Canon EOS 6D - why no builtin flash?

Earwax69 wrote in post #15017227
--ok, I dont use that feature anyway, but it's kinda limitating as a serious camera...--

Here is another way I thought about looking at this. There are three different ways Canon has to trigger OCF. If you compare each method and relate them to different levels of standard zooms it would look something like this:

1. Pop up flash triggering - 18-55IS
2. IR master ie 550ex, 580ex, ST-E2 - 17-55/2.8
3. RF master ie 600ex, ST-E3 - 24-70/2.8 II

The 18-55IS will produce great images, but if you are ready to step up your photography to the full frame level of a 6D, would you, if it were FF campatible that is, still use that 18-55? Maybe at the 6D level, it's time to step up the OCF triggering to the next level too.

Neilyb wrote in post #15008460
I guess Canon ran out of space cramming in the silly stuff like GPs and WiFi.

"Silly stuff"...really?
A couple years ago people said the same things about wi-fi in smartphones, or LCD TV's having horrible images compared to CRT, or having video in "pro" cameras, or even using DIGITAL cameras over film, or better yet, believing the Earth was flat(yea, really stretching this analogy, if you couldnt tell..lol)...seriously though...come on man..really???

If being able to REMOTELY control your ENTIRE camera from your smartphone/etc is "silly", then consider ME 'silly'..
not only can you control it, you can use your tablet or smartphone as the monitor for your LiveView capture...pretty incredible IMHO..especially for guys that do video or a lot of tethered shooting..
But pretty sure this will spread like wildfire, so either join the 21st century, or continue using film and maps showing the "edges of the Earth"...

CRAP..I went WAAAAAY OT
Why no flash? BECAUSE NONE OF THE OTHER Full Frame models have it..why start now? even with a "beginner" full frame I still dont see the issue here.
Have I used on camera flash to trigger OCFs, yea...but I am not going to cry over it...and sure never missed it on any bodies that dont have it..

elrey2375 wrote in post #15016708
If you think Canon cares about the discrimination level of their buyer, you are being naive. They're discriminating all right, anyone who has $2K can buy one, that's where the discrimination ends. The bottom line is ALL that matters.

What a farcical statement, of course companies care about their bottom line. Name one (well run, profitable) company that doesn't.

That's the principle reason for matching the product to the intended market segment. Give the buyer what he wants: sale, don't put in things he doesn't need / won't use: savings.

Unregistered.Coward wrote in post #15018018
What a farcical statement, of course companies care about their bottom line. Name one (well run, profitable) company that doesn't.

That's the principle reason for matching the product to the intended market segment. Give the buyer what he wants: sale, don't put in things he doesn't need / won't use: savings.

Not "doesnt need/wont use" but "leave out everything you can get away with". They know people would like a flash, but they figure they can still get enough sales just with the sensor. Im sure theyve done the math on it though.

BMW gets away with crappy leather/leatherette. Their customers would love better leather, but they would rather take the other BMW feature and name, and overlook the omissions.. all for a steep price. So BMW holds back on the leather quality to save cash, and charges a lot for the upgrade.

Canon knows people want the built in, but they will still pay for a camera without it, and then canon can sell speedlites at an even bigger profit margin. Im not saying its wrong, its business, but they arent stripping down models to do us a favor.

HyperCams wrote in post #15017769
"Silly stuff"...really?
A couple years ago people said the same things about wi-fi in smartphones, or LCD TV's having horrible images compared to CRT, or having video in "pro" cameras, or even using DIGITAL cameras over film, or better yet, believing the Earth was flat(yea, really stretching this analogy, if you couldnt tell..lol)...seriously though...come on man..really???

If being able to REMOTELY control your ENTIRE camera from your smartphone/etc is "silly", then consider ME 'silly'..
not only can you control it, you can use your tablet or smartphone as the monitor for your LiveView capture...pretty incredible IMHO..especially for guys that do video or a lot of tethered shooting..
But pretty sure this will spread like wildfire, so either join the 21st century, or continue using film and maps showing the "edges of the Earth"...

CRAP..I went WAAAAAY OT
Why no flash? BECAUSE NONE OF THE OTHER Full Frame models have it..why start now? even with a "beginner" full frame I still dont see the issue here.
Have I used on camera flash to trigger OCFs, yea...but I am not going to cry over it...and sure never missed it on any bodies that dont have it..

