The buyers of 24-70 II

TheLensGuy wrote in post #14995040
Don't mean to ruin the mood, just interesting to observe nobody has brought this up yet.

I think this is exactly what you intended to do. Talk about a wet blanket. Do you tell kids there's no Santa Claus and Easter Bunny too?

So you would never buy a new car ? , if you waited 9 months before buying a new model there would be a newer updated model just around the corner.

It'd be fitting if the OP waited 9 months to buy the new 24-70, then when he did finally go ahead and buy one, ended up getting one that had sat on the shelf for 8 or 9 months. Could easily happen.

TheLensGuy wrote in post #14995881
It has got nothing to do with me not having the funds for it, I will buy the lens sometime next year, when it settles and Canon finishes the first production runs. It's about common sense, and it's about not getting carried away. The lenses are obviously not defective and that's not what I said anywhere. What I'm saying is, it's very likely (in fact we should just say it is a fact) that every single lens that was produced in the first 6 months of this year had to be opened up, fixed, and put back in together. This is why this lens was delayed 9 months (not 9 days or 9 weeks), and as you know this wasn't 1 delay, it was 4 delays as far as I can remember. When I'm buying something serious, say a BMW, a 60" Samsung TV, 5D Mark III, anything, I don't go and buy it before it's released by pre-ordering it, I wait 6-9 months so that first a few batches of "problematic" products are out of the way. I want my product to be fresh, clean, and perfect. I don't want something that was touched and "had to be fixed" in any way.

We are photographers no? Photography itself is a profession (or hobby) that requires "perfection". Clearly not everyone is wired up that way and some people like "carpe diem" and they just don't think twice before doing something.

I was trying to help others by trying to get them to open their eyes, that's all.

Okay, so let me get this straight. It seems to me that you're trying to connect two unrelated things. You're concerned that (1) early production copies of this lens use components that have already been tested and have been hand assembled, and (2) early production models are prone to being recalled if there is a problem with them

well (1) you realize all L lenses have their individual components QC scrutinized, and are fully hand assembled right...? if that is your definition of a copy that is not "clean", im sorry to disappoint you, but waiting 6-9 months is not going to make a difference.

and (2), yes, recalls happen, and when they do, early production models are usually the ones affected. point taken. but contrary to what you seem to be implying, most people on this forum (and in general) have brains, and have common sense, and do think twice before making a purchase...and already realize this. recalls are neither canon specific, nor camera specific, and trying to avoid them is frankly pointless, as 99% of the time, you get your item back, in better condition than when you sent it, for free. if you feel that knowing this warrants you a superior level of "common sense" than anyone else....then realize why people think your thread is pointless.

Stone 13 wrote in post #14995131
you certainly seem to "know" quite a bit about Canon's manufacturing process.

...and have developed quite a paranoia about it .

Sorry, I don't mean to flame you, but it's hard to not to.

What you are saying applies to a NORMAL lens release, this is a lens that was delayed 4 times, its bugs and issues were widely known and reported all over the web (please check canon rumors for beta testers under NDA mentioning all these issues). The fact of the matter is, people pre-ordering this lens did not pre-order a regular lens, they pre-ordered a lens that had bugs, known bugs, was fixed by Canon in production line, which meant a manual process by humans. Do you still not see the difference?

I cannot believe how people can be so ignorant. It's easy not to see truth when you choose not to. Believe what you want and ignore everything else.

brennanyama wrote in post #14996598
Okay, so let me get this straight. It seems to me that you're trying to connect two unrelated things. You're concerned that (1) early production copies of this lens use components that have already been tested and have been hand assembled, and (2) early production models are prone to being recalled if there is a problem with them

well (1) you realize all L lenses have their individual components QC scrutinized, and are fully hand assembled right...? if that is your definition of a copy that is not "clean", im sorry to disappoint you, but waiting 6-9 months is not going to make a difference.

and (2), yes, recalls happen, and when they do, early production models are usually the ones affected. point taken. but contrary to what you seem to be implying, most people on this forum (and in general) have brains, and have common sense, and do think twice before making a purchase...and already realize this. recalls are neither canon specific, nor camera specific, and trying to avoid them is frankly pointless, as 99% of the time, you get your item back, in better condition than when you sent it, for free. if you feel that knowing this warrants you a superior level of "common sense" than anyone else....then realize why people think your thread is pointless.

It's funny...I'm finding a trend with the 24-70 II threads.

It's the lens that everyone wants, but also the lens that people who are not getting it try to shoot down by trying to convince others that:
1) It's not worth it
2) The old version is better for whatever reason...ala old one is metal
3) Sharpness doesn't matter after a certain point and therefore buying a lens for this much is stupid
4) Other lenses like the 24-105L are sharper
and now
5) The first batch are all going to come with problems/mistakes/erro​rs/tampered/etc.



Whatever makes you guys sleep better at night.

Also, as an answer to this thread directly...I'd rather a human fix it and verify the lens works as it should. For reference, I just got my Sigma 50mm back from calibration. Thing is now sharp as hell. Now compare that to the thousands of people that get a bum copy straight off the assembly line.

Plus the fact that Lens Rentals got 5 copies of the 24-70 II with little variability between them...all 5 copies were tack sharp. The one they took apart verified everything being above par in both construction and design. There was not anything that was "bandaided." So I'm not seeing where any of your assumptions have validation.

