Question about "recovering" smart objects

Hello,

I'm still trying to get accustomed to what exactly smart objects can and cannot do. What I absolutely love about them is the ability to double click and go back into RAW and import those adjustments back into Photoshop while keeping all layers and adjustment intact--truly phenomenal.

When you are forced to rasterize the smart object in order to do certain adjustments that they do not accomodate, can you rasterize the smart object, then do your adjustments, then convert it back into a smart object, and still be able to go back into RAW as mentioned above?

What if you open a file into Photoshop as a standard "Background" layer (not smart object) and then add a bunch of layers and adjustments; can you at that point convert to a smart object and get back into RAW from it?

And lastly, and most importantly for me, is there any way to create Actions with a smart object as your base image? Or do all actions need to be based off of rasterized "Background" layers?

Please help! So confused,
Randy

RandMan wrote in post #14921784
When you are forced to rasterize the smart object in order to do certain adjustments that they do not accomodate, can you rasterize the smart object, then do your adjustments, then convert it back into a smart object, and still be able to go back into RAW as mentioned above?

No.

What adjustments are you referring to? And what version PS?
There might be other workarounds…

RandMan wrote in post #14921784
What if you open a file into Photoshop as a standard "Background" layer (not smart object) and then add a bunch of layers and adjustments; can you at that point convert to a smart object and get back into RAW from it?

No. You then get a SO that contains all those (adjustment)layers. If you double click on it, PS will open the SO as a .psb document that contains all those (adjustment)layers.

RandMan wrote in post #14921784
And lastly, and most importantly for me, is there any way to create Actions with a smart object as your base image?

Sure, why not? Depends on what you want the action to do I'd say.

Some links about SO's:
http://www.creativepro​.com …smart-about-smart-objects
http://xeler8r.com …scs2/s_objects/​index.html
http://simplephotoshop​.com …smart-object-via-copy.htm
http://www.graphics.co​m …&op=viewarticle​&artid=739

A note here:

Smart Objects can work with Adjustment Layers and Smart Filters and so keep their Raw data intact -- in other words you can open the Raw in PS as a Smart Object and add an Adjustment Layer and/or a Smart Filter, tweak those, then double-clck the Smart Object icon and Camera Raw will open with the Raw data, with the original Raw adjustments intact. That's the power of the non-destructive editing with Smart Objects.

But if you change the Smart Object to a "regular" image format and do adjustments directly to it, then, well, once you apply those adjustments then you are no longer able to go back to processing the Raw data (unless you Undo without saving the new file/image or go back in the History).

One thing I find really frustrating is I haven't found a way to apply smart filters to a cropped smart object - if you crop it, then go to "lens correction" and add a vignette it only applies the vignette to the edges of the uncropped object.

jack880 wrote in post #14927697
One thing I find really frustrating is I haven't found a way to apply smart filters to a cropped smart object - if you crop it, then go to "lens correction" and add a vignette it only applies the vignette to the edges of the uncropped object.

OK, I don't have CS6, Lightroom 4 lets you apply vignetting after cropping and I assume the same applies to Camera Raw...?

As to cropping a Smart Object in the Photoshop editor and then applying vignetting, don't know, haven't played with it!

René Damkot wrote in post #14925557
No.

What adjustments are you referring to? And what version PS?
There might be other workarounds…


No. You then get a SO that contains all those (adjustment)layers. If you double click on it, PS will open the SO as a .psb document that contains all those (adjustment)layers.


Sure, why not? Depends on what you want the action to do I'd say.

As far as adjustments go, I can't name exact ones off the top of my head, but it's those certain tools and functions that can only work on rasterized layers--they kind of hit me surprise when I go to use them and realize I can't (from what I've read about SO's I'm guessing it's anything that affects actual pixels). I'm using Photoshop CS5.

As for the Actions: Let's say I have a SO open in Photoshop. For example--I'll hit record for a new action, then maybe add a channel mixer adjustment layer for a b&w conversion, then clip a Curves adjustment layer above that, then duplicate the base image (the Smart Object) and do a High Pass/Overlay blend mode for sharpening. Then I'll hit stop.
If I play the action back on a different image, I get a series of error dialogues interuppting the action and saying that certain layers and images cannot be found.

Actions record Layer names when you click a layer. So if you Click "Layer 1 copy", the action will only play back on an image that contains a "Layer 1 copy".

To avoid that, use shortcuts Alt[and Alt] for "previous" and "next" layer, or Alt, and Alt. for "bottom" or "top" layer.

I think it should work then.

If you must use a filter that won't work on a SO, then do a Shift Cmd Opt E (merge all layers into a new layer), then run the filter.

René Damkot wrote in post #14930307
Actions record Layer names when you click a layer. So if you Click "Layer 1 copy", the action will only play back on an image that contains a "Layer 1 copy".

To avoid that, use shortcuts Alt[and Alt] for "previous" and "next" layer, or Alt, and Alt. for "bottom" or "top" layer.

I think it should work then.

If you must use a filter that won't work on a SO, then do a Shift Cmd Opt E (merge all layers into a new layer), then run the filter.

Aaahh, ok. Now I understand the first part about the layer names, and the last part about merging into a new layer, but can you elaborate on the "Alt" part in the middle? I understand what you're getting at and the reason behind it, but it's not a command or shortcut that I've used. Does it mean holding down Alt while clicking on a layer? That's the only confusing part to me.

Thank you for the help!

No mouse involved: Press Alt and the key, so Alt+[, Alt+] (square brackets), Alt+, (comma) or Alt+. (period)
Side note: Cmd+] and Cmd+[will move a layer up or down, Cmd+Shift+] or [will move a layer top to or bottom.

René Damkot wrote in post #14934293
No mouse involved: Press Alt and the key, so Alt+[, Alt+] (square brackets), Alt+, (comma) or Alt+. (period)
Side note: Cmd+] and Cmd+[will move a layer up or down, Cmd+Shift+] or [will move a layer top to or bottom.

Oh, I see--I'd never heard of those shortcuts. So just to make sure I'm clear:

Alt [Move down one layer (to select it)
Alt] Move up one layer (to select it)
Alt , Jump to bottom layer (to select it)
Alt . Jump to top layer (to select it)
Cmd [Switch currently selected layer with the one directly above
Cmd] Switch currently selected layer with the one directly below
Cmd Shift [Move currently selected layer to top of layer stack
Cmd Shift] Move currently selected layer to bottom of layer stack


Yeah?

Yep.

Just saw this from Dr Russell Brown and it looks interesting. Click Dr Brown's Scripts then go down to the Edit Layers in ACR 1.1.6 panel.

René Damkot wrote in post #14946142
Yep.

So I created an action this morning to set up an edge mask for sharpening. Copied image into a new channel, ran the find edges filter, blur, levels etc. Within the action I utilized the "Alt ." keystroke to select the top layer in the stack before creating a new layer that would be a merged copy of everything below it.

When I ran the action on a different image to test it, the action interrupted at that stage with an error box that said that the top layer was not found. I clicked continue and the action finished out, but it did not do anything at all.

Can you diagnose the diagnosis?

I guess the "copy to a channel" doesn't work (or works differently?) with a SO.
Try using "Apply image", or add a step: ShiftOptCmdE (ShiftAltCtrlE) to merge everything to a new layer (name it!) and delete that merged layer after you've used it to do what you want to do.

See this thread: https://photography-on-the.net …97&highlight=re​ally+smart