I do not have a smart phone, so yeh silly stuff. You like it, buy it. I don't I won't. I am out.

guitarman1024 wrote in post #15007881
Hello all,

I was just wondering if anyone have any idea why the newly announced 6d does not have built in flash?

I can kind of understand why higher models does not have it, because professional photographers will probably never use it.
But 6d is designed for photo entusiasts and they will most certainly use it sometimes?

Same as no FF have tilt-screens.. too amaturish (to the pro's).
I would have bought the 7D if it had a tilt-screen.

jthomps123 wrote in post #15009924
Honestly i'd rather have the memory than a photo this bad. No offense as the conditions were just too poor for the equipment at hand...

Wrong on soo many levels.

I wish NO camera of any sort had a pop up flash, or at least one that could only be opened manually after three or more warnings.

Okay, this is mostly tongue in cheek, but I get really tired of idiots with P&S cameras taking flash pictures in places like aquariums and museums where there are "NO FLASH ALLOWED" signs all over the place. It can ruin everyone else's photos, and cause damage to displays. Then again, I guess you can't blame the camera if the user doesn't have a brain.

To get back on the subject at hand, I very rarely used the pop up flash on my 40D or my 7D, and I surely don't miss it on my 5D Mk III.

I don't think anyone has mentioned this, but as someone who used to have a 7D and (large) 17-55, the lens and hood actually block the flash at wider focal lengths.

Unless they come out with a new smaller kit lense than the 24-105 I expect the same would happen, then lots of complaints

what would have been cool is they had added the flash controller software to the camera and allow it to work with a basic 270EX II

onboard flash can come in handy, this was a holiday snap taken in a dark bar with a panasonic GX1 which can lock the popup in a vertical position, I had camera in one hand, and a white table menu in the other to reflect flash
f/1.8 1/60s 90mm iso800

Neilyb wrote in post #15018164
I do not have a smart phone, so yeh silly stuff. You like it, buy it. I don't I won't. I am out.

So what you are telling me is....you still think the earth is flat? LOL

HyperCams wrote in post #15019171
So what you are telling me is....you still think the earth is flat? LOL

Steve Fossett should be rolling in his grave right now...

Built-in GPS + WiFi > built in flash. The last time I've used a built-in flash is when I accidentally had the mode dial on the greenbox on my friend's 60D.

I like all the conspiracy theory about Canon "forcing" you to buy an external flash. Is canon also forcing you to buy L lenses because they purposely make them better? LoL, okay.

Lets not forget, no pop up flash = less nooks and crannies where water and dust can get into.

This would definitely be a great second or backup camera to my 5D3 and a dedicated wedding photobooth workhorse with the built in wifi. Cant wait to try it out

There seems to be a lot of snobbery against a pop-up flash.

The bottom line is that no, it's not as good as an off camera flash, but it is better than nothing, and when it can be used to control off camera flashes it is a LOT better than nothing.

This video makes me start thinking a little more about this 6D


http://youtu.be/Vwqo91​NsIZI?hd=1

Ooooh... Ahhhhh.. 6D.. Entry level full frame.. Every oohs and ahhhs about it- thinks - entry level full frame.... $2100... I laugh when someone thinks that someone can come in- slap down $2100, and voilà, full frame camera setup.. Ooops... cheap lens to replace that 18-55 - 24-105L- still about another $900 or so.. Add in a flash because there is no pop up- another $250 .. Dang- that full frame ain't that cheap any more- eh ? What's that so far- with a single lens & flash- roughly $3300.. Ooops.. Maybe full frame is not that cheap any more. People - get real.. $2100 is not a cheap camera- it's the same cost and nearly the same feature set and limitations of the 5D2 that it replaces. And full frame was never cheap to begin with.. What's next- petition Canon for cheap "L"'s ? How about asking Canon to designate all of their EF lenses as being "L" class- including their cheapest lenses out there- like the 50mm f/1.8- because- it should be considered an L.


As far as pop up flash.. After I got an external flash I really never use the pop up anymore- - well -till the 7D came along. See, the best use for a pop-up flash- if you have one- is to trigger an off camera flash or two.