoshop CS, then you are talking about serious photo editing as you can use more powerful tools. That's what I have, and it cost quite a bundle.

Great suggestion, Bb. Don't certain DSLRs come with a semi-cheap (still more than Elements) Photoshop CS bundle/rebate? Might be worth planning for that in a few years, and starting with Elements, which is quite a lot to learn in the first place (almost all of which transfers well to CS, I think).

Ok guys, I can't really wait for Xmas for my gist so I told to my brother to send me the cam and use it ASAP! lol I used it last night and it's pretty impressive. Colors are so rich. I'll show you a sample as soon I'm going to download it. I took a pasta with red sauce in it and it looks funny but nice. Maybe I took that shot 3 times coz the other 2 are blurry. Yup, very slight hand movement.I tried to steady my hand sooooo still just to ger a nice shot (hope it is). My problem is - if say I'm at downtoad, I usually stop for few seconds to take an expected scenery. Like, subway, people while shopping etc. So do I really have to still that much on crowded place? I like a quick snapshot. I haven't tried it yet though on crowded places. Is there a setting where I can still move quickly during/after shot without making blurry images? I tried it on film before where I move so fast and never get blurry images. 99% of my pictures using my film are never blurry even im in such a hurry. I bet, there's a setting on G6 where it minimizes or totally experience blurriness.

Sorry guys, I reread my latter post and got wrong spellings - here at work and can't compose a good one. But I'm sure you get what I mean guys. Thanks!

You were probably shooting high ISO (400 or 800) indoor film on the SLR.

G6 Auto mode always chooses 50 or 100 ISO (in other modes, you must set it manually). It's hard to get a good crisp shot even on an SLR at 50 or 100 ISO in low light. 200 ISO on the G6 is not unbearably noisy (grainy), try that. 400 ISO is pretty noisy, but it's sometimes best to get a noisy shot than a useless blurry one.

Remember, you want to use 1/60 or faster shutter speed to get a decent handheld photo. I have the shakiest hands in the universe, so i'm usually better off around 1/125. So try Tv mode (Tv mode sets the aperture automatically based on the shutter speed you choose) and set the camera for 1/60 or a little faster, and if you can't get a well-exposed shot there, your only options are to use a faster ISO or a tripod.

Also note that any motion in the shot will create blur, too, so if you're shooting moving objects, you might need a faster shutter speed depending on how fast they're moving.

One final thing, maybe someone can recommend a good resource for 'how to hold a camera.' the basics are to brace your arms to your chest and hold your breath before you shoot, but i could use more tips on that, too. any suggestions or links, anyone?

Sophia,
You might store a hyperfocal setting under your camera's C1 or C2 user mode, so you can just switch to that mode with the dial, and shoot away:
http://www.marcjutras.​com/ehyperfocal.html

I've had good luck with that. It's written for a G3, but it works the same on the G6. Optionally, you could also set the ISO up to 200 before storing the setting in C1 or 2, so that you always have a faster shutter speed. If you do, think about investing in a noise-reduction package like:
Noise Ninja http://www.picturecode​.com/
Neat Image http://www.neatimage.c​om/index.html?60

Camera bracing: Hold the camera like you would a heavy SLR--one hand on the grip, one cradling the bottom of the camera and the lens--the latter is easier to do with a lens adapter (http://www.lensmateonl​ine.com/newsite/G6.htm​l).

Look around for anything you can use as a tripod: walls, posts, trees, etc. Press the camera on top of/next to the immobile object, rotate your LCD to suit, and snap away, completely stable.

Failing that, flip the LCD so it's horizontal, facing upwards, and press the camera against your hips, and snap away--this can be easier to stabilize than holding the camera in front of you, but it can also be too low for shooting in a crowd (depending on what you want to capture).

Consider getting a mini-tripod, like the ultrapod:
http://www.pedcopods.c​om/products.htm
You can find these for under $15 at local camera stores, outdoor stores, etc. They fold up into a tiny package--about the bulk of two fat pens--and can easilly fit in a small camera bag, satchel, etc. Indispensible for self/family-portraits.

What do you mean by "noisy" bryan? Blurry or grainy?

Thanks guys. Don't get me wrong - is the Rebel Xt create also a blurry if i use it at the same condition just like what I've explained for g6? or G6 is more prone to bluriness...

Without going into too much detail:

Just as higher ISO (more sensitive) film becomes grainier, increasing the sensitivity of a CCD (the 'film' in your digital camera) results in "noise." it's like 'digital grain,' basically. So nothing to do with blurriness, you're just getting 'static' in the image. sometimes it can be removed with software, and depending on the photo or the camera, it might not be a problem, but at ISO200 on a G6, it's pretty noticeable, and ISO400 is pretty bad, though still useable for some applications, and like i said earlier, it's better than nothing.

most digitalSLRs have bigger and better sensors and can shoot at higher ISOs (well over 400) without obnoxious noise, so they'd have the option of shooting less blurry pictures, just because a higher ISO allows you to take steadier pictures in low light.

You can see actual G6 samples on this page (note they're comparing it to another camera, just look at the G6 samples and compare the different ISOs:

http://www.dpreview.co​m/reviews/canong6/page​14.asp

Note that subject motion and poor focusing can result in blur, too, I'm just talking about preventing camera movement, because that seemed to be the problem you were describing. post some photos and we can probably tell you more.

B.

Yup, I will post sample images soon. Thanks guys!

I've check the www.dpreview.com - nice images. have you seen this picture sample where kids are in a carousel with strings - or whatever you call it lol. I bet, that's a good one. Do you agree with my guys if I say that the sample pictures are better with G6 than Rebel? Also, I went to regular electronic stores - target and circuit city and doesnt carry G6 - wonder why.

I'm pretty happy with my G6 guys. I mean, I'm not yet ready for expensive / high end DSLR. Just for the body, it's more than expensive than G6. A good lens that I like is somewhat 400 bucks. So twice the price. I'll keep this "nice" gift for a while, learn from it and it will be time to move on for an another level. When I feel comfortable (financially and artistically), then time to buy more. I bet, photography wise, we all started from the bottom right? But if I try to look at it, starting from the bottom of digital and starting to G6 is really AWESOME for me! lol. I think I'm just in a hurry and I have to slow down a little bit. Just the blurriness worries me. But I'll learn.

Hey guys, where I can buy the booklet for G6? Can I find that at barnes?