TheLensGuy wrote in post #14997166
I cannot believe how people can be so ignorant. It's easy not to see truth when you choose not to. Believe what you want and ignore everything else.

Okay now you're just being inflammatory for no good reason at all. You're entitled to your opinion on this lens, but I think you need to cool down a bit.

You don't have to buy this lens but you have no right to insult the people who disagree with you which seems to be the majority in this thread.

Perhaps you should rethink your post or you just might find yourself banned.

Cheers....

TheLensGuy wrote in post #14997166
. . . fixed by Canon in production line, which meant a manual process by humans.

You seem to think that there is some problem with humans touching / handling / fixing lenses. A human going over a lens by hand and correcting any faults is a good thing - a very good thing.

You certainly don't think that they have machines that can do all of the QC evaluations, and make all of the necessary corrections, do you? These things are done by hand. A human doing hands on QC is what makes an L lens a superior product. It is one of the steps that are necessary in order for the lens to reach a state of perfection or near perfection.

Many things are done much better when they are done by hand. When I buy a lens, any lens, I certainly hope that a human Canon employee has gone over it, by hand, and made adjustments, fixes, and corrections. That is what makes a lens top notch!

Lens Guy, why are you talking down to everyone here when you absolutely don't know what you're talking about. We're all aware of buying the first line of a product and it's concerns, so I guess thanks for giving us elementary school logic . There's no doubt in my mind that you can't afford this lens or that you're "justifying" your one year delayed purchase by taking your time to create a thread that doesn't even concern you because you don't own the lens. Thanks for your worthless input and waste of my time. Apparently Lens Rentals (5) lenses tested weren't consistent and sharper than primes and the legendary 70-200. Why should we trust THEIR complete breakdown of the lens and how impressed they were on the build quality. Lately, I think you should be aware that the lens is not going to change in the slightest bit (your lens next year will be identically the same). If for any reason there was an issue with the first wave then Canon would take care of us. So go snivel somewhere else and quit trying to ruin peoples excitement about this lens that we're all looked forward to.

TheLensGuy wrote in post #14995040
they most likely fixed them (hence the delay)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't lenses which were fixed by canon themselves and re-calibrated being considered better because the manufacturer made sure you get a perfect lens?

I would actually be surprised if you don't give a second though to buy a less than 1000$ lens, knowingly that the manufacturer isn't putting as much effort to make sure you get a perfect lens.

Besides, there is the warranty you get when buying a new lens.

lucasmcd wrote in post #14996551
So you would never buy a new car ? , if you waited 9 months before buying a new model there would be a newer updated model just around the corner.

That kind of reasoning has never ever bothered me. If I want a certain product, the fact that there is a different product "around the corner" is unimportant, I've decided what I want. I've never been someone who wants the newest, I'd rather have what fits my needs.

I was very undecided about the 24-70L mk2 until the Canon Rumours review. I'd prefer to see a more authorative in-depth test, but as we have yet to be offered any I'm comfortable with the sharpness reports we have been given.

Stone 13 wrote in post #14995131
you certainly seem to "know" quite a bit about Canon's manufacturing process.

I think it is better known as BS.

TheLensGuy wrote in post #14995881
It has got nothing to do with me not having the funds for it, I will buy the lens sometime next year, when it settles and Canon finishes the first production runs. It's about common sense, and it's about not getting carried away. The lenses are obviously not defective and that's not what I said anywhere. What I'm saying is, it's very likely (in fact we should just say it is a fact) that every single lens that was produced in the first 6 months of this year had to be opened up, fixed, and put back in together. This is why this lens was delayed 9 months (not 9 days or 9 weeks), and as you know this wasn't 1 delay, it was 4 delays as far as I can remember. When I'm buying something serious, say a BMW, a 60" Samsung TV, 5D Mark III, anything, I don't go and buy it before it's released by pre-ordering it, I wait 6-9 months so that first a few batches of "problematic" products are out of the way. I want my product to be fresh, clean, and perfect. I don't want something that was touched and "had to be fixed" in any way.

We are photographers no? Photography itself is a profession (or hobby) that requires "perfection". Clearly not everyone is wired up that way and some people like "carpe diem" and they just don't think twice before doing something.

I was trying to help others by trying to get them to open their eyes, that's all.

Did you ever think in those 6 to 9 months that you are waiting, many others are making buckets of money shooting weddings with this lens, maybe using their new 5d3 as well. Sometimes a lens pays for itself in the first couple of jobs. Why would anyone want to wait? If you get a bad lens, send it back...what is your point?

TheLensGuy wrote in post #14997166
Sorry, I don't mean to flame you, but it's hard to not to.

What you are saying applies to a NORMAL lens release, this is a lens that was delayed 4 times, its bugs and issues were widely known and reported all over the web (please check canon rumors for beta testers under NDA mentioning all these issues). The fact of the matter is, people pre-ordering this lens did not pre-order a regular lens, they pre-ordered a lens that had bugs, known bugs, was fixed by Canon in production line, which meant a manual process by humans. Do you still not see the difference?

I cannot believe how people can be so ignorant. It's easy not to see truth when you choose not to. Believe what you want and ignore everything else.

Are you telling us that every single lens in early production is defective one way or another? I would assume that by the camera manufacturers produce ten of thousands in the first batch they already tested the lens over and over. It is not like an airplane manufacturers where they produce a few at a time and work out the kinks along the way.