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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 05 Jul 2012 (Thursday) 07:31
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Do crop sensors "appear" sharper than FF due to the crop factor?

 
pstyle1
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Jul 05, 2012 07:31 |  #1

So my 5D2 is for sale since I'm trying to buy a 5D3. Had a guy drive an hour to buy my newish 5D2 for a really good price.

He brought his 550D (T2i I believe) and his 35mm f/2.0 to compare. He used his lens on my 5D2 and his 550D, and the images (when zoomed in all the way) appeared sharper on his cam even after we fiddled around with micro adjust. He was kinda put off and didn't buy it. No big deal.

It didn't occur to me then, but I later realized that his pics must have appeared sharper due to the crop factor since a 35mm on a crop is more magnified.

Is that what happened or do I have a crappy 5D2?


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lannes
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Jul 05, 2012 08:28 |  #2

If any thing the crop should be less sharp when zoomed in, that's what happens when I compare the 7d to the 5dm2


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Jul 05, 2012 08:30 |  #3

maybe im just old school but you never compare images from the LCD screens on two different cameras. you should always compare using a computer on the SAME SCREEN. :)




  
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pstyle1
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Jul 05, 2012 08:31 |  #4

lannes wrote in post #14673119 (external link)
If any thing the crop should be less sharp when zoomed in, that's what happens when I compare the 7d to the 5dm2

Same focal length (not adjusted to make up for crop) and same distance from subject?


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Jul 05, 2012 08:32 |  #5

I wouldn't worry about it.

The tests I've ran between my 5d2 and T2i show the T2i has an advantage in the pixel density department. Though the 5d2 has advantages in a little lower ISO noise and over-all better picture quality, the T2i has a slight advantage in crop-ability. Some of the side by side tests I've done show the T2i has a little better resolution at 100% crops which shows a little bit better detail. I don't think it is anything to write home about.

The modern APS-C sized sensors found in the T2i, T3i, T4i, 60D, 60Da and the 7D are very good.


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David ­ Arbogast
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Jul 05, 2012 08:40 |  #6

One thing to consider is the quality of the lens being used. Lenses are sharpest in the center of the frame, but generally have fading sharpness going out towards the edges. A crop frame camera is cropping off the lens' worst performing areas. I just had a look at the 35mm f/2 MTF chart and it shows a pretty dramatic falloff in sharpness from the center to the corners. http://www.usa.canon.c​om …f_lens_lineup/e​f_35mm_f_2 (external link) The T2i is cropping off the worst of that, while the 5D II is showing everything. Since a relatively poor-performing lens was used for comparison, that might be the reason for the apparent disparity in sharpness.


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Jim_T
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Jul 05, 2012 08:50 |  #7

Another consideration is that with digital cameras, sharpness, color, contrast etc are all variable. Were the sharpness settings the same on each camera? And if they were at the default level... Did Canon make the default sharpening the same on both cameras or was the default sharpening in the crop camera slightly more aggressive?




  
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Jul 05, 2012 09:23 |  #8

Are you sure it wasn't just the mediocre AF on the 5DII:)?


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Jul 05, 2012 10:26 |  #9

So, he didn't buy based on reviewing the on-board screens of two different cameras? First off, on-board screens are $h!t. Second, did he account for change in the field of view since he used the same lens - eg fill the frame with the subject to the same amount for both shots? Third, your potential buyer was an idiot.


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EL_PIC
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Jul 05, 2012 10:31 |  #10
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The APS camera only uses the sweet spot of lens.
There are real and perceived differences.
Its alot like Petite and BBW in Females.


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cputeq007
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Jul 05, 2012 10:35 |  #11

Random question - was he shooting in JPEG on his camera, and were you shooting RAW on yours?

I would concur with the "buyer = idiot" assessment previously made, though. If his basis on whether the 5D2 is worth or not is a completely unreliable comparison of rear LCD images, then he probably doesn't need the 5D2 or any other FF camera.


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Jul 05, 2012 10:39 |  #12

He probably has the sharpness setting way up in his jpeg settings, while yours had a lower setting - what he saw was difference in processing and not in sensor performance. D'oh!


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Jul 05, 2012 13:31 |  #13

AJSJones wrote in post #14673658 (external link)
He probably has the sharpness setting way up in his jpeg settings, while yours had a lower setting - what he saw was difference in processing and not in sensor performance. D'oh!

That was what i was going to post. It's no way to test the IQ of any setup. I normally take test images and compare on my PC. That's why I kept my 100-400 after testing it against a 300F4 and a 400F5.6.


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SkipD
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Jul 05, 2012 13:48 |  #14

EL_PIC wrote in post #14673630 (external link)
The APS camera only uses the sweet spot of lens.

This is not true. Each point in an image formed behind is created by light coming through the entire surface of the lens' front element.

What is true - and probably what you meant - is that when using a lens designed for a 35mm film format camera (the so-called "full-frame") on a smaller format camera such as an APS-C format DSLR, the edges of the image formed behind the lens are lost due the smaller area of the APS-C sensor. Since the edges of the image are generally less corrected for errors than the center, the image captured by an APS-C format DSLR while using a lens designed for "full-frame", there may very well be less error in the captured image.


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BrickR
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Jul 05, 2012 14:21 |  #15

I wouldn't worry about it, the buyer doesn't sound exactly "well informed". There are a lot of factors to consider when doing a test like that. Doing it "on the fly" will in no way give a reliable result. The buyer should have brought their laptop, at the minimum, if they wanted to check picture quality. I can't count how many times I looked at my 3" LCD and thought the shot was great and when I see it on my real monitor I realize its slightly off.

Even more importantly, the 5d2 LCD isn't as sharp as the T2i's (pixel count) so comparing images on those separate LCDs is an even worse idea if you're checking sharpness.


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Do crop sensors "appear" sharper than FF due to the crop factor?